Carbon neutral and CO2 emissions, etc

ucbalumnus
Thu, 09 Sep 2021 23:26:15 +0000

coolguy40:

Battery power produces zero emissions in cars, etc, but the battery manufacturing itself creates more pollution than the gas cars they’re replacing. Solar and wind work fine in desert and warm regions, but they don’t work in snow and ice. Hydroelectric is great, but not every region has access to large rivers. Geothermal is great, but most of us don’t live in volcanic regions.

Petroleum-based liquid fuels are convenient, especially in transportation contexts, but mining petroleum is messy, and petroleum requires imports that increase the trade deficit and lead to entanglements in foreign policy problems. Natural gas may be great for many uses, but leaks are a big problem, and mining it with fracking consumes water and can pollute ground water. Coal is a traditional energy source, but mining it has various problems, including health problems and hazards for the miners as well as unquenchable coal mine fires, and puts up fly ash pollution (including more radioactive materials than nuclear power plants’ waste).

bennty:

Frankly, I’d prefer it if the utilities would work with the feds to organize this better.

Utilities look at it from a finance aspect. In the windy plains areas of the US, utilities are putting up wind turbines because collecting the free “fuel” (wind) is now cheaper for them than shoveling coal or piping natural gas, despite the cost of the wind turbines themselves.

bennty:

Genuine curiosity, not JAQing: do you have a citation for that claim about battery manufacturing and cars?

Electric vehicles have higher costs at manufacturing and disposal / recycling at the end, but lower costs during use (much like nuclear power plants). In general, the lifetime costs are lower for electric vehicles, but it depends on the comparison liquid fuel vehicle and the source of electricity that the electric vehicle is charged from. Cleaner Cars from Cradle to Grave | Union of Concerned Scientists has a map showing how electric vehicles compare based on the electricity grid in various parts of the US.