northwestyRegistered UserPosts: 3,414Senior Member
edited May 15
"The quote was roughly “coaches are the highest paid employees at many universities”.
Banker -- I'm not sure what point you are trying to make. Since nothing in this discussion relates to what the Nick Sabans and John Caliparis get paid. But your statement is so misleading as to be inaccurate.
The accurate statement would be that "the men's basketball head coach and the football head coach are the highest paid employees at many D1 universities."
That is pretty much never true for any other coaches of any other sports at any colleges.
Plenty of other university employees make more than the coaches in non-revenue sports -- the university prez, COO, CFO, GC will all make much more than the typical college coach. So does the law school faculty. So does the B-school faculty. So does the med school faculty.
The relevant point for this discussion is that the non-revenue coaches do not get paid a lot. But they do get admissions tips. Hence the temptation to sell those tips for cash which goes to the sports program or to the coach's pocket.
Upthread, a few posts:
No, Felicity Huffman should not avoid jail "just because" she is a rich white person. Neither should she be punished for being (1) a rich white person; (2) a celebrity.
There is an excessive amount of Schadenfreude in our culture, but particularly toward celebrities, who sometimes receive more than their share of gleeful hand-rubbing when they do get caught. We can argue and agree that too few rich people, white people, and celebrities even get caught and brought to justice for crimes. However, that does not justify scapegoating those who do get caught. That's a disordered and "generalized" kind of "justice," not much more dignified than physical vigilante justice, which actually operates from a similar principle when you think about it.
I was commenting to the thread direction at the time, discussing the idea of direct donations to fund athletics.
Some see as a bad idea. Ok. I’m open to it
Let the supporters of the sports help fund it directly and not take away money from the core mission.
And yes at many schools. Dozens and dozens. The highest paid person on staff if a coach or two.
Yes, not every sport. And not every school.
What could possibly be misleading about saying “at many” are the highest paid. It’s a fact. And certainly wouldn’t say all and everywhere. That would be misleading.
Oh FYI. Here’s an article from your school newspaper from a few years ago.
“Northwestern head football coach Pat Fitzgerald made $2.48 million in 2013, according to Northwestern's 2013 tax return, which was released Tuesday. The document shows salaries for Northwestern's top earning faculty and staff.”
Plus 2.7mm in loans. Total $5mm+. School president that year made 1.3mm.
Another local school DePaul paid its basketball coach 2.3mm and the chancellor made 900k.
That’s just two schools I checked for fun in Chicagoland.
twoinanddoneRegistered UserPosts: 21,504Senior Member
I don't think any other person who paid someone to cheat on a test, who falsified a resume, who signed a false applcation would go to jail. White, black or green, I don't think our prisons are filled with cheaters of this type. Food stamp fraud for thousands, medicare fraud by a doctor over a period of years? Yes, but not one time cheaters.
The parent defendants weren't plotting to overtake the education system of the US, they were trying to get one or two kids into college. Singer and the ADs and the test taker were the masterminds, committing the same acts over and over. The parents bought stolen goods, signed a false form, took a deduction on their taxes that will be disallowed.
"A Georgetown University undergraduate student whose dad has already pleaded guilty to paying $400,000 to the ringleader of a nationwide college admissions bribery scheme is now suing the school to try to stop disciplinary action from the university.
But shortly after the student, Adam Semprevivo, filed suit Wednesday, Georgetown informed him and another student of its intent to dismiss them from the university."
The other student may be Isabelle Henriquez, the one who allegedly gloated over getting away with cheating.
Other interesting info from the article:
--his GPA and SAT were apparently within Georgetown's standards. He maintained at 3.18 GPA at Gtown.
--He is alleging the school did not follow at least 10 of its own honor code regulations in its investigation
--he is alleging in the lawsuit that Georgetown knew something was up with Coach Ernst 2 years ago and of Semprevivo's connection to Ernst but that they
"(1) continued to knowingly accept tuition payments for Semprevivo, (2) allowed Semprevivo to take and complete courses, and (3) allowed Semprevivo to earn credits for completed courses."
@momo2x2018 and I must have posted at the same time! And to be clear, Georgetown is not just expelling, they are rescinding the initial acceptance so all credits earned are wiped out.
Just read another article on this at The Daily Beast:
"The lawsuit accuses Georgetown of not even bothering to read his admissions application. “If you look at Adam’s high school transcripts, his letters of recommendation, and his resume it’s clear that his sport choice was basketball. He was even on the basketball team,” Kenner said. “So the school either didn’t read his application or didn’t care to read his application.”
Wondered if Georgetown was going to take action to dismiss students. The female student (possibly) dismissed also has a sister involved in the scandal at Northwestern.
The lawsuit seems a bit much, then again I can't imagine what the kids have been through...even if some were 100% involved.
Adam Semprevivo is claiming he knew nothing about the tennis fakery, but also seems to admit one of the reasons he didn't know is because Singer filled out and signed his application for him. There is also an email about playing tennis allegedly written by Semprevivo.
Adam Semprevivo is claiming he knew nothing about the tennis fakery, but also seems to admit one of the reasons he didn't know is because Singer filled out and signed his application for him.
Can someone explain to me how that could be true? Wouldn’t the applicant need to write his/her essay using the same portal? That couldn’t have been allowed to be done by Singer. Isn’t the applicant required to review it even if it’s done by a consultant?
There are many cases where the parents' mistakes can cost the kids. One easy one: they don't pay the college bills. Not sure I buy in to the idea of "innocent by disassociation." The kids may not have been actve accomplices, but find themselves in a tough position.
Earlier, some said the parents didn't trust the kids' abilities, what colleges they could've gotten into without cheating. I think I'd reframe that as: didn't stop to consider the potential costs to their kids. Now, they reap.
Technically, Adam's case is being presented by his presumably pricy attorneys. They can claim what they want, but it does not mean it will hold water.
And in law, you can try, as defense, "Well, they weren't plotting something worse." But they are charged with what they did do. And if found guilty, will have consequences.
I think Huffman will see time in jail. BUT, how much more that 8 hours, I don't know. They'll protect her, call it "holding," not send her to a maximum security prison. That's my guess.
Now, I do wish some could find links from credible law journals or sites- not common media, UAToday, Daily Beast. What's next, TMZ?
And if USA Today and Daily Beast aren't credible, there was also a link to the LA Times. In perusing the net I also found articles from the Washington Post, NYT, WSJ, CBS, Reuters, and CNN, all with varying amounts of detail.
Replies to: Feds uncover admissions test cheating plot
Banker -- I'm not sure what point you are trying to make. Since nothing in this discussion relates to what the Nick Sabans and John Caliparis get paid. But your statement is so misleading as to be inaccurate.
The accurate statement would be that "the men's basketball head coach and the football head coach are the highest paid employees at many D1 universities."
That is pretty much never true for any other coaches of any other sports at any colleges.
Plenty of other university employees make more than the coaches in non-revenue sports -- the university prez, COO, CFO, GC will all make much more than the typical college coach. So does the law school faculty. So does the B-school faculty. So does the med school faculty.
The relevant point for this discussion is that the non-revenue coaches do not get paid a lot. But they do get admissions tips. Hence the temptation to sell those tips for cash which goes to the sports program or to the coach's pocket.
No, Felicity Huffman should not avoid jail "just because" she is a rich white person. Neither should she be punished for being (1) a rich white person; (2) a celebrity.
There is an excessive amount of Schadenfreude in our culture, but particularly toward celebrities, who sometimes receive more than their share of gleeful hand-rubbing when they do get caught. We can argue and agree that too few rich people, white people, and celebrities even get caught and brought to justice for crimes. However, that does not justify scapegoating those who do get caught. That's a disordered and "generalized" kind of "justice," not much more dignified than physical vigilante justice, which actually operates from a similar principle when you think about it.
I was commenting to the thread direction at the time, discussing the idea of direct donations to fund athletics.
Some see as a bad idea. Ok. I’m open to it
Let the supporters of the sports help fund it directly and not take away money from the core mission.
And yes at many schools. Dozens and dozens. The highest paid person on staff if a coach or two.
Yes, not every sport. And not every school.
What could possibly be misleading about saying “at many” are the highest paid. It’s a fact. And certainly wouldn’t say all and everywhere. That would be misleading.
Oh FYI. Here’s an article from your school newspaper from a few years ago.
“Northwestern head football coach Pat Fitzgerald made $2.48 million in 2013, according to Northwestern's 2013 tax return, which was released Tuesday. The document shows salaries for Northwestern's top earning faculty and staff.”
Plus 2.7mm in loans. Total $5mm+. School president that year made 1.3mm.
Another local school DePaul paid its basketball coach 2.3mm and the chancellor made 900k.
That’s just two schools I checked for fun in Chicagoland.
The parent defendants weren't plotting to overtake the education system of the US, they were trying to get one or two kids into college. Singer and the ADs and the test taker were the masterminds, committing the same acts over and over. The parents bought stolen goods, signed a false form, took a deduction on their taxes that will be disallowed.
https://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-georgetown-lawsuit-college-admissions-scandal-20190515-story.html
"A Georgetown University undergraduate student whose dad has already pleaded guilty to paying $400,000 to the ringleader of a nationwide college admissions bribery scheme is now suing the school to try to stop disciplinary action from the university.
But shortly after the student, Adam Semprevivo, filed suit Wednesday, Georgetown informed him and another student of its intent to dismiss them from the university."
The other student may be Isabelle Henriquez, the one who allegedly gloated over getting away with cheating.
Other interesting info from the article:
--his GPA and SAT were apparently within Georgetown's standards. He maintained at 3.18 GPA at Gtown.
--He is alleging the school did not follow at least 10 of its own honor code regulations in its investigation
--he is alleging in the lawsuit that Georgetown knew something was up with Coach Ernst 2 years ago and of Semprevivo's connection to Ernst but that they
"(1) continued to knowingly accept tuition payments for Semprevivo, (2) allowed Semprevivo to take and complete courses, and (3) allowed Semprevivo to earn credits for completed courses."
Just read another article on this at The Daily Beast:
"The lawsuit accuses Georgetown of not even bothering to read his admissions application. “If you look at Adam’s high school transcripts, his letters of recommendation, and his resume it’s clear that his sport choice was basketball. He was even on the basketball team,” Kenner said. “So the school either didn’t read his application or didn’t care to read his application.”
https://www.thedailybeast.com/college-admissions-scandal-georgetown-student-adam-semprevivo-sues-school-after-dad-admits-to-dollar400k-bribe
The lawsuit seems a bit much, then again I can't imagine what the kids have been through...even if some were 100% involved.
We discussed that pages ago. In such cases, eliminating credits fraudulently earned is sop.
Can someone explain to me how that could be true? Wouldn’t the applicant need to write his/her essay using the same portal? That couldn’t have been allowed to be done by Singer. Isn’t the applicant required to review it even if it’s done by a consultant?
Earlier, some said the parents didn't trust the kids' abilities, what colleges they could've gotten into without cheating. I think I'd reframe that as: didn't stop to consider the potential costs to their kids. Now, they reap.
Technically, Adam's case is being presented by his presumably pricy attorneys. They can claim what they want, but it does not mean it will hold water.
And in law, you can try, as defense, "Well, they weren't plotting something worse." But they are charged with what they did do. And if found guilty, will have consequences.
I think Huffman will see time in jail. BUT, how much more that 8 hours, I don't know. They'll protect her, call it "holding," not send her to a maximum security prison. That's my guess.
Now, I do wish some could find links from credible law journals or sites- not common media, UAToday, Daily Beast. What's next, TMZ?
https://dcist.com/story/19/05/15/georgetown-says-it-will-expel-two-students-amid-admissions-scandal/
https://www.law.com/nationallawjournal/2019/05/15/student-sues-georgetown-after-his-dad-is-busted-in-admissions-scandal/
And if USA Today and Daily Beast aren't credible, there was also a link to the LA Times. In perusing the net I also found articles from the Washington Post, NYT, WSJ, CBS, Reuters, and CNN, all with varying amounts of detail.
I could not find anything relevant on TMZ. :-)