UVA, it's not discrimination. It's a cultural scholarship. White people also have them. In my city we have community organizations that give out turkish scholarships, greek, jewish, etc.
What cultural group do black people beling to? Bantu? Gold Coast? Lol.
The scholarships for African Americans aren't racist. They are the same as cultural heritage scholarships.
But you are missing the fundamental point of AA. It is NOT to help low-income URMs. It is to help URM's in general. In all income levels, URMs drop out more, earn less, die earlier, etc. This is a clearly racial issue.
AlexandreRegistered UserPosts: 24,632Senior Member
I don't see what the big fuss is about. A private scholarship can set its own rules as long as it is not oppresive or illegal. If some group should want to provide scholarships to white males (hopefully of limited means), so be it. There are many whites who live in poversty and such a scholarship can only be seen as a positive.
bzva74 - I actually hadn't thought of it that way. But will a black male has a substantially harder time in HS than a white male of the same income bracket? I can't imagine that do to skin color alone; someone is naturally going to have a harder time in school. Heck, the smartest senior in my school last year was African American. Also, there are scholarships for Asians only. I'm not sure if there is a statistic, but Asians are naturally very intelligent. However, there are a plethora of scholarships dedicated to Asians alone. These Asians, or URM's, do not drop out more, earn less, die earlier, or any of the other points you have mentioned.
I still feel that dividing scholarships up by economic background would be much more appropriate. It is just as hard for a white student whose parents make 40k a year to succeed as a AA student. However, one of these students whose parents do make 40k less or year should DEFINITELY not be held to the same standards as a student whose parents make 40k+ a year.
Also, in regards to Irish-Americans, Indian-Americans, etc; what if I am, well, nothing. I have such a low percent of a different race in me that I qualify for NO specialty scholarships. Should I just be left out?
I thought about what you said katliasmom and this is what I came up with. If a school does not want a student because he holds strong opinions (as long as they are not discriminating or hurtful) then I don't want to be there.
Finally, regarding the past, I only have one thing to say - forgive and forget. Yes it was a horrific time and Americans should be ashamed that such a monstrosity occurred. But it is now over.
I'm not trying to stir up any problems guys, but I naturally enjoy arguing. And this is something, well, I'm very opinionated about.
^I have read somewhere that across the board (even into the higher income brackets), blacks, on average, score lower on the SATs than their white counterparts of similar income and same school.
Also, we can not disregard the past yet, when there is still much, much work to be done. It is still not yet even 50 years since Martin Luther King marched on Washington and gave his I Have A Dream speech. We surely have come a long way, but there is still a ways to walk. If the past was truly done with, then graduation rates for the races would be equal. College enrollment rates would be equal. Percentage of each race in each income bracket would be close to equal. The truth is there is still much holding black people down in our country, and there is still much holding poor people down in general in our country. And we can never really move on and say forgive and forget until we reach a time when things really are equal and people have become mostly colorblind.
I myself am a Questbridge Scholarship finalist, and it was the way that I could even afford applying to college. Lately I've seen things and read articles stating that Questbridge's partner colleges practice racist admissions decisions. Apparently, it has become 3 times harder for a white or asian student to earn a full-ride scholarship through questbridge than an URM. Even though all the students who apply through questbridge are poor. So yes, not being an URM, it makes me sad to know this. However, I am happier knowing that those scholarships and college careers are going to poor people who have gone through hardships and deserve them for their selves and their families sake, regardless of race.
As for the original scholarship, if that man really and truly felt that there were no scholarships for, as he said, people who look like him, then I have no problem with what he is doing. And the article does say that white males have become a minority in his state.
I grew up extremely poor. It was (and still is) okay to call poor white people "trash." I was beaten and had my pants pulled off for being "white." Neither I nor any of my ancestors were slave owners, bigots, or haters--as though guilt could be inherited in the DNA or even in the pigment of the epidermis! However, we shall see that midwestern, rural, poor whites (NOT from rich slave families) are the ones that people degrade and accuse of being "rednecks" and "bigots." Well, someone needs to take a look in the mirror!
Frankly, I am tired of people who think whites are bad--especially rural poor whites. That is both racist and classist. It is also deeply ironic since the poor rural whites never had the opportunity to actually oppress anyone. The elite community "doth protest too much!" They are the ones with the power.
My take on the scholarship? Either ALL race/gender based scholarships are good, or NO race/ gender based scholarships are good. Any other choice is pure hypocrisy.
Peace out.
Katliamom, can you please explain why you believe the young man posting this thread will, "give UVA a bad name?" If you can't explain that, then explain how can you justify an ad hominem attack against someone who is a minor? It is my personal experience that people who can engage in reasoned discourse on controversial topics make the very best students and citizens. But that is just my personal opinion.
I would like to address the "male" part of this scholarship.
Females far outnumber males at practically all colleges. Yet there are a huge amount of scholarships available to women, even though they are the majority. Google scholarships for men, you will only get references to this article. Then google scholarships for women, you will have pages of results.
Also, this is not about affirmative action. Giving a $500 scholarship is very different from college acceptance. This discussion has taken a left turn.
I say if you have the funds and want to set up a scholarship fund with distinct parameters, then that is your right.
ShrinkrapRegistered UserPosts: 11,790Senior Member
"can you please explain why you believe the young man posting this thread will, "give UVA a bad name?""
How about because he says says things like
"but Asians are naturally very intelligent"...Just sayin....let's just say it's not PC.
As far as the "tons/plethora" of scholarships for URM's, they are almost all based on income AND minority status.
And as far as " I do not see white people complaining about scholarships restricted to minorities only."....just search "afirmative action" and see if anyone is complaining.
I won't argue it here, but I believe race continues to play a role independant of income when it comes to education.
Personally, I don't think there is much "push back" regarding this scholarship. I bet nobody really cares. I have read this author before, and I don't think his stuff is well reasearched.As mentioned above, there are plenty of non-URM groups that offer scholarships.
Shrinkrap, maybe I phrased that wrong. But Asians do perform better on standardized tests than other races and that is a fact. Maybe it is because they are more driven or maybe it is because they are pushed harder by their families. Whatever the case, it is a fact. If you think Asians are naturally less smart than other races then please explain why. Also, I guess that means other posters on this thread "will give a school a bad name". As nattilee stated "blacks, on average, score lower on the SATs than their white counterparts of similar income and same school." Are you arguing that this can not be true for Asians?
Asian Americans make up 4% of the U.S. population, but represent 20% of the students now attending America's elite Ivy League schools.
HomeschoolMD, thanks for backing me up. I feel like it is immature for someone to make such a harsh, demeaning statement because I hold an opinion. You're talking about the case I'm trying to defend. I feel bad for whites who come from lower income families. Their college scholarship options are vastly limited due to their skin color.
I guess holding an opinion on this site is looked down upon. Because I don't agree with your views doesn't mean you have to be cruel. Remember, when MLK was first outspoken about his OPINION about how AA were treated, many disregarded him. Are you doing the same? HomeschoolMD is the perfect example. He has suffered the same setbacks that an AA of the same income would. However, even though he overcame the situation, he is still restricted from a plethora of scholarships due solely to his skin color.
Hanna, you are right, that was ignorant of me. However, are the whites complaining about the scholarships because of the minority’s skin color, or the concept of the scholarship being limited to one race? The first option is blatant racism and the person should be ashamed of themselves. However, the second option is fueled by a sense of unfairness. Yes, I know life isn't fair. But being restricted from something because of skin color is just unfair. I would actually like someone to find one thing AA or Hispanics are restricted from. And I mean legally not allowed to participate in.
Again guys, I’m just arguing this because it is something that personally ticks me off. To see some of my friends not able to apply for scholarships they greatly need hurts me.
I actually recall a scholarship open to whites around 2005 (maybe?) that was offered by a Hispanic professor who thought the minority-based scholarships were unchallenged racism. I heard about it on the radio (can't find an article about it now). It was news specifically because the man funding it was Hispanic.
I'm not above taking a scholarship for Polish girls. I look for them all the time. I haven't been oppressed at all for being Polish, though. Neither was my mother. But for some reason, Polish people feel like helping other Polish people get through college, whether or not there was hardship. I think that's what's offensive about it. It's not the discrimination, it's the idea that these people only want to help others of their own heritage succeeed, simply because they're of the same heritage.
Yes, but speakingez, what about students from the "white" heritage. I do not have a large enough percent of one race to be considered for a scholarship. However, I am able to apply for this scholarship. Many Hispanic and AAs think that the scholarship is unfair. And I do recall reading about a scholarship for whites released a long time ago. I've done a lot of reading on this subject. I'll try to find an article.
There are thousands of scholarships out there. If you can't find one, you're not looking hard enough.
You dont need to open WHITES ONLY scholarships to let whites pay for college. If the poor white guy isn't smart enough to be awarded a normal corporate or private/public scholarship, he wont be smart enough to get a white's only scholarship. With blacks it's a bit different since they tend to score worse all around.
Replies to: Scholarship For White Males Only
What cultural group do black people beling to? Bantu? Gold Coast? Lol.
The scholarships for African Americans aren't racist. They are the same as cultural heritage scholarships.
But you are missing the fundamental point of AA. It is NOT to help low-income URMs. It is to help URM's in general. In all income levels, URMs drop out more, earn less, die earlier, etc. This is a clearly racial issue.
bzva74 - I actually hadn't thought of it that way. But will a black male has a substantially harder time in HS than a white male of the same income bracket? I can't imagine that do to skin color alone; someone is naturally going to have a harder time in school. Heck, the smartest senior in my school last year was African American. Also, there are scholarships for Asians only. I'm not sure if there is a statistic, but Asians are naturally very intelligent. However, there are a plethora of scholarships dedicated to Asians alone. These Asians, or URM's, do not drop out more, earn less, die earlier, or any of the other points you have mentioned.
I still feel that dividing scholarships up by economic background would be much more appropriate. It is just as hard for a white student whose parents make 40k a year to succeed as a AA student. However, one of these students whose parents do make 40k less or year should DEFINITELY not be held to the same standards as a student whose parents make 40k+ a year.
Also, in regards to Irish-Americans, Indian-Americans, etc; what if I am, well, nothing. I have such a low percent of a different race in me that I qualify for NO specialty scholarships. Should I just be left out?
I thought about what you said katliasmom and this is what I came up with. If a school does not want a student because he holds strong opinions (as long as they are not discriminating or hurtful) then I don't want to be there.
Finally, regarding the past, I only have one thing to say - forgive and forget. Yes it was a horrific time and Americans should be ashamed that such a monstrosity occurred. But it is now over.
I'm not trying to stir up any problems guys, but I naturally enjoy arguing. And this is something, well, I'm very opinionated about.
Also, we can not disregard the past yet, when there is still much, much work to be done. It is still not yet even 50 years since Martin Luther King marched on Washington and gave his I Have A Dream speech. We surely have come a long way, but there is still a ways to walk. If the past was truly done with, then graduation rates for the races would be equal. College enrollment rates would be equal. Percentage of each race in each income bracket would be close to equal. The truth is there is still much holding black people down in our country, and there is still much holding poor people down in general in our country. And we can never really move on and say forgive and forget until we reach a time when things really are equal and people have become mostly colorblind.
I myself am a Questbridge Scholarship finalist, and it was the way that I could even afford applying to college. Lately I've seen things and read articles stating that Questbridge's partner colleges practice racist admissions decisions. Apparently, it has become 3 times harder for a white or asian student to earn a full-ride scholarship through questbridge than an URM. Even though all the students who apply through questbridge are poor. So yes, not being an URM, it makes me sad to know this. However, I am happier knowing that those scholarships and college careers are going to poor people who have gone through hardships and deserve them for their selves and their families sake, regardless of race.
As for the original scholarship, if that man really and truly felt that there were no scholarships for, as he said, people who look like him, then I have no problem with what he is doing. And the article does say that white males have become a minority in his state.
Frankly, I am tired of people who think whites are bad--especially rural poor whites. That is both racist and classist. It is also deeply ironic since the poor rural whites never had the opportunity to actually oppress anyone. The elite community "doth protest too much!" They are the ones with the power.
My take on the scholarship? Either ALL race/gender based scholarships are good, or NO race/ gender based scholarships are good. Any other choice is pure hypocrisy.
Peace out.
Then you aren't looking very hard. There are plenty of those people just on this web site, never mind the rest of the world.
Females far outnumber males at practically all colleges. Yet there are a huge amount of scholarships available to women, even though they are the majority. Google scholarships for men, you will only get references to this article. Then google scholarships for women, you will have pages of results.
Also, this is not about affirmative action. Giving a $500 scholarship is very different from college acceptance. This discussion has taken a left turn.
I say if you have the funds and want to set up a scholarship fund with distinct parameters, then that is your right.
How about because he says says things like
"but Asians are naturally very intelligent"...Just sayin....let's just say it's not PC.
As far as the "tons/plethora" of scholarships for URM's, they are almost all based on income AND minority status.
And as far as " I do not see white people complaining about scholarships restricted to minorities only."....just search "afirmative action" and see if anyone is complaining.
I won't argue it here, but I believe race continues to play a role independant of income when it comes to education.
Personally, I don't think there is much "push back" regarding this scholarship. I bet nobody really cares. I have read this author before, and I don't think his stuff is well reasearched.As mentioned above, there are plenty of non-URM groups that offer scholarships.
HomeschoolMD, thanks for backing me up. I feel like it is immature for someone to make such a harsh, demeaning statement because I hold an opinion. You're talking about the case I'm trying to defend. I feel bad for whites who come from lower income families. Their college scholarship options are vastly limited due to their skin color.
I guess holding an opinion on this site is looked down upon. Because I don't agree with your views doesn't mean you have to be cruel. Remember, when MLK was first outspoken about his OPINION about how AA were treated, many disregarded him. Are you doing the same? HomeschoolMD is the perfect example. He has suffered the same setbacks that an AA of the same income would. However, even though he overcame the situation, he is still restricted from a plethora of scholarships due solely to his skin color.
Hanna, you are right, that was ignorant of me. However, are the whites complaining about the scholarships because of the minority’s skin color, or the concept of the scholarship being limited to one race? The first option is blatant racism and the person should be ashamed of themselves. However, the second option is fueled by a sense of unfairness. Yes, I know life isn't fair. But being restricted from something because of skin color is just unfair. I would actually like someone to find one thing AA or Hispanics are restricted from. And I mean legally not allowed to participate in.
Again guys, I’m just arguing this because it is something that personally ticks me off. To see some of my friends not able to apply for scholarships they greatly need hurts me.
I'm not above taking a scholarship for Polish girls. I look for them all the time. I haven't been oppressed at all for being Polish, though. Neither was my mother. But for some reason, Polish people feel like helping other Polish people get through college, whether or not there was hardship. I think that's what's offensive about it. It's not the discrimination, it's the idea that these people only want to help others of their own heritage succeeed, simply because they're of the same heritage.
You dont need to open WHITES ONLY scholarships to let whites pay for college. If the poor white guy isn't smart enough to be awarded a normal corporate or private/public scholarship, he wont be smart enough to get a white's only scholarship. With blacks it's a bit different since they tend to score worse all around.