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Odds at Goldman--very bad
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Replies to: Odds at Goldman--very bad
This is why I think he is right in saying that not everyone who is interested in banking will be able to do so especially when you are talking about the best positions out there.
And again, regardless of whether you like it or not, bank recruiting is elitist. The guys that select from non-target schools are much more strict than if the pool is from targets. I would read this thread: http://www.ibankingoasis.com/node/2517
It gets worse when you want to break buyside (PE, HF, top prop firms) out of undergrad. They wouldn't have bothered with even seeing the resume in the first place (I have actually seen this happen). So, all those people who happen to want banking but aren't at targets won't get it. That btw includes all those schools that nitpickers identify as semi-targets. So yea, your anecdote about grads going to work at goldman (which btw doesn't mean they are bankers...most people at goldman aren't front office bankers, traders, salesmen or asset managers) isn't the norm.
So yea, it is a completely different level of competition when you want to get these jobs. Just view it this way: on CC, every april there is a boatload of posts about how top students not getting into top 10-15 colleges. Now imagine the guys that made that cut competing against each other. That would be the level of competition you face.
I don't think every student at Ross wants to go in to investment banking and applied to goldman sachs. My point was that invesment banking isn't impossible to break in to. 38.8% of Ross grads go in to the industry (I don't know what percent of the graduating class tried) and it's not even an ubertarget like Harvard or Wharton.
Unless all these business schools are liing it doesn't appear that difficult at all. I'm looking at a brochure right now. Top 20 MBA program, 10% of all graduates going into Investment Banking. Only 40% of all graduates are going into finance at all.
At this school, 10% go into IB, but only 40% go into finance at all. So a 25% rate is probably more accurate but you have to consider that many of those in finance probably don't want to go IB simply due to the long hours etc.
Talking to students from another school (actually, not even a top 50 MBA program) they told me that many of their fellow students wanted to go IB when they started their MBA but by the time they've really learned more about IB most change their mind (BTW, that school also sends people into IB despite not being a top 50 program).
I'm sure it is quite difficult to get into IB from undergrad. However, if you really desire to be IB then you can always fall back on an MBA and have what appears to be a very good chance at going IB. (especially if u come from a finance background which should give you an edge once in business school).
First of all, it's according to how many people responded to the career survey, so everything is self-reported material. Of course we can assume that a good number out of the 350 graduates did the survey, and most probably answered as accurately as possible. But still, the 40% is not 40% of students but rather 40% of respondents.
Second of all (and more importantly), many jobs can be classified as "investment banking" that actually aren't traditionally IB. And it can be anywhere in the world. Just look through the Ross job database (search by "finance-investment banking") or postings on Vault or **** for "investment banking" and you'll know what I mean. You'll see a list of random firms/positions. The real % we need to know is % going into a BB (or top boutique) in NYC as an IB analyst, eliminating firms and positions (and probably even locations) that don't traditionally count.
I know a Ross student who graduated in 2004. He went to GS. He said only one other person that year became an analyst in IB in NYC. The rest were non-IB positions and/or not in NYC. I'll try to get more details on that, but that's what he said.