<p>Remember though, that a “traditional” liberal arts education in, as you said, “literature, composition, sciences, economics, math, American govt and history, and foreign language” can indeed be found at Wesleyan. Wes offers all of these courses, and is quite strong in many of those areas. The schools just doesn’t force its students to study all of these fields. However, many, if not most, do anyway. I, for one, have hit every single category you mentioned except foreign language, and didn’t take any feminism or queer theory courses, either. Just because Wesleyan offers these alternative courses doesn’t mean everyone is taking them.</p>
<p>Smartalic34, glad to hear that.</p>
<p>that website is depressingly biased… not that the opposing extreme is any better.</p>
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<p>What you envision for a broad liberal arts education is not a bad thing at all. I think the major point here is let the student decide what he/she wants to take. Obviously some colleges are better at that than others. What’s wrong with adding to these traditional courses additional subjects that are a bit more contemporary and useful than still one more play by Shakespeare? Race, feminism, sexual orientation–these are CONTEMPORARY issues, important in TODAY’S world. What is wrong with understanding them better? I’m old too, but I think I understand the point of opening up a college’s curriculum with more choices. Not requirements. Choices.</p>
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<p>There is no “opposing extreme” website. Post a link, if you know of one. If you can find one, I’ll agree with you.</p>
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<p>Amen. 
I made it my business to know every core requirement (or lack thereof) at every college my kid applied to, before I was willing to plunk down multiple $40-$60 application fees. I gave my input, but in the end it was their choice.</p>
<p>“What’s wrong with adding to these traditional courses additional subjects”</p>
<p>Plainsman, there is nothing wrong with adding courses, but I was under the impression you could, if you were so inclined, take only these courses for four years without taking any of the foundational courses to which I previously referred.</p>
<p>Smartalic34, are the charges leveled by the author of these rankings that Wesleyan students and professors attempt to silence opposing viewpoints and do not allow diversity of thought justified? Would a student with conservative views feel unwelcome on campus?</p>
<p>Not knowing the source or author, after a quick read of their reviews I came away with this: “hey, this is a list of schools my right-wing religious conservative friends find threatening” given its anti-coed, anti-liberal, anti-multicultural, anti-social science, anti-“anything that isn’t traditional” slant. </p>
<p>Train wreck? That seems like a rather juvenile label.</p>
<p>Just a moderate view, I hope. I firmly believe in learning good writing & thinking in college, as the base - and I’m personally biased in being a huge fan of everyone being taught Shakespeare. I’m not in charge of curriculum anywhere, but I do have my own strong opinions (i.e. Shakespeare, which is a lonely argument any more) about breadths. Ok, I don’t run my own college, or world, more’s the pity. But I do think there are these writing and thinking fundamentals that a BA from any accredited institution should be able to shout to the wide world. Whatever students are studying, it should be rigorous and based in good evidence - it should be sound. Beyond that, take what classes they will, I say, and have at it. What gets my goat are students (and parents, politicians, etc) with a chip their shoulder about content. That is not what college is about. College is about learning how to make your own argument. If you disagree with the professor’s story, do your best to make a better one.</p>
<p>I know the rankings are obviously politically motivated, but I am trying to focus on the criticisms relating to the curriculum and if Wesleyan has a tolerant culture for many viewpoints, including conservative ones on campus. I am looking for students or others who are familiar with Wesleyan to respond to the substance of these charges without getting into a political food fight.</p>
<p>Starbright, I don’t know your politics and I don’t really care to know, but I noticed in a prior post you compared American colleges unfavorably to Canadian colleges, because Canadian colleges generally have far less “fun” courses and place far greater emphasis on academic education. Is it possible you actually agree with the authors of this ranking in this specific area. Here is the quote from your prior post:</p>
<p>“One tends to take heavier workloads each semester and with far fewer “fun” courses available (courses that Canadian unis would consider entirely extra-curricular and not part of an academic schedule worthy of a transcript grade). There is usually more reading and a lot more writing. And as you may have heard, bigger schools with much less ‘hand holding’. Universities in Canada work more as places you go for an academic education and not as oriented as a “life changing experience” that Americans look for.”</p>
<p>Gendered Movements: Migration, Diaspora, and Organizing in a Transnational Perspective</p>
<p>This course examines the following conundrum: Why are women’s contributions to contemporary transnational and global processes not recognized despite the fact women comprise a significant and sizeable proportion of transnational migrants, actively knit together and produce diasporas and global organizations, and their labouring undergirds contemporary neoliberal economic processes? In analyzing these issues, we will explore the works of feminists seeking to account for the gendered contributions of women to these processes.</p>
<p>There are countless courses like this one in the Wesleyan course catalog. I have read the course description a number of times, and I don’t have a clue what it means. Anyone out there who understands it?</p>
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<p>Are you sayinng, because you don’t understand it, that there must be something wrong with it? That might explain how the editors of the train-wreck poll came up with their list.</p>
<p>Ok, so some traditionalists are uncomfortable with schools that do not have extensive core requirements. Presumably, those people (or, more likely, the kids of those people), don’t end up attending Wesleyan. </p>
<p>Wesleyan’s stature speaks for itself. It is, without question, one of the best liberal arts colleges in the country. Is it for everyone? Clearly not. A lot of people would rather follow the rules and check the boxes than take responsibility for charting their own course. (I have one kid at Wesleyan and one kid at a large state university that has an extensive core curriculum. I find virtue in both approaches.)</p>
<p>The type of kids who attend Wes – in general, really smart, motivated kids – are not prone to use the lack of core requirements as a way to glide through school taking what some might consider “silly” courses. More likely, based on my observations of my daughter and her friends at Wes, they use that freedom to take double majors that are difficult to achieve at schools that have extensive core courses. For example, my daughter’s roommate is majoring in psychology and dance; my daughter, more conventionally, is majoring in economics and math. And, both kids have rounded out their educational path with a reasonably broad range of courses outside their majors.</p>
<p>In any event, the ranking – and, I suspect, the posting – are far less concerned with the quality of education being delivered at Wesleyan than they are with making a political statement about the institution and the people who attend it. The ranking organization and the poster are entitled to their views. But, if they think that, based on the lack of a core curriculum and some of its quirkier course offerings, Wes is not delivering a top quality education, the record of achievement of Wesleyan graduates suggests otherwise.</p>
<p>JW, I don’t consider myself illiterate, but whoever wrote that description is totally unable to write clear and understandable prose. It’s rare that I have seen a writing sample more inscrutable than that one.</p>
<p>“I suspect, the posting – are far less concerned with the quality of education being delivered at Wesleyan than they are with making a political statement about the institution and the people who attend it”</p>
<p>Sidperson, thank you for divining my motivations; next time just ask me. Trust me, I don’t have a secret agenda and I am not attempting to make a political statement. I have asked a number of questions and, except for one poster, no one as of yet has addressed them.</p>
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Okay, it’s a rather long compound sentence with a lot of information packed into it, but, it’s actually pretty clear, if you take the time to read it. God forbid that twenty years out of college, we adults should have to read anything more complicated than an Excel™ spreadsheet!</p>
<p>Parent57 - The authors come at this with a bit of a bias. Have you read the “Choosing the Right College”? The name is a great pun … with the use of “Right”. I read the intro, which you essentially excerpt from above, and thought this might be pretty good if a student is interested in a classic liberal arts education … although schools without strict core requirements like Brown and Amherst would suffer in the ratings. However the meat of the reviews are a different story (at least to me).</p>
<p>Schools are criticized for not having a tradtional core and highly critisized for classed in women’s studies, or African-American studies, or virtually any other liberal topic … and heavily critisized if these courses can be used to fulfull reguirements. They are also cricized for not allowing diversity of thought and being biased liberal and not allowing or minimizing conservative or traditional thought. OK, I’m not sure these courses are necessarily poor options but the lack of openess to opposing views is certainly troubling and somethng about which I appreciate input.</p>
<p>Let’s follow that thought. </p>
<p>Grove City College is given credit for the rigorous hiring practices to ensure new faculty members fit into the school environment … that they fit in and do not create dissidence from the faculty … that they fit in and agree with the faculty’s Fundamentalist Christian viewpoint. </p>
<p>Grove City College is also given credit for sticky to it’s principles about it’s curriculum and not giving in to modern liberal trends and adding courses like women studies courses … somewhat Ok with this comment … extra credit for having stuck to teaching from their fundamentalist christian viewpoint.</p>
<p>So Grove City gets credit and a green light for screening faculty to ensure they agree with the mind set of the school and for ensuring all courses are taught from this viewpoint.</p>
<p>What happened to the thoughts in the intro about valuing diversity of thought and wanting a campus open to opposing viewpoints? In reality what this book is not rating that at all … it is rating how tolerate a school is of conservative ideas and how much it limits liberal views.</p>
<p>PS - even with my harsh criticism I think this guide could be useful for someone more neutral of even liberal when looking at schools. For me (very socially liberal) any school they rate with a green light would be out. However I’d be interested in why they rated a main stream school with a red or yellow light
- what they consider as a negative course offering I probably consider a positive
- what they consider as a negative because of imposing political correctness I would be interested in finding out more
- what they consider as a negative for suppression of conservative thought I would be very interested in finding out more</p>
<p>PS#2 - 3-7 kids a year from my kid’s HS go to Wesleyan and they overwhelminly LOVE it … it’s definately a school I recommend visiting as it has a very strong (liberal) personality and is not for everyone … but for those comfortable there thay have a GREAT experience.</p>
<p>3togo, I looked for the write-up on Grove City and couldn’t find it. This school was not listed on their top ten list. If, as you say, they commend the school for not hiring faculty with viewpoints differing from the mindset of the school, then I would think they are being hypocritical.</p>
<p>^^Grove City is listed in the parent publication, “Choosing the Right College”; however you can use the ranking’s search engine to get a snippet (the entire write-up will cost you $2.50)</p>
<p>[CollegeGuide.org</a> - Grove City College](<a href=“http://www.collegeguide.org/itemdetail.aspx?item=e7f10cc3-b477-445f-bf68-639ad6401225]CollegeGuide.org”>http://www.collegeguide.org/itemdetail.aspx?item=e7f10cc3-b477-445f-bf68-639ad6401225)</p>
<p>I agree with 3togo that it’s not a badly written guidebook, if you’re willing and able to set your own defaults. The first edition included some fairly spot-on historical information, at least as far as Wesleyan was concerned. But, subsequent editions have become increasingly gimicky, IMHO, this attempt at mimicking the USNews rankings, being just one example.</p>
<p>Thanks JW, but I am too cheap to pay the $2.50.</p>
<p>That’s $2.50 less being contributed to the vast right-wing conspiracy. ;)</p>
<p>Seriously, that’s my only reservation about buying the book or delving much further into its search engine; it’s such a clearly politicized enterprise that it would be like putting money directly into the pocket of the Tea Party, which is the last thing this country needs.</p>
<p>Having graduated years ago, I was somewhat surprised at the number of schools offering options to a core curriculum. My S and I listened and tried to understand more about this. One of the many things we noticed was the very high percentage of schools offering first year writing courses or first year “experiences.” While every student in a school might have a first year writing course, the content was widely varied in these courses. What was being taught was a set of skills - not the specific content. Much of what we believe we learned about open curriculums was very similar. There was/is an underlying approach to teach skills - analysis, problem solving, presentation orally and in writing, etc. By offering courses that would engage the students based upon content (since they would be able to select their courses), it was easier to help develop skills. For me at least, this makes sense. The students should always be engaged using this approach. I had to laugh about studying the Federalist papers (which I did). Why is this essential? I see where it can be important for some students but everyone? I hope this helps to at least diffuse the tension around core requirements or lack thereof.</p>