A New Study on campus rape and the one in five number

Parents Forum
1241

I thought of that as well. The accused person would hope that the tribunal concluded that both people actively participated and both people were drunk to incapacitation, and the tribunal would tell them, “Go thou and sin no more.”

But it only would be successful if the tribunal were convinced that, among other things, the original accuser was an active participant and the original accused person was drunk to incapacitation. And if the tribunal concludes that both people were active, “consenting” participants and both were drunk to incapacitation, I have no problem with the tribunal telling both of them to go away and behave themselves next time. (I have no problem with the tribunal sanctioning them both, either, since both would be determined to be offenders. But obviously if both are equally guilty, both should be equally punished.)

The accused person has no defense, though, if both people are determined to be drunk to incapacitation, but only the accused person was an active participant. That is still rape. Do we have a feeling for what percentage of accusations of rape are Occidental-style accusations where the woman says that she was drunk to incapacitation, but acknowledges that she was a full “consenting” participant?

1242

@Demosthenes49 wrote, in regards to the responsibility held by participants in a sex act, both of whom are too drunk to give consent:

Wait, what?

All that I can get from reading this is that men are more likely to be sexual aggressors, and therefore should be assumed to bear more responsibility for sex. This is a fairly common way of thinking, but it’s also outdated (not as in socially outdated, I’m talking scientifically outdated here). If that’s not what you meant, please unpack your meaning a bit.

1243

Maybe @Demosthenes49 thinks it’s the man’s responsibility because women sometimes accuse men, but men rarely accuse women? That is, if a man and a woman are both too drunk to consent, his biggest risk is that both will be equally active but she will accuse him, and her biggest risk is that he will overpower her when she is not an active participant.

1244

I interpreted this as practically speaking it is the man’s responsibility because he is the one who can be labeled a sexual offender and kicked out of school if something goes wrong. Drunk hooking up is playing with fire for guys and girls, but for slightly different reasons.

1245

@chris17mom: Pretty much. For better or worse, our society views sex as something men do to women. Prosecutors know this and charge accordingly (because that’s how juries will behave). Legally both would be responsible, but the abstract law doesn’t matter much if prosecutors don’t charge accordingly (this is not to impugn prosecutors, they just live with the reality of their jobs).

1246

@Demosthenes49 Yeah, that makes sense. As the mother of a boy, though, this is pretty distressing. It really seems like the potential to be unfairly accused is huge, just due to his gender. I’ve been having him read these threads, and I’ve mentioned the risks of drinking and hooking up many more times than he can stand! He’s getting really sick of me harping on it! But better safe than sorry I say. :slight_smile:

1247

It’s not. There is a risk your son will be unfairly accused. It is not huge. It is small, but non-zero. He can eliminate that risk almost entirely by avoiding having sex with people who have been drinking, and by not having sex when he has been binge drinking.

If you have any daughters, their risk of actually being assaulted is much higher than your son’s risk of being falsely accused. There are a lot more assaults than accusations, and there are a lot more accusations than false accusations. Young women can lower their risk of being assaulted by not binge drinking.

1248

Vice is on right now on hbo.

The sexual assault program.

1249

@“Cardinal Fang” I guess you are right and the risk is not huge. We have talked about it extensively and he understands the problem. I just think the whole environment of housing binge drinking co-eds together is a recipe for regularly occurring incidents of these sorts. But that is not something I can really control, and as a parent sometimes you have to give them the information and then let go. And hope and pray they are ok!

1250

I thought the Vice show was pretty good when the viewer can see and hear the victims.

I think this is one of the stories.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/02/12/university-of-arkansas-sexual-assault-expulsion_n_6646262.html

1251

I totally agree with this woman. From http://freebeacon.com/issues/scholar-grievance-feminism-crippling-debate-on-gender-politics/
and especially “love” the concept of “grievance feminism” in light of what’s been happening around Northwestern, Columbia and other campuses.

Just look at the 1,000+ posts about statistics here and read the responses.

I believe this because on all the threads over the past year some amazing in poor taste posts have been hurdled at our “own” people trying to explain their perspective if it’s happening in 'normal" life then it’s stands to reason that it would be happening at even greater degree among feminists.

http://■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■/2015/04/georgetown-demands-edits-to-christina-hoff-sommers-video/

And these young college people are now pressuring a college about a public and open lecture. The grievance feminists not only want to stop the opposing view, they want to stop their own if they “look bad” with their arguments in public. The maddness needs to stop.

1252

Well… It looks like this bill is going to pass in Cal.

http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/pub/15-16/bill/asm/ab_0951-1000/ab_967_bill_20150326_amended_asm_v98.htm

1253

A summary of the bill…

http://time.com/3910602/campus-rape-sexual-assault-california-law/

1254

http://www.freep.com/story/news/columnists/rochelle-riley/2015/05/25/rochelle-riley-campus-assault/27940351/

1255

Yeah, jane and john at Occi were “real brutal” with each other LOL. Ah yes, still pretty loosy goosey.

1256

I don’t think that California bill will have the effect its sponsors intend.

1257

I don’t like the mandatory sentence structure…

Ok…if there has to be a minimum…these are awful crimes…a two year suspension may be a weak punishment…

Hmmmmm…what are the actual crimes in the following? A two year suspension may be too much…

1258

I agree, dstark. A minimum two year suspension looks like too much for some of those offenses. If the punishment is too severe, it encourages victims not to report and adjudicators not to convict, even when the perpetrator committed the offense.

1259

I would start anther thread, but we have enough rape threads.

http://www.al.com/news/montgomery/index.ssf/2015/06/auburn_university_lab_tech_ind.html

My guess is Auburn is going to fire the guy before he is convicted.

http://www.campusreform.org/?ID=6541

1260

And federal Judge Wallace Capel did not mince words when it came to this sad excuse for a man:

Also the judge denied bond saying he was a danger to the community. I think the fact that there is a “market” for this drug says it all.