<p>texaspg, In NY they charge the same premium for everyone.</p>
<p>"I dont know why speaking untruths is used to support arguments.</p>
<p>People know the truth."</p>
<p>People know their version of the truth. ACA has 14 amendments so far that did not go through congress. Very few are able to keep up with it at this point and when I read a news story title claiming “Obama Repeals Obamacare” in WSJ, I have to wonder what they are saying. I assume they fact checked the story but with so much political content in it and statements that one can interpret different ways, sometimes the reader’s interpretation skills can be in question. </p>
<p>Here is the actual quote. What I find interesting is that when I try to find a catastrophic plan in my zip code with an age 30 or above, there are zero plans. So the real question is whether they are being offered to older people and if so which States.</p>
<p>"The under-30 ObamaCare category that is being opened to everyone is called “catastrophic” coverage. These plans are still more expensive than those sold on the former market but they’re about 20% cheaper on average than normal exchange plans because fewer mandates apply and they’re priced for a healthier, younger risk pool. "</p>
<p>Edit: I tried a zip code in California and found plans for a 55 year old. The pricing does vary between 20 and 60 from 102 to 540, a lot more than 1 to 3.</p>
<p>To the best of my knowledge, all of the exchange plans in Illinois are also available off the exchange. However, the opposite is not true. There are many more options available off the exchange when you look at the available deductibles and OOP maximums. </p>
<p>Since healthcare.gov erroneously sent my D’s app to IL Medicaid, she was forced to get a policy off-exchange. The main benefit of this was that she was able to get a plan with a much lower deductible than was offered on the exchange. The drawback, of course, is that she was not allowed to pick a plan that could be subsidized.</p>
<p>Still waiting to pay, however. : (</p>
<p>“To the best of my knowledge, all of the exchange plans in Illinois are also available off the exchange. However, the opposite is not true. There are many more options available off the exchange when you look at the available deductibles and OOP maximums.”</p>
<p>IllinoisMom is saying what I was attempting to. I think, cf, you are doing the same thing that I am…making an assumption without knowing specific facts. Were you just comparing the same five insurance companies plans on and off the exchange? If so, I agree the plans are very similar. But there are far more options off the exchange. For example, Group Health (on exchange) prices look really great—but it’s an entirely different sort of health care experience. Not one you can really compare to other plans.</p>
<p>If I was to truly research this, it would take weeks. Unless I knew someone who had already gone through this same situation. The exchange plans mostly don’t cover the best hospitals, would they cover my son’s neurologist, what about the hospitals we use? How much would be out of network. What about coverage in NYC, would he get two policies to cover each state because he comes home often and his doctors are here, perhaps a catastrophic plan? What about all the different variables?</p>
<p>I’m not asking people for answers to these questions because we don’t have to face this issue yet, I’m saying it is individual and very complicated. Sometimes one plan might look cheap until you actually look at the details. You can’t just look at a few plans and say they’re all the same, they’re not.</p>
<p>Texaspg, some versions of the truth are false. ;)</p>
<p>I am not commenting on the contents of your post. I assume your contents are true. .)</p>
<p>I dont have the exact numbers but a large majority of the young in NY will qualify for subsidies. I would say 80 percent, but I might be off by several percent. :)</p>
<p>Anthem has similar plans on and off the exchange in Ca. Anthem also has additional plans off the exchange. I did not see any bargains off the exchange.</p>
<p>With Kaiser, I could not see their off exchange plans. Maybe, if I was already a customer of Kaiser, I would have been able to see their off exchange plans.</p>
<p>"I would say 80 percent, but I might be off by several percent. "</p>
<p>There are two pieces to it. If the premiums are higher for younger people because they are subsidizing the older ones, then they are priced higher compared to their income thus requiring subsidies. This is the discussion a month ago concerning a CNN piece claiming some younger people get no subsidy despite being poverty income level without considering their premiums being peanuts (I think it was Illinois).</p>
<p>OTOH, the 20 percent young ones not qualifying for subsidies will probably pay far above based on their age because they live in NY compared to Illinois</p>
<p>This is a pretty good article clarifying the various scenarios facing young people. It’s really not as easy as they get subsidies so why not sign-up? Cat plans were cheap pre-ACA (cheaper?) so if they didn’t buy them then, why would they buy them now? Some will. Some probably won’t.</p>
<p>[Will</a> the ‘Young Invincibles’ Join Obamacare? - Bloomberg](<a href=“Bloomberg - Are you a robot?”>Bloomberg - Are you a robot?)</p>
<p>“OTOH, the 20 percent young ones not qualifying for subsidies will probably pay far above based on their age because they live in NY compared to Illinois”</p>
<p>Yes… </p>
<p>I dont know what is happening in NY but I may end up paying $350 a month in NY for a bronze plan for a 25 year old. </p>
<p>I am not understanding the first part of your post. Subsidies are based on income levels. Are you saying the net cost after subsidies is higher in NY compared to Illinois for a young person with the same income?</p>
<p>dstark - I am betting on you being my primary poster on the next thread - ACA relocations. NY will be cheaper for you with your son subsidizing you… :D</p>
<p>The subsidy is triggered at 9.5% (lower at lower incomes starting at 100% poverty level). The premiums are so low in some states that the subsidies never get triggered even at very low incomes.</p>
<p>Texaspg, Lol.</p>
<p>Since I know so little about ACA relocations, I am warning you, my posts are going to be full of untruths. :)</p>
<p>“The subsidy is triggered at 9.5% (lower at lower incomes starting at 100% poverty level). The premiums are so low in some states that the subsidies never get triggered even at very low incomes.”</p>
<p>You are right. :)</p>
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</p>
<p>Where does someone not get a subsidy despite being poverty level ($11,490)? This place, wherever it is, has insurance rates for $230 a year. $230 a year.</p>
<p>Megan McArdle in Bloomberg Oct. 1 (from Flossy’s link), the first line:</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Actually, it’s a large exaggeration. In fact it’s completely wrong. The Kaiser Foundation dug into the numbers.
[The</a> Numbers Behind ?Young Invincibles? and the Affordable Care Act | The Henry J. Kaiser Family Foundation](<a href=“http://kff.org/health-reform/perspective/the-numbers-behind-young-invincibles-and-the-affordable-care-act/]The”>The Numbers Behind “Young Invincibles” and the Affordable Care Act | KFF) </p>
<p>
</p>
<p>It turns out that (except in New York) premiums by age track expenses by age pretty well. People of a certain age pay a premium that more or less is the average cost for people their age.</p>
<p>The Kaiser article was published last week, so McArdle has an excuse for getting the answer wrong in October.</p>
<p>Okay, well here’s the no subsidy CNN link, but it’s probably all wrong, too.</p>
<p>[CNN:</a> No Obamacare subsidy for some low-income Americans - CNN.com](<a href=“http://www.cnn.com/2013/11/22/politics/obamacare-subsidies/index.html]CNN:”>http://www.cnn.com/2013/11/22/politics/obamacare-subsidies/index.html)</p>
<p>"Where does someone not get a subsidy despite being poverty level ($11,490)? This place, wherever it is, has insurance rates for $230 a year. $230 a year. "</p>
<p>People at 100% get Medicaid. It is at a poverty level where the premiums were at 7.5% income level and not 100% (165$ per month or so). If you are so keen, you can go back and read the thread. That’s when we identified at what income the threshold starts and how it increases upto 9.5%</p>
<p>Flossy, </p>
<p>"But if the baseline plan is cheap enough, the formula is thrown off and the subsidy is zero.</p>
<p>“The way the subsidy works is by capping the percent of your income that you’d have to spend on a silver premium,” said Cynthia Cox, a policy analyst at the Kaiser Family Foundation, referring to the medium-level insurance plan the government uses as the baseline. “But if the premium before subsidies is already so low that it falls below your income cap, then you wouldn’t qualify for a subsidy even if your income would otherwise qualify for one.”</p>
<p>Texaspg, just mentioned this. </p>
<p>Thanks for the link.</p>
<p>People at 100% get insurance in non-expansion states. Like Texas. </p>
<p>Flossy, the no-subsidy link isn’t wrong. It’s just profoundly dopey. People with insurance they can already afford don’t get subsidies! And yet people with that same income whose insurance premiums would be higher do get subsidies! Film at 11!</p>
<p>Why this was worth one pixel on CNN is beyond me.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>There is one price for everyone under 21, including your 20-year-old. The 3-1 ratio is for people aged 21 to 64. If you go back, you will discover that for every plan, the price for the 64-year-old is exactly three times the price for the 21-year-old. That’s black letter law.</p>
<p>"People at 100% get insurance in non-expansion states. Like Texas. "</p>
<p>Non-expansion states are not part of Medicaid discussion - already established and don’t need to be dragged into make a point.</p>
<p>"Why this was worth one pixel on CNN is beyond me. "</p>
<p>That is the whole point of the discussion - 100-400% poverty level are eligible subsidies but it can disappear for many younger ones much earlier than 400% because their premiums are low. However, in NY 80% of younger ones seem to be getting a subsidy because their premiums are higher than other states.</p>
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<p>What difference does the subsidy make? If you’re buying insurance, or anything else, what you care about is what you pay.</p>
<p>Come on, are young people in Chicago going to complain that they are forced, forced I tell you, to pay less for their insurance than people in New York? Get out the world’s tiniest violins.</p>