Airtran removes Parents & Screaming Kid

Parent Cafe
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<p>as the parent of a special needs child who suffered from sensory integration dysfunction and frequently had tantrum during his toddler years that were more neurologically based - and sometimes lasted for hours during his meltdown periods (yes hours!), I can empathize with the parents (but still would have strapped him in, one way or the other). This version got a little more of my sympathy:</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.telegram.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070121/COLUMN01/701210459/1008/NEWS02?page1[/url]”>http://www.telegram.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070121/COLUMN01/701210459/1008/NEWS02?page1&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

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<p>True, I said maybe she was completely resisting which could make it very hard. But it didn’t seem from the version we got they were really trying (she was under the seat). Although who knows, I wasn’t there. Even so, they really can’t delay a plane for that and although I do empathize because it must suck to get kicked off your plane and miss your flight when your toddler is already having a meltdown, there is a full plane of other passengers too and you have to be empathetic to them. I’m not going to judge their child’s behavior or their parenting…it’s a high stress situation. It just seems strange to me. I was on a plane recently and there were a few small children not handling it very well but they were in the seat. I suppose that the airplane seatbelts are fairly easy to undo since you just pull them up and they snap open, which could have meant they would have had to physically hold her there. And I mean they have to trust their instincts, if doing that isn’t right for their child, they shouldn’t do it. But they must have realized she would have to sit down at some point or they would have to vacate the plane.</p>

<p>Edited: the version above is interesting with more info from the parents. Sounds like it could have been handled better. The airline attendants were very sympathetic to the children on my flight. If the airline attendant had even tried to address the child, perhaps it could have helped the situation, rather than treating her like luggage or something. Still, while I understand that they may not have been able to get her in the seat in any way, I can understand also that she would need to be in the seat for the plane to take off.</p>

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<p>I’d like to think that everyone who whipped out an opinion based on the first news story would spend some time contemplating how their opinions are so easily manipulated by very simple rhetorical devices, and also about who owns the media which deliver those rhetorical opinion-shapers…</p>

<p>nah… ;)</p>

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<p>“we’re trying” that was the extent </p>

<p>she plopped herself on the floor- so you pick her up and put her in the seat for heavens sake</p>

<p>I ask again, if this was an emergency, do you think those parents would “try” and control their child or would they do what they needed to do…</p>

<p>as a parent, I don’t sympathize…they just let her have a tantrum…delaying the plane 15 minutes</p>

<p>having been the parent of toddlers, a parents JOB is to make sure their child is safe and if it means picking them up and putting them in a seat, then that is what we do</p>

<p>I have to say, most parents I talked to about this would not have “tried” they would have “done”</p>

<p>please, we are trying…hogwash…this was a normal cranky child whose actions delayed at least a hundred other people, not to mention those at the other end and the parents “were trying”</p>

<p>you pick her up, put her in the seat, strap her in and let her cry…</p>

<p>she is not in pain, she is not dying, she is having a tantrum…somehow millions of parents figure how to deal with them every day </p>

<p>and to get all huffy because you coulnd’t control your child enough to allow a play full of other people, who the parents seem to not care much about, well they should stop pouting and APOLOGIZE to all the people they held up</p>

<p>never once in any comment did the parents say sorry to all the people the inconvienced</p>

<p>that shows lack of character and what kind of parents they are…and why they allowed their child to have a long tantrum and “try”</p>

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<p>flying after ear surgery can be very dangerous, btw- some say you need to wait at least a month, depending on the surgery…</p>

<p>if those parents had to get in a helicoptor to get out of danger, I GUARANTEE you they would have gotten that kid into a seat in 30 seconds</p>

<p>i know I sound harsh, but picture yourself on that plane with a connection to make and you have a parent who can;'t control their child delaying you</p>

<p>I can bet those of you that understand might not be so forgiving if they let them stay on the plane, consoling the child for what another 15 minutes and you missed your flight…they drew the line and since mom had no control, nor dad, they were asked to leave</p>

<p>for those that think they should have been allowed to stay, how much longer should everyone else, and we are talking hundreds of people be held up while mom consoles a child having a tantrum</p>

<p>remember, you have passengers, families at the airport, pilots, workers, people making connections, etc</p>

<p>guess they should have let mom console her child for another 20 minutes or whatever while everyone else sat quietly </p>

<p>if your kid was having a tantrum, say in the middle of the street, guess traffic should just stop and wait for you</p>

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<p>I just read an article by a travel writer (can’t find the link again) which suggests that the parents were just unprepared. The writer talked about pre-trip conversations stressing the importance of “helping the pilot get ready to fly by strapping in,” and having diversions–new books or toys. The writer said that if her kid was still upset, she’d go to a bribe (lollipop), and finally only as a last resort force the kid into the seat. Seems like the parents were without “tools” for a kid at the age at which tantrums are all too common.</p>

<p>I feel sorry for the parents. If they can’t negotiate this stage, wait till the teenage years!</p>

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<p>The guys an EMT going to school nights to get a nursing certification!</p>

<p>Bad, bad, mean airline.</p>

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<p>kluge, I didn’t “whip out an opinion.” I took the time to view an interview with the parents. They came cross as totally self-absorbed, unconcerned with the other passengers. I agree with CGM: the parents should not have merely “tried,” they should have “done.”</p>

<p>I sympathize with parents traveling with little kids. I’ve offered to hold babies for moms who need to use a restroom. I’ve tried to distract distressed little ones. Helped moms get down carry-ons, etc. I’m not heartless. I just expect parents to be in control of their kids.</p>

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<p>“A willful kid that age can be almost impossible to bring under control. Sure - you can physically overpower them, but they will become literally hysterical - and ain’t that fun on a plane?”</p>

<p>It’s difficult, no doubt…but if you really couldn’t get her strapped in, I don’t think you’d blame the airline for asking you to get off the plane. She can scream her head off if she wants; she just has to wear the seat belt.</p>

<p>At what point do you think the airline should ask an unbelted passenger to leave the plane so the 100+ others can take off? If 15 minutes is too soon to step in, what about an hour? Two hours?</p>

<p>100% agree that these parents would be the first to sue the airline if there were severe turbulence following takeoff and the unbelted child had been injured.</p>

<p>I saw a similar family dynamic boarding a flight a couple of months ago. A ten-year-old boy sat in the aisle seat his father wanted, and refused to move when his father asked him to (first politely, then forcefully). Finally the father took the middle seat and complained to the mother, “He won’t move!” Unbelievable – as though there were no other forms of persuasion besides a request. Dad, your son is too big to move by force, but I don’t think he paid for his ticket, his Gameboy, the clothes on his back, or anything in his carry-on. Start taking YOUR things back from the child, and see whether he still insists on sitting in YOUR aisle seat. What are you planning to do in a few years when your son takes your car and your credit cards? Complain about it to your wife?</p>

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<p>We once flew the Flight From Hell when D2 was a toddler. She had her own seat and we strapped her in for take-off and for turbulence as the rules insist, and that’s what she threw a fit over. She didn’t want to be in the seat and screamed and cried for an hour or so about it. We did our best to quiet her, but nothing would work that day. I still cringe to this day when I think of the unfortunate people who sat around us. For this reason I tend to cut a lot of slack to people traveling with babies and toddlers.</p>

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<p>I read these articles also. As I recall…even on Airtran, families with young children are allowed to board first. The family indicated that they “just needed more time” to settle their child down. They should have preboarded, and buckled the child in IMMEDIATELY…and brought toys and other things to entertain the child. I know some kids are not as easy to deal with as others, but we simply carried our kids or held their hands…buckled them in and that was that. Did the family expect the airline to wait indefinitely for their child to conform to the safety standards of air travel (buckled in seat)? Sorry…I’m with the airline. Now…would some restaurants please do the same. It annoys me no end when I go to an EXPENSIVE restaurant (not an ice cream parlor) and some family has their toddler either tossing food or crying and it’s 9 in the evening and no one seems to notice in the kid’s family. Hire a sitter.</p>

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<p>the original reports said the child screamed, slapped the parents repeatedly, and bit them. This sounds to me like the usual suspects and their empowered child. If they think this is bad, wait til they put her in school and find out the teachers also don’t tolerate screaming and slapping. Here is one statement…
“Judy Graham-Weaver, spokesperson for the airline, reported that the child was “climbing under the seat, hitting the parents, and refusing to sit in her seat.” The incident continued for fifteen minutes past the scheduled departure time and at that point, the crew and other airline personnel decided that the family needed to get off the flight so that it could continue as scheduled.”
<a href=“http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/133406/toddlers_family_kicked_off_plane_following.html[/url]”>http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/133406/toddlers_family_kicked_off_plane_following.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

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<p>I don’t think many (anyone?) has said they should have been allowed to stay indefinitely. Some people aren’t judging their parenting skills on the basis of this one incident, but I recognize that it was probably time for the flight to take off and they couldn’t allow her to be out of her seat any longer. They probably could have had this experience with any airline. I just don’t see that they should be condemned on the basis of one incident. I think they should have been prepared to force their child into the seat or leave, but I think it’s understandable that when you’re traveling, stressful conditions, pretty confused about what’s going on, worried about your child’s behavior, that they would have been surprised and not reacted very charitably. Does that mean I agree with all they’re saying, not quite from what I’ve seen, although it’s difficult to judge without knowing them or being there.</p>

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<p>This reminds me of a few trips I’ve taken with my children. When my older son was about 2.5, I took him to visit my sister’s family. We boarded the plane, he was in the window seat in his carseat, I was in the middle, and a young man in his late 20’s, dressed in a suit, was in the aisle seat. My toddler was fascinated by the activity outside the plane, and he asked a long series of intelligent questions about all the unfamiliar vehicles on the tarmac. As the plane took off he fell asleep. The man next to me asked, “How do you stand it?” I was astounded. The was at the very best end of my son’s behavior spectrum.</p>

<p>On another trip, maybe a year later, we were on a propeller plane, and we had to circle the airport for about 40 minutes before landing. Neither my son nor I have a weak stomach, but I was feeling queasy and he started to turn green. Several other passengers vomited, and my son finally did too, just as we were landing. Afterward he still looked terrible and was clearly not feeling well. I was trying to take care of him and clean him up as everyone else got off, and after a few minutes the flight attendants began to pressure me to get off the plane because it was necessary to take a bus to the gate, and all the other passengers were waiting on it. I felt terrible about keeping them waiting, but I was doing the best I could. The flight attendants were not sympathetic and did nothing to help except provide a few wet paper towels.</p>

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<p>Another perspective on this incident:</p>

<p>“Parents don’t bring their kids on planes to make everyone else miserable, they do it for the same reason everyone flies: to get from point A to point B. When kids freak out on a plane, it is a nightmare for parents, coming from one who has been there.
Kids fly on planes. They cry sometimes. They fidget, they laugh, they get frustrated. Oh, yeah, and some breastfeed <a href=“http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15720339”>http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15720339&lt;/a&gt;.
You know who else flies? The guy who screams into his cell phone, the couple who fights, the college kids starting Spring Break early, the lady who shoves her stuff into your space, the young woman with a shrill voice who doesn’t stop talking, the 6 foot 8 man who puts his seat so far down it hits your lap.
Flying isn’t easy, and adults certainly do their part to make it an uncomfortable experience, too.
Isn’t it about time we took a collective deep breath and acknowledge that if we each tried just a little harder to respect each other’s space it might make the whole experience a bit more bearable?
Why expend so much negative energy on children and their parents? Kids on planes is a reality that is not going away. The sooner the airlines deal with it productively, the better for everyone.
Perhaps AirTran, and Freedom, the airline that recently kicked a breastfeeding mother and child off a plane, need to consider putting a “family section” in the back of their planes and assign only flight attendants with compassion.”</p>

<p><a href=“HuffPost - Breaking News, U.S. and World News | HuffPost”>HuffPost - Breaking News, U.S. and World News | HuffPost;

<p>By the way, Airtran has one of the worst records for delayed flights - close to 25% (and I understand that a flight is not considered “delayed” unless it’s departure time is 15 minutes or longer after the initial departure time - probably because 15 minutes can often be made up in air time).</p>

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<p>I don’t necessarily condemn the parenting skills because of what happened on the plane, but I do cringe at the whining afterwards. If we were removed from an airplane because my toddler’s behavior was delaying the departure, I’d completely understand. Actually, I’d be mortified. Anyway, the last thing I’d do is publicize the event further by complaining in the press.</p>

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<p>“You know who else flies? The guy who screams into his cell phone, the couple who fights, the college kids starting Spring Break early”</p>

<p>What is Huffington thinking? If those people aren’t sitting in their seats when it’s time to push back, then they should (and would) be taken off the plane, too.</p>

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<p>Yep, who in their right mind would ever whine after being kicked off a flight and then not being allowed to take another flight for 24 hours?</p>

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<p>“Yep, who in their right mind would ever whine after being kicked off a flight and then not being allowed to take another flight for 24 hours?”</p>

<p>Exactly. Because I wouldn’t want to publicize that we/my child were responsible for delaying a flight, and that my child screams and hits me in public. That’s just me. I get embarrassed about stuff like that.</p>

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<p>My first thought was that I couldn’t believe the pilots held the plane for a full 15 minutes waiting for the parents to get their child to sit down. I think the plane was 15 mins behind schedule regardless of the kid, and when it was ready to leave, it was going. Regardless, if the kid wouldn’t get in the seat, they had no choice but to ask the family to leave the plane. I think that the rudeness was shared between the family and the airline. I’ve also read two different reasons the family waited 24 hours to take the next flight. First was that they wanted a direct flight with no layovers, and there were none available. Second was that the airline told them they had to wait 24 hours to fly. Truth certainly gets muddled in these sorts of things. :rolleyes:</p>