Alcohol and Cancer - Surgeon General’s Warning

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The numbers (just for info sake) was the base level for these cancers affected by alcohol was 118 per 1000 people getting these cancers. With roughly 1 drink a day (5-7 drinks a week), it goes to 133. I believe if it is 2 a day, it goes to like 158.

The studies about the health benefits of alcohol have been questioned. For example, the compounds in red wine that can protect health are also found in grape juice, so there are ways to get the benefit without wine.

One of the big problems, especially in the US, is what a drink is. Per standard terminology, it is 12oz of beer, 5 oz of wine, and 1 drink with 1.5oz of hard liquor. The problem is there is a tendency to drink more than you think. With hard liquor, lot of people pour themselves a lot more than 1.5 oz. With wine, the glasses they use to say I had a glass of wine is often much bigger than that. With beer, it is better because a bottle or can is the standard size. With hard liquor when you do it at a bar or restaurant, likely you are getting a standard serving, same with beer, with wine the glass they serve is likely close to 5oz.

For me personally I don’t drink much which means when I occassionally do drink something alcoholic if I have a couple of beers or a couple of glasses of wine or a couple of drinks I don’t worry about it. Funny part is because I don’t drink much, when I do drink 1 drink feels good to me, often drinking more doesn’t feel great.

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I think people react to risks in a way that they feel gives them control over their lives. On one end of the spectrum this means ignoring risks even when the risks are substantial. On the other end it means adjusting one’s lifestyle to minimize the risks, even if the risks are minuscule or even negligible. The rest of us are somewhere in between. Not sure which end of the spectrum causes more stress, but it probably depends on the individual.

But this thread is about alcohol, and with regard to alcohol, aside from the peer pressure I don’t see much harm or stress in people choosing not to drink for health reasons or any other reasons. It costs next to nothing to refrain from drinking. Why is this decision so threatening to those who choose otherwise? I can see why it is a threat to those on the alcohol industry’s payroll, but for the rest, what’s the threat? What’s this supposed stress created by the decision not to drink?

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I can tell you that my company hasn’t sold less alcohol in a year for as long as I can remember. The portfolio I manage was up well above the industry in both volume and revenue. One of my best selling items is up 40% MTD, during “Dry January.” People say younger generations drink less, but that doesn’t appear to be the case in our market.

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Not surprised. Our culture loves its alcohol, and it is impossible to escape the constant glorification, advertisements, and minimization of the dangers. Even on a thread about the health risks of alcohol.

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If you google “Are alcohol sales declining?,” the AI answer is:

“Yes, alcohol sales are declining.”

And associated news articles that go along with it.

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Absolutely. Just as there is no harm in eating tomatoes if you don’t like them. There’s absolutely no reason to drink alcohol if it doesn’t bring enough joy to outweigh the potential risk.

What I bristle at is the assertion that no amount of alcohol is “safe.” Sure, any amount of alcohol will up the risk, but let’s look at real numbers.

In the US the incidence of breast cancer over a lifetime is 12.9%. Ten grams a day of alcohol, equivalent to 5 drinks per week, comes with (the numbers vary, so I picked the highest one I found) a 7% relative increase in breast CA. The net…13.8% or a delta of less than one percent.

For some an overall increase of 0.9% is not acceptable. Most though, who already drink, would look at that and accept the marginal additional risk. I don’t think it’s usefully to paint all alcohol consumption with a broad brush. The relative risk increase is HIGHLY dose dependent.

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“Splitting the G” has become very popular with the younger generations. I’m sure TikTok is full of G splitting content.

Guinness, the beer of Irish pubs and Irish men, has endeared itself to chug-happy Americans eager to “split the ‘G.’”

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/12/03/dining/drinks/guinness.html#:~:text=Guinness%2520sales%2520were%2520strong%2520from,drinking%2520Guinness%252C”%2520he%2520said.

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The concept of what is “safe” is relative to one’s risk tolerance. Why bristle when others are more risk adverse than you? The situation reminds me of those who just couldn’t stand the fact that others chose to wear masks during covid, when they didn’t. Who cares if others choose to be more careful? It doesn’t cost anyone else anything.

Of course. But it is not ENTIRELY dose dependent. Or at least we don’t fully understand the dangers of even moderate alcohol use. For example there is growing evidence that for people with or susceptible to AFib, even moderate amounts of alcohol can be a trigger. Sure, drinking heavily increases the risk, but even moderate amounts can be risky. There is also growing evidence that quitting alcohol can significantly improve outcomes, but unfortunately the studies have been hard to conduct because it is really hard to get habitual drinkers to quit drinking all together.

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I googled “How much does alcohol raise cancer risk?,” and AI answered with the following:

"Alcohol consumption increases the risk of developing cancer in a dose-dependent manner. The risk of cancer increases with the amount of alcohol consumed and the type of cancer:

  • Head and neck cancer

Alcohol increases the risk of head and neck cancer by 40–500%. Drinking about 3.5 drinks per day doubles or triples the risk.

  • Esophageal cancer

Alcohol increases the risk of esophageal cancer by 30–500%. Even light drinking increases the risk.

  • Colorectal cancer

Alcohol increases the risk of colorectal cancer by 20–50%. Drinking about 3.5 drinks per day increases the risk by 1.5 times.

  • Liver cancer

Alcohol increases the risk of liver cancer by 60–200%. Heavy drinking increases the risk by 100%.

  • Breast cancer

Alcohol increases the risk of breast cancer by 4–60%. Drinking about 3.5 drinks per day increases the risk by 1.5 times.

  • Mouth and throat cancer

Moderate drinking increases the risk of mouth cancer by 80% and throat cancer by 40%. Heavy drinking increases the risk by 400% and 160%, respectively."

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I guess this isn’t the thread to mention that our graduation gift to our son this spring is a couple of days on the Kentucky Bourbon Trail sampling the distillery wares. However, I did warn him of the potential risks associated with this gift. :wink:

(DH will bring along a few fine cigars to pair with the spirits. Double whammy.)

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Do you know this? If so, please cite peer reviewed evidence.

Is there growing evidence of we can’t and haven’t conducted good research?

I’m not trying to be contrary. I just don’t like dogmatic statements based on murky science foundations. Been there done that with beef. Been there done that with eggs. Been there done that with keto.

Doesn’t it make you scratch your head when Germany has the fifth highest alcohol consumption per capita but ranks below 30th in cancer rate? The United States ranks 4th in cancer rate and below 30th in alcohol consumption per capita.

In the big scheme of things there are far bigger fish to fry than eliminating a few drinks per week.

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A little primer on risk.

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I understand risk.

As I mentioned up thread, it’s a risk me and my family do not take, whether absolute or relative. It’s also just wasted calories, high calories, low nutrients. I don’t eat donuts, cakes, ice cream and cookies either. :slightly_smiling_face:

Everyone can make their own choices for themselves and their families.

You can actually multi-task and “fry” the small, medium and large fish all at the same time.

Per Google AI:

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Interesting choice of a quote, considering the next sentence is “Or at least we don’t fully understand the dangers of even moderate alcohol use.”

As for what I know, I am relying on the advice of a well-respected cardiologist/ electrophysiologist/ physicist who, among other things, was the director of one of the most prominent electrophysiology labs in the world. He explained to me a few years ago that it has become increasingly clear that even moderate alcohol consumption can exacerbate/trigger AFib episodes in those with AFib, and recommends to some of his AFib patients that they quit drinking if they are willing to do do so.

I didn’t argue with him or make him provide me with his sources, but I assume he was referring to the studies like those described (but not cited) here . . .

For people who already have afib, alcohol appears to have a nearly instantaneous effect on their heart rhythm, according to a recent study. People in the study wore heart rate monitors and special ankle sensors to measure their alcohol intake. Researchers found that a single drink doubled the odds of a bout of afib occurring within the next four hours.

In yet another study, researchers created three-dimensional structural maps of the left atrium (one of the two upper chambers of the heart) in people with afib. Compared with light drinkers and nondrinkers, moderate drinkers had more evidence of scarring and electrical signaling problems in their atria. The severity of those problems was directly linked to the severity of afib among the participants.

The bottom line is that even small amounts of alcohol may harm your heart, which is why avoiding alcohol or limiting yourself to an occasional drink on special occasions may be the safest approach. Alcohol use is linked to many other health threats, including car accidents, violence, high blood pressure, and various cancers, and the risks rise in tandem with the amount you drink.

Describing (and citing) same or similar studies (gift link) . . .

The scientists found that drinking alcohol heightened the odds that a person would have an episode of atrial fibrillation, or an abnormal heart rhythm, within the next few hours. And the more they drank, the greater their likelihood of having an arrhythmia. The new study was published on Monday in the Annals of Internal Medicine. The conclusions, along with data from previous studies, suggest that people with a history of atrial fibrillation could reduce their chances of developing arrhythmias by cutting back on alcohol or avoiding it altogether.

Yes there is such evidence. See the NYTimes article above for a description of the issue with past studies dealing with the impact of alcohol, and how the current studies address these issues.

Nope. There are plenty of other lifestyle differences between the Germany the US that may explain the differences. I do scratch my head that you insist I should produce peer reviewed studies, but then turn around and rely on anecdotes such as this one.

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With all the discussion of alcoholic drinks, a risk no one has mentioned yet is mouthwashes with alcohol.

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Bread can have an ABV of up to 1.9%.

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Paleo bread doesn’t have yeast. And stop eating bread. :rofl:

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Seems more rhetorical than illuminating.

Most bread has a alcohol content of under 0.5% by weight, as compared to 5-6% ABV for regular beer, meaning that one would have to consume around a dozen loaves (1 lb each) of bread to ingest the amount of alcohol in one pint of beer (5-6% ABV)

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Challenge accepted! :rofl:

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