Yeah right. I have dealt with these situations every day (and every night) for 25 years. There are some situations in which juveniles have real psychiatric illnesses such as schizophrenia an are truly out to lunch such that any reasonable person would mostly exonerate them from responsibility from almost anything. The rest, the majority, of juvenile offenders who are “between 60 and 80%” mentally ill have softer mental illnesses which are generally speaking: raised by wolves and acting like wolves. The likelihood that the naive innocent would get an additional “FIVE YEARS” for basically nothing presupposes that the judge is some sort of troglodyte moron who reflexively adds time for meaningless offenses. That really does not happen 99.9% of the time.
There is no place on earth, or perhaps in the history of civilization, in which miscreants have more opportunity than in the USA now. It is sad and unfortunate that many don’t take advantage of that. It is discouraging that their parents are more responsible at times for the untoward outcomes than is the child. But the idea that the world is somehow raining down on them for doing next to nothing is false. Our country bends over backwards for any disadvantaged child that make an effort. Apologists do them no favors.
What do the children in your roommates “detention facility” do that is non-violent, the implication being that they are victims of their circumstances? Few people know the real stories and tragedies represented in these cases. They hear the sanitized versions. For example, is you roommate even permitted to tell you anything without violating their confidentiality? Of course not. You get a filtered version of their details, their “color” and “undeniable FACTS” notwithstanding.
My two cents: work - not volunteer - in a prison for awhile. I have done that. My preconceptions aside, I met not a single inmate that I wished were my neighbor. In fact (this was a maximum security prison) virtually everyone was an innocent victim of circumstances and wrongfully incarcerated. In my last week there, a female cafeteria worker was murdered. Another victim of circumstances.
Prisons are corrupt places. A friend who was employed in the system said, for example, that when he once tried to stand up for an inmate who had very obvious MH problems, he found his tires slashed in the parking lot.
@WiSdad23, great post. “Raised by wolves and acting like wolves” probably one of the best quotes describing out of control adolescents today. In my social worker role, most of my work is done with the mentally ill adult and geriatric population but I did my thesis on paramilitary camps for adolescents and worked for the county sheriff at a program similar to “scared straight”. Sixteen rapists, murderers and felony assailants aged 14-17, split female/male, 12 weeks. There was no diagnosable mental illness except poor or non-existent parenting.
Wait a sec. We’re way OT. But any social scientist knows a slice may not represent enough of the rest. We know there are many kids ‘in the system’ who are neither wolves, nor the product of them. And who would have been better served otherwise.
No wonder many of these kids are just written off by many.
Of course there are violent offenders at a young age. You’ll never hear me argue otherwise. But here is a report backed up by actual studies, not people’s perceptions.
Notice that the majority of crimes are non violent.
If anyone would like actual, fact based information about youth in the system, I’m happy to share syllabi from classes I’ve taken in the last few years around adolescents in the system. Or the part of my prelims reading list dedicated to institutionalized youth.
But in the mean time, I’m going back to sleep. I’m very sorry for derailing this thread. This will be my last post on this topic… here at least
It sounds like talking apples and oranges. WiSdad23 was talking about a maximum security prison. I doubt we’ll find many juveniles locked up for stealing yard signs there.
Yes, I’m not sure why we’re comparing maximum security prisons to juvenile detention facilities.
In the newspaper this morning: The governor of Maine just slashed the budget for educators at our local facility by one million dollars annually. The loss of staff will threaten the school’s accreditation status.
My last word on the subject: I would have posted like WiSdad23 before I started volunteering (i.e., working for free) in these facilities. Seeing the system up close and personal really changes your perspective.
@MaineLonghorn it is great that you volunteer at juvenile facilities but respectfully volunteers never hear the nitty gritty of what is really going on. The small minority of juveniles in any facility (even most psychiatric facilities) have actual mental illnesses like schizophrenia. Most are delinquents, budding personality disorders, conduct disorders, and substance abusers who commit crimes (i.e. not the hapless young person who smoked one joint).
Oh, Sighhhh.
Anyway, I’d still like a link about the signs (and jail?) We have another issue here, related to drinking, sometimes with grave injury…and dubious consequences. So, I’m curious.
Agree that the discussion of the juvenile detention, prisons, mental health underfunding, etc. is not related to the topic here, so let’s put that aside and focus on the COLLEGE ADMISSION consequences of such minor crimes. We had kids on our street bash the mailboxes with baseball bats in celebration of their upcoming graduation from HS. Some of those kids were college-bound… What would be an appropriate reaction from the colleges?
Perhaps it would depend on the college. Some colleges are much more strict about non-academic behavior, while others basically want to say that a student’s trouble with the law for acts not involving the college, students, or staff is between the student and the law. It would not be surprising if the former were more likely to rescind than the latter.
If I were running a college, I would want to make it consistent the penalty assessed on students at the college for similar acts.
No penalty from college => no penalty from college.
Expulsion => rescission.
Some other penalty from college => start college with the penalty and disciplinary record.
Of course, that would mean that the college needs to write its admission offer with appropriate conditions that the student accepts such disciplinary penalty for any acts between then and enrollment.
At the very least…tell your kids to dump the political signs elsewhere. Good grief, don’t bring them home! Have a bon fire or something:) Better yet, just slap a sticker with a different slogan over the top and leave them in the ground. What, exactly, are the monetary damages for signs you get for free?
First world problems, people. I might be in the minority, but I couldn’t give a rats patoot about this petty “crime.” It’s akin to toilet papering a tree…except that it’s actually much nicer because the kids are removing trash instead of leaving it. LOL. I very honestly wouldn’t care if a kid stole my sign. Big freaking deal.
What kills me…is how many people who would have a fit about a political yard sign…wouldn’t blink an eye over their own kids being caught drinking underage.
It’s the hypocrisy that makes it laughable…and sad.
While political signs are expensive and sign theft can be an emotional issue, candidates should not allow yard sign drama to distract from their campaign. Take the example of gun-toting Dale Peterson, a candidate for Alabama Agricultural Commissioner who ran an ad accusing his opponent of recruiting “thugs and criminals” to steal his yard signs. The ad went viral, but Peterson lost the election—coming in a distant third place. Although Peterson probably had other issues (he was subsequently convicted of stealing beer, paper towels, and cashews from a local Sam’s Club), the sideshow created by his accusations did not help his chances.
Another interesting thing to consider about political signs…home owners and neighborhood associations can ban them. And while you see a lot of threats of a mystical $1000 fine and a year in jail for anyone dastardly enough to do this horror against humanity…I have yet to see a documented case where these penalties and charges were ever actually filed…and certainly not against a kid. Typically, the police department says to the angry homeowner…this kid isn’t going to get convicted of anything when there are no actual monetary damages…why don’t we just ask him to apologize instead? Typically does the trick.
If you’ve ever stuck gum under a bench, technically you could be facing thousands in fines for defacing public property, and spend time in jail for vandalism.
See how that works?
I’m not advocating stealing signs…and my kid has never been stupid enough to entertain such shenanigans (she’s MUCH more insidious…she volunteers to drive people to the polls) LOL.
But for people who take this kind of nonsense seriously?
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