<p>Yes, and the parents who were counting on promised defined-benefit pensions may have seen the pension plans fail. Just one more thing adding up to needier retiree parents needing support from poorer working age children.</p>
<p>Perhaps families have to go back to the model of the extended family living together, with the retired generation providing day care and baby sitting services to the child generation while the working age generation is earning money to support the family. Indeed, some newer housing developments are built with that in mind – new houses that come with small apartments attached to them for retired grandparents to live in and enable extended family living while giving the retired and working age generations some amount of private space. Grandparents often like to be around the grandchildren anyway…</p>
<p>But that extended family model may not work as well if the elderly generation becomes disabled and dependent, as modern medicine can give years to one’s life, but often in disability and dependency. Then the working age generation gets pretty squeezed…</p>
<p>“Will we be like the kind of parents you are describing? Assuming you had been responsible and devoted parents and had provided what you could for your children, what else do and should your adult children expect from us without being accused of being selfish parents?”</p>
<p>I think for the vast majority of people here on cc, we will not be the selfish parents people are describing. As long as our kids have a realistic picture, and don’t expect that we will all leave them millions. We have loved, coddled, and cherished our kids probably more than any generation in the past…because we can. Hopefully that will play out for the better, not worse.</p>
<p>Good advice from Batllo, NewHope and others to the OP.</p>
<p>We would don’t expect our kids to fund our retirement. With luck, we’re going to help them as they establish an adult life. I joke that our son, if he goes into finance, will buy us an island. When our son was younger, we were talking about buying a second house in the mountains. [Although we looked at some houses, instead of doing so, we took our kids on serious trips each year (Japan, Australia, England, France, Bali, Nicaragua, China, skiing in the Canadian Rockies … ).] But, overhearing one of those discussions, our son said, “When I have a job, I will buy you a house in the mountains.”</p>
<p>We dd not plan on our children supporting us, but frankly I believe that all bets are off going forward.</p>
<p>I think we’ll be fine in retirement, but our finances (invested money) have been stagnant for awhile, and I don’t see that changing. The years of invested money doubling every ten years are long gone, and probably not returning.</p>
<p>My parents were able to happily help extended family members with any requests for tuition money, even self supporting adults. They could afford such generosity even in old age because they were blessed to have earned a solid living, invested well, lived well within their means, and were lucky enough to be part of the “greatest generation”. College was cheap, the economy was strong, compound interest was a term that had meaning. </p>
<p>It is a different world out there today. I can’t imagine being able to offer tuition help to our extended family the way they did.</p>
<p>There is a long history in our family of financially independent seniors. After paying all your bills, you save for your retirement and your kids’ educations - that’s just the way it’s always been. It’s meant living well inside our means without a lot of stuff we’d really like to have. I don’t anticipate needing our kids’ financial help, though if we live long enough we will certainly need their assistance and maybe even management in actual living. But we’ve planned and worked hard to be able to cover the costs. The hard part will be to leave them all a little something, which I would dearly love to do.</p>
<p>Do people become more selfish as they age? I work with seniors every day, and I don’t think so. Aging is not a disposition sweetener, though. Our brains do change, and there’s no escaping biology. We are wired for survival. I think we become more focused on what we think is necessary to keep going, which is why you would never have wanted to find yourself between my grandmother and the bananas at Stop and Shop.</p>
<p>"I think we become more focused on what we think is necessary to keep going, which is why you would never have wanted to find yourself between my grandmother and the bananas at Stop and Shop.’</p>
<p>That is hilarious!</p>
<p>To add onto that one, you definitely don’t want to find yourself between my grandmother and the toilet. Or you will be truly sorry.</p>
Not so sure … in my experience a lot of seniors seem to head to an extreme on some issues. Some become very carefree while others get pretty nasty. Some finally feel free to spend some money while others won’t let go of a dime. Certainly not everyone about everything but most seniors I’m close to went extreme in at least one dimension.</p>
<p>In my experience, things that existed before, but perhaps to a lesser degree, become intensified as people age. </p>
<p>My mother always had some underlying anxiety about particular things, but not to a noticable extent. In her last decade, particularly after my father died, those traits became more pronounced. They weren’t new anxieties or worries, just less suppressed. </p>
<p>I see the same things happening with my inlaws as they age. Quirky personality traits becoming more pronounced.</p>
<p>Actually, I don’t think my parents are selfish. I think they just crave my attention and resent that my kids and husband take up a lot of my attention. They are constantly wanting me to come stay with them (two rooms in a retirement community, no kitchen, one bathroom). They get terribly offended if I stay in a motel instead but I just need time away during my visits to see them. It’s almost as if there’s a sibling rivalry they feel with my spouse and kids.</p>
<p>On the topic of older people becoming selfish…I wonder whether some anxiety develops about outliving savings, so people who were very generous before retirement rein things in a bit when the income becomes fixed. I worry about having enough and I am in my 50s.</p>
<p>I think many of us have concerns about whether we’ll have enough or outlive our savings. I’m in my 50s & H is significantly older. Retirement for him is just around the corner. Tough to count on investments outpacing inflation–may have to stick with real estate and hope that rental values outpace inflation rather than counting on stock market/equities. Tough to know what to rely upon.</p>
<p>You know, I seem to be coming across articles of late that suggest that there can be very inflated notions of what it really will take to live on in retirement. Generally, people travel a good bit at first but that calms down and then expenses are significantly lower. No time to hunt down links to articles right now but there is a suggestion that financial planners and investment houses beat the bushes a lot about how those retiring don’t have enough saved – and for many this is true, of course. But if you think about it, who stands to gain by those mature types still working setting aside ever more into retirement accounts? The investment planners and financial institutions, of course.</p>
<p>There’s a sweet spot for everyone. I seriously doubt my spouse and I will need 80 percent of our current income in retirement. For one thing, right now we are saving close to 30 percent of our income in retirement accounts and various deferred income vehicles. We won’t be doing that in retirement, surely. Then there’s college expenses. We’ve been paying private hs tuition and college for quite awhile now. We won’t be doing that in retirement, either. Have had the conversation with the kids about how we are not footing bill for graduate degrees.</p>
<p>So there will be healthcare costs, certainly. Housing we expect to go down a good deal. Enjoying our relatively large living space now but certainly don’t want it in retirement. </p>
<p>Just not sure we need to be quite so worried.</p>
<p>This is obvious, but bears repeating. The more independently ambulatory and mentally healthy you are in your old age will make a huge difference in retirement costs. My widowed father was fine living on his own in his own home until about age 83, when he started to fall, became confused, lost his driver license, became incontinent and then confined to a wheelchair, which has required round-the-clock assisted living care that has steadily increased in cost over the past 6 years. (Now about $7K per month).</p>
<p>If I had had to take him into my home to care for him, it would be a nearly full-time job. Fortunately he saved enough so that this will not happen, unless he lives past 100 or so.</p>
<p>I was never overly concerned about having enough money for retirement until the past year or so. Then I watched as my dad went through the same path as your dad and my mom decline with dementia. Dad is now in skilled nursing and we are looking into assisted living or personal care for my mom. </p>
<p>I also am the primary person for another couple, one of whom is 88 and the other is 92. They are still living in their home with daily assistance - and this is working right now - but that could change in a flash.</p>
<p>What I NEVER considered is how long someone can live in a very, very fragile state. I am starting to wonder about the wisdom of replacing pacemakers after age 80. Oh dear, that sounds terrible.</p>
<p>Yes, people CAN live a very long time while very medically (& mentally) fragile. Many long term care policies have term limits as well, so this may not provide enough for folks either.</p>
<p>I know a woman who just got a hip replacement–she is 93! She is otherwise pretty healthy & sharp.</p>
<p>I have a great uncle that lived in his own home with his wife & some live-in support until he recently passed away–at 107! His wife passed less than a year later, also north of 100! Don’t know how much care they needed or received.</p>
<p>There are/were at least two residents in my father’s assisted living facility who are 100. Don’t think it can’t happen to you. I think the high quality care provided in some of these places often extends life spans beyond expectation. I wonder sometimes if this is a good thing, I know that sounds terrible, too.</p>
<p>sewhappy, this morning I read an article (and of course now can’t remember where) about just how little many people have saved for retirement. We’re talking people who have only a few thousand dollars, if that. :eek: Whenever I’ve seen numbers on the median values of retirement savings and/or total net worth for people nearing retirement, they’re low. Travelling or otherwise celebrating retirement is going to be financially out of the question for these people. I think this is the population that’s being urged to save more for retirement.</p>
<p>Yes, but many of them may not have all that many options as to how much longer they can retain a job or stay in the workforce, especially if their skillset is limited and demand for their skills shrinks. It is scary how little many have saved toward retirement and I have no idea how what such folks expect to live on or otherwise sustain themselves. The assistance offered by government program is not enough to sustain most in whatever style they may currently be accustomed to, much less pay for expensive medical care as they age.</p>
<p>When people live paycheck to paycheck, many don’t think of being able to save for retirement and have already exhausted their resources.</p>