As Rejections keep rolling in What do you tell your Honor student?

We’ve just gone through something similar and our child DID apply to his first choice (though not his toughest school) early decision. He was deferred and then rejected. Everyone including his college counselor seemed certain he would get in. The parents here have posted wonderful responses, and I’m sure Amusicmomma has said all the right things to her devastated daughter. But none of these responses can easily console a child who has worked so hard, been told they had a good shot at really competitive schools, and then receive one rejection after another.

I hadn’t realized that the college application process had become so much more competitive in recent years. Many of our son’s friends are in the same boat, which doesn’t help with the disappointments but does explain how it happened. More people are applying to college every year, adding more qualified (and similar) candidates to the already massive pool. The schools can’t admit everyone who is qualified. Sometimes it’s something miniscule or remote or even random on an application that helps the admissions officer choose one over another.

I do think, however, that where each of our kids does end up is very important and that the value of those four years should not be under-estimated. They won’t have a chance like this again. But it doesn’t have to be at a prestigious school; it can be anywhere as long as that college makes our child feel welcomed and valued. I wanted our child to get into his top choices because he wanted it; but deep down, my one concern all along has been finding a place where he will be happy. And there are so many schools that will offer this.

Nicely said, Nina22. Nicely said!

This tread really has my head spinning. My d is a junior, she is forming the list of schools she is interested in (Leaning towards small/mid liberal arts in the Northeast) But it seems that everything is a “reach” because even if on paper it is a match (to gpa, sat scores, etc.) the competitive high application rate/few acceptances makes it a reach. She really doesn’t want a huge university, but I’m thinking it may be something she has to consider.

SO sorry and I’m thinking some of this is a crap shoot. My son got waitlisted at UC Davis, got into UCLA and got into the spring 2014 at Berkeley. Confusing. Hopefully, she can choose a good community college and continue to work/volunteer in the direction she wants to go and reapply. SO many kids seem to take this route for financial reasons as well as other reasons. Also, does she have some safe schools? Perhaps explain to her that being a big fish in a small pond has advantages.

So true. So many kids are told they should only go to Ivy League schools. So false; there are great schools everywhere. Also, she can appeal decisions. Perhaps if she shows a school or two her determination, it will help move her forward. A friend’s son hated the school he was in, came home for the summer and started pushing other schools. GOt waitlisted at Weslyan and every day sent them another letter of recommendation, a plea, etc and finally got in! Persevere.

@Massmomtothree

Actually, your D is in a very good spot. You should definitely use ED (early decision) to your advantage. However, there is a very big caveat. Can you afford it if your D get into one of these prestigious but very expensive LAS (that is, if the financial aid does not come through).

All my D’s friends who applied ED to small Northeast LAS’s got in (100%).
These includes Williams, Amherst, Swarthmore, and Wellesley.
These kids are very small subset of her friends - most of her other friends want national schools. :slight_smile:

My son recently got rejected from harvard. he ended up at a technical college and could not be happier, I think the ivies are sort of a scam in addition to lowering students self confidence.Tell your dauter that there are many great schools, just pick the most prestigious one of the schools she gets into.

“I hadn’t realized that the college application process had become so much more competitive in recent years.”

Last year, of colleague of mine went back to Brown for her 30th anniversary. During the welcoming speech, the Dean jokingly told the class that none of them would have gotten into Brown today - it may be an exaggeration but there is certain kernel of truth to that.

“But it doesn’t have to be at a prestigious school; it can be anywhere as long as that college makes our child feel welcomed and valued.”

I certainly concur with the sentiment. However, I would add that they should be at a place where they are challenged intellectually and academically. Yes, rigorous schools can be found anywhere in the US and not just at the Ivies. Nonetheless, I know enough about US universities to know that many of them are just not that rigorous. I was clueless in high school (to this day, my mom swore that, in high school, I went to bed every night at 9pm). Then I was fortunately enough to go to a flagship state school in the Midwest (on the side note, I don’t think I have a remote chance of being admitted these days given my SAT/GPA). There, I developed a work habit that still serves me well 25 years into my career.

Ok Amusicmomma, catch-us-up, where did she get in?

Dealing with the rejection when you’ve worked hard for a goal is incredibly difficult. But who led kids to believe it would work out? It’s not about hard work, it’s about being special. You can’t always work hard to be special. In some cases, working hard will create a special person, but it’s a gamble. Lower acceptance rates create the illusion that acceptance itself is an accomplishment. It’s not. The best analogy is when you’re going to play baseball and you need to pick sides. Were the kids who got picked first the hardest workers? Unlikely. Have they won the game by virtue of being picked first? No. The game hasn’t even started yet.

Another thing that may reassure people dealing with rejection from the Ivies is to know that in the real world, there are a lot of very successful people who hold a bias against hiring people from top schools, and for a very good reason. They understand that if you treat your acceptance as an accomplishment, you’re unlikely to accomplish anything. All of this is explained beautifully in Loren Pope’s Looking Beyond the Ivy League. Clearly more people need to read it before their kids get to the point of heartbreak. But it’s never too late to figure out the game.

@eclpts
Agree! Will have to tell my students, the game hasn’t started yet. I will have to get that book too. As someone said earlier, it is a 26.2 mile marathon and it is only at the 2 mile mark, and there is another 24.2 miles to go. Sometimes kids can’t see that far. However we adults can help them to see further.

I suggest for those reading this and applications are ahead. Know what you are up against - and do the reverse. Apply to states that are losing population ~ LAC’s in Ohio, Michigan, etc. At our Virginia high school (populous metro DC) our students - at all levels - do much better out-of-state. UVA takes only 30 of 500 collegebound from our HS. There is just no room.

Here’s a dose of reality. Almost every applicant to the very top schools is outstanding in many ways. Each school has a responsibility to admit a well balanced group of students who can learn from each other, become adults together, develop skills in communicating with different kinds of people, and learn about the world at large through each other.

So, if MIT has 500 asian boys who played first violin in their city IB high schools, were raised in upper middle class homes by college educated parents, and had all A’s and high scores on SAT’s, and they only have 1100 spots, it behooves MIT to find a way to admit the best of that bunch and the best of lots of different types of bunches of students as well as a lot of one-offs, so that the admitted students can not just meet themselves coming and going but have that full college experience of getting to know themselves through getting to know the world.

That doesn’t mean that the other students admitted instead of the majority of those well cared for violin playing asian boys are not well qualified. It simply means that MIT has a ton of well qualified kids to choose from and is going to choose a diverse group of kids so that the experience of the kids who are chosen is richer and so the benefits of an MIT education is spread further and deeper.

So, if you play an unusual African musical instrument and you’re a tightrope walker, and you were educated by Tibetan monks until age twelve and then lived in the Yukon through tenth grade before heading down to Wyoming to finish off school with your ranching cousins, you might be picked over someone with similar grades and scores who grew up playing tennis and going to cotillion dances in Philadephia with a banker father, a stay at home mom and a little sister who dances ballet.

In other words, don’t take it personally and don’t become outraged if you’re not chosen. MIT chooses not to accept thousands of excellent students every year. They only have so much room.

Another factor might be interviews. A lot of schools don’t require interviews but offer them. A very boring but polite white valedictorian boy with an engineer father and a nurse mother from Texas might lose out to a gregarious kid who didn’t take a single IB or AP class but who was obsessed with robotics and taught himself to take apart and put together motorcycles when he was ten while his mom worked all night at the convenience store. His SAT’s were within the acceptable range required despite having less academic opportunity and support than the other kid, but it was his passion and ability to suck people into his world that hooked the admissions committee onto him instead of onto the “safe” kid. In truth, the robotics kid might be a better bet because he did what he did in spite of lack of all the usual support. How would the boring kid have turned out in the same circumstances? So, the robotics kid might be more talented and successful after all. This is where an interview might help some and hurt others. It’s not just what is on paper. If you really connect with the interviewer instead of just politely answer questions, you’ve got a big advantage over a kid with the same things on paper but an inability to connect with the interviewer.

I’ve read a lot of stories about kids who felt they had followed the formula to get into MIT but didn’t. Some were bitter, some were angry, and some were devastated. But, they were in good company–not alone at all. This is part of why no college admissions coach can truthfully guarantee admission to any particular school. If there were two of those robotics guys, maybe only one of them would get in. Diversity of interests and background is as important to some schools as racial and other diversity types of diversity are.

Another factor is your presentation of your credentials and so on. Did you take great advantage of the opportunity to build an amazing extracurricular resume, pointing out where you did anything extraordinary? Just filling in the blanks won’t cut it. Did your references really know and connect with you, or did they barely know you because you were quiet in the back of the room?

It’s not about whether a kid was good enough for the school. It’s a matter of the committee picking a group of kids who will interact with each other and support each other’s development in the best possible manner to promote the goals MIT sets out to achieve in the world and for itself as an institution.

Also, if a kid doesn’t get in, it’s possible that it’s mostly due to the school not being a good fit for them. A kid who fits well into Harvard is likely not to fit well into Caltech. So, be glad if you are not accepted into a school that would not be a good fit for you. That means that you won’t be in a place that seemed great on paper or the internet but that would be just miserable for you because your personality is a better fit for a different school.

When my son was in public school before running out of math and science, I got to know one of his classmates and her mom. The girl ended up being valedictorian of that school. She assumed that because my son and another girl were expected to and did get into Ivy League and other top national universities, that she would naturally do so also. But, she didn’t. She got into the state flagship school that is well ranked nationally and was offered a half scholarship. She refused to go to college as a result. She felt humiliated. She was going to keep applying to the same schools till she got in with a full scholarship, doing little until that time came. That’s when I had a talk with her. I asked her if she wanted me to help her and she agreed. I told her I might hurt her feelings but I was going to be blunt. She was a good little girl type student. She used a little girl voice, agreed with everything adults said to her, did everything the schoo told her to do, and did nothing unique, held no leadership positions, and initiated nothing on her own. I told her to stop using that little girl voice and use a woman’s voice, to stop agreeing with everything and say what she meant, to stop following instructions so well and do something unique, to stop covering up her family hardship and start describing their journey and her role in helping the family stay afloat, and to recontact one of her interviewers (with my getting his permission first) and ask him to help her set up a science project in his area of interest that she can complete at home (since she didn’t have transportation) and to also start as Spanish language tutoring program for recent immigrant kids from Mexico, and so on and so forth. I told her what her life would be if she sat on her hands and waited for someone to accept her as she was when they didn’t before. I told her to grow, to do, to say, and to be all that she could be in the months until the next wave of applications were due. I coached her in developing and describing her goals and showing progress toward them. Long story short, she got into Brown, Cornell, and University of Chicago and chose to go to Cornell on a full scholarship. Yes, she went a year late, and this wasn’t on her list the first go round. But, she is happier than ever there and has stated that she’s glad she went through that year of challenge and discovery, of transformation to get to where she is now. By the way, I suggested that she say that she took a gap year to help her parents and sister resettle in Mexico and to grow as a person. She actually did do that but not initially for that reason.

I am not suggesting that students who don’t get into their favorite schools should take a year off and try again. That’s an option. The point is that there can be reasons other than academics that you don’t get in, and it can be a blessing. I think it’s easier to get in after a very productive gap year than to transfer, so consider that if you’re up for a risk and think it’s worth it. The risk is that you won’t get in the second time and may lose heart, be disconnected from your class, and never really get on track academically at the level where you can learn the most. I handled this girl this way because she refused to go to the state university at all. So this was a recovery project. It helped tremendously that the Ivy League interviewer advised her on which schools to apply to, gave her a reference regarding her project, gave her her project in fact, and otherwise supported her efforts. I basically told her “It’s now or never, so do this right if you’re ever going to do it.” She responded well to instruction, so she did it.

I know another kid who went to a summer program with all kids who were bound for top, top schools but didn’t get into any. He responded by heading to the local university who knew him from high school when he’d go there for science projects and finished his degree in two years, going to grad school two years early to start his Ph.D. studies–at an Ivy League school. He said that if had gone to MIT immediately, he probably would not have been mature enough to avoid the temptations and distractions but grew up a lot in those two years at home.

There are many paths to greatness.

AlwaysNAdventure, post of the year.

^^^ Truly excellent!

AlwaysNAdventure, so true - can’t tell you how many people I know who went to obscure undergrad colleges and went on to ivy league grad schools. I know one who went to a CA state college and then got a free ride through an exclusive Dartmouth masters program that only accepts a handful of students; another who went to a 2nd tier LAC after being rejected from William & Mary and then went on to earn his PhD from Princeton and have a great career in cancer research… and many more than I have time to recount here.

I had to chime is as well. My D was rejected from all 6 of the Top 25 schools she applied to (extremely rigorous schedule, good grades and a 2360 on the SAT!). Her GPA and SAT’s were near the top of the acceptance ranges for Stanford, Duke, etc. We were shocked and she was very disappointed…at first. Fortunately, she got great academic scholarship offers and Honors program admission offers from her backups and took a full scholarship offer from an out-of-state flagship university. It has ended up being a great fit for her and she has had a great first-year experience. The school had so much to offer in a many different areas, and she has taken full advantage of it. So much depends on the attitude of the student and the parents going forward. She is optimistic by nature, and after the initial crushing disappointment passed, she focused on the many wonderful opportunities she would have at her chosen school and never looked back. Just be positive and supportive and I’m sure everything will work our for your student. Just because a school didn’t make the top 20 or 30 on some magazine’s top colleges list, doesn’t mean it’s not a great school!

@AlwaysNAdventure, kudos for changing someone’s life! What a great story and outcome!

Davidg - sometimes it’s not us parents pressuring our kids to go to the elite schools. My husband and I both attended Big 10 State Schools and have done just fine in our careers. My son decided several years ago that he was intent on attending an elite school and somehow settled on MIT. He became obsessed with getting in and did everything in his power to make it happen. - I knew it was a long shot and a crap shoot. I struggled with giving him the right dose of support tempered with realism, knowing his chances were slim, due to the number of applications MIT receives.

When the rejection letter finally came, it was still sad for me to watch him deal with it. He is doing fine, settling in to the realization that he will be in the Honors program at a Big 10 State School. I know he will do fine and firmly believe he will ultimately be happier for the reasons you state -

I think he may have been over his head academically at MIT, not to mention surrounded by people with money, and far from home. Still, it is difficult to watch your child receive rejection when you know others with lower ACT scores and lower GPAs do get in. I am in recruiting (not college) so I know there is more to selection that a few numbers, but when the selection process is personal, it is difficult to understand.