“The only people eligible would be those aged 18 or over in England or Wales who have received a terminal diagnosis and been told they have no more than six months to live. Lethal drugs would have to be self-administered, and two doctors and a judge would have to approve the decision.”
Seems like a reasonable enough approach.
I don’t think so. From the opening anecdote:
Sarah Tarlow had a sense that something was wrong as soon as she opened her front door and called out to her bedridden husband upstairs. There was no reply. Instead of the sound of the radio that normally echoed from his room, the house was engulfed in silence. Unable to move his legs, incontinent, his eyesight failing, without any sense of taste or smell, her partner of more than two decades, Mark Pluciennik, had taken a lethal drug overdose. Because it is illegal in Britain to help someone die by suicide, Mr. Pluciennik, who suffered from an undiagnosed neurological illness, chose one of his wife’s rare absences, in May 2016, to take his own life, protecting Ms. Tarlow from possible prosecution. But that meant dying completely alone.
This man’s situation would not be covered by the proposed legislation.
Ok, so what are your limits?
I’m not a lawmaker or philosopher, so I don’t have a firm opinion. Off the top of my head, I’d say more toward the max (but not without limits) on the continuum. There are countries and states that have had assisted-dying laws for several years. If I had to make an informed decision about where to draw the line, I would study what’s going on in those places.
This feels like an appropriate topic for the politics forum.
I’m not sure why this has to be political.
It’s a complicated topic. Last year I read this book… heavy stuff. American couple, where husband wanted the described Swiss option (non-profit Dignitas)
excerpt from link
In multiple interviews with Dignitas personnel, Brian must prove that he is cogent enough to show “discernment and determination.” The couple know that if they wait too long, he will no longer be capable of passing this test. They hit an upsetting delay when they learn that Brian’s neurologist had written on the MRI report that the reason for the test was a “major depressive episode.” Depression is a deal-breaker for Dignitas, which does not want to be in the business of helping clinically depressed people commit suicide. Brian and Bloom have to prove that the neurologist’s note is simply not true.
More than 20 years ago I wrote a paper for school about dignity for dying humans. We are so compassionate about ensuring our animals are taken care of at the end of their life in a dignified manner, but don’t do the same for humans.
I do support dignified death.
Another subject I believe should be between the patient, their family/loved ones, and their doctor.
The religion in which I grew up used to teach that taking one’s own life was a mortal sin, full stop. There could be no requiem Mass or hope for the soul of the departed. That stance has changed and more compassion is shown now. However, whether or not some teachings are official there are still many, including clergy, nuns and lay teachers, who continue to promulgate old ways of thinking. That complicates the question of one’s right to die for some.
The other teaching that makes this issue complex from a faith POV, at least for practicing Catholics, is that suffering brings one closer to God. If we suffer, for any reason, and “offer it up” (I can’t count how many times nuns told me that), we reduce our time in Purgatory and gain Heaven sooner. Again, this isn’t official but it’s still been taught in Catholic schools and religious education classes.
For quite a few years, I prayed that my father would die because I loved him dearly and hated that he was suffering. Even if offering up suffering made sense to me, he was not capable of doing that thanks to Alzheimer’s. If I could have hastened his death I would have done so, out of compassion and love.
H and I have had multiple conversations about how we do and do not want to die. In case there are no other options available when the time comes, I have taken steps including stockpiling Rx pain meds. Seeing three of our four parents suffer with various types of dementia causes us some concern for our own prospects. I don’t want to wait until a doctor decides I have only six months to live due to some other medical condition, especially after witnessing my father’s years of suffering. I don’t want to put my loved ones through that, and I see no redeeming value in it for myself. H feels the same way. Neither of us is in any hurry. I just hope we can arrange things so that the surviving spouse is not placed under any suspicion.
While it can be a political issue, it is one that underneath it all goes deeply into issues like religious belief and what human dignity means. Limiting assisted dying to someone who has a terminal illness that is expected to kill them in 6 months can sound reasonable (and it is to me), but that leaves out a lot. Some assisted suicide laws allow someone who is diagnosed with incurable depression to end their life, and that is a lot harder to me personally, that maybe the problem is our mental and physical health care systems are failing people and what is incurable depression may just be the system fails too many people (and that is simply my gut feeling, shows my skepticism of how health care is done; and it is very possible that some people are so depressed there is nothing anyone can do). Where the law mentioned fails is what about someone with ALS, that is going to see decline over time that is going to take away so much, or Alzheimers and other forms of dementia, that can take years. What if someone wants to end their life on their own terms so they don’t experience the decline those insidious diseases inflict on them? What is someone wants to die with dignity?
Someone mentioned a common belief of some religious systems, that human beings are supposed to suffer, that suffering either is part of some cosmic plan or something that brings them closer to God or whoever. Life has suffering in it, it is part of being mortal, I get that, we lose loved ones, we fight depression, some of us fight addictions, or have painful conditions we deal with every day. The thing is that there can be suffering that is beyond what a person can face, where they don’t want to have to go through that, and like everything in life, what one person can suffer through another person may not be able to, do we deny the latter the right to end it with dignity? Should one religious or other philosophy deny someone else what they see as a dignified end?
I am troubled by things I have read about, like the Swiss company that has created this suicide module for being wanting to end it. I think laws like the OP posted are a good first step, but I think the law has to examine the factors around assisted suicide and decide maybe sensible safeguards that prevent someone who merely is dealing with a bad moment from killing themselves legally, like counseling to make sure that this is just a temporary blip (likewise a reasonable waiting period is not a bad idea, unless the person has a terminal disease and is already miserable, or has degeneration where there is no prognosis other than further degeneration).
One of the problems I have with the moral ideas against suicide is that it totally ignores dignity, in my experience it goes beyond that and tells you there is dignity in suffering, which I don’t believe at all. We euthenize our companion animals when they are suffering because we want them to be at peace, and they cannot make that decision. My thought is why should someone who is dying or has a long term prognosis of degeneration and decline not have the right to choose when to go to maintain their dignity? In a system of law that is supposed to allow people the right to determine their own path, why should the law step in in situations like this and not allow someone to determine their own version of death with dignity? Especially when it is influenced by religious belief that suicide is always a mortal sin (among other things, that there are religious beliefs that don’t feel assisted suicide in cases of suffering is a sin). That doesn’t mean like in Kurt Vonnegut (I forget the story) where people can ask to be euthenized (I think it was Welcome to the Monkey House) for any reason they want, there needs to be guardrails to make sure that it is what they really wish and that it isn’t in a moment of despair.
Anyway, my thoughts, and it doesn’t mean people who believe differently are wrong, this has a lot of gray areas, even to myself. On the other hand, in a world of differing beliefs I think at least in terms of the state, we have to be careful to not trample on the rights of people to decide what living with dignity means and not impose the ideas of one group of people, even a majority, over the others while not creating a free for all either.
Sometimes it creates a real conundrum, where you see people who say the government interferes too much in people’s lives supporting efforts to repeal or have courts nullify assisted suicide laws that is probably one of the biggest decisions a human being can make about themselves.
Again, this is not me saying anyone’s beliefs are wrong, these are just my thoughts on the subject, how I have tried to see it (and it evolves over time, as I see things that create gray areas or where i am not sure).
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