<p>Relative to the rise of the value of assets of families in the top quintile of the population, until two years ago, prestige private colleges were the cheapest they had been in 35 years. They are still way underpriced, as can easily be seen by the massive and continuing increase in the number of applicants, and the continued willingness of families to go into hock for them.</p>
<p>I expect that, given current asset values, arounnd $75-80k per year would begin to bend the curve. We’ll never find out, though, as the colleges collude each other to “warm the water slowly”, and the frogs continue to jump in.</p>
<p>My alma mater, #1 LAC, claims they spend $80k a year to educate students. (I don’t believe it for a minute.) But if it is as they say, I would much prefer them to charge what it costs to folks who can afford it, and stop using my measly alumni contribution to subsidize millionaires’ kids, and give it to those who really need it.</p>
<p>(not in my lifetime - the school is, after all, made for millionaires’ kids.)</p>
<p>The number of applicants is not relevant, as students must apply to learn whether, and how much, financial aid they get. The numer to watch is how many are accepted with little or no aid and choose not to go. That number is rising. The upper-middle is already priced out.</p>
Has this number increased? I guess the question is, how many are serious and not treating the school as a safety school.</p>
<p>My kid is at our state flagship instead of full pay at a top 15 school because we couldn’t/chose not to be full-pay. He loves it there and doesn’t regret the missed chance. Will he/we regret it 10 years down the road? We’ll see.</p>
<p>Prices aren’t going to moderate until the easy availability of student loans is eliminated. A good start would be restoring the ability to discharge them in bankruptcy.</p>
<p>Toblin, $200k/year is far from “super rich” in many cities in the U.S. My family makes more than that and we live an extremely middle class lifestyle, but much of that is because we are frugal/savers. I know of some families which take in $150k and don’t save at all. Now that’s something! I read a while ago about how millionaires are the people you would never expect from their lifestyle. Young money runs out fast.</p>
<p>Unfortunately, there will never be a “one size fits all” EFC calculator that is fair to everyone. I think schools should rely on their own methods, rather than using the cop out of “Ooooooh, well we meet 100% of the need that’s demonstrated!”</p>
<p>Yeah, Vandy, they can. I for one would never expect my parents to forfeit their ENTIRE RETIREMENT for the marginal benefit of a top private school, and I don’t think I’d do it for my kids either! How many people do you think would? Economics is usually a question of how much, rather than “yes” or “no”</p>
<p>@ OP: 50k already strains budgets. I think state schools have recently attracted a lot of students who would have chosen top20 schools if the money was right. I don’t think Ivies are necessarily impacted so much as the non-Ivy private schools that charge 50k but don’t have the endowments to help out the majority of admitted students. </p>
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<p>Should the parents rely on meager Social Security benefits or just live out their retirement in poverty?</p>
<p>My kids go to public school in a county with a lot of professional families. The really rich ones go to private school. The top achievers at the public school tend to be from achievement-oriented, financially comfortable families. Most of them don’t qualify for a lot of need-based aid but their families are not, however, rolling in it.</p>
<p>Every year, at graduation, the principal calls the names of the top 10% of students–about 50 kids–and which college they plan to attend. Four years ago, there were a fair # of kids going to Duke, MIT, Dartmouth, Cornell, Wake Forest, Northwestern, and so on. Last year, the valedictorian got a full merit scholarship at USC, and virtually every other kid the top 10% was attending either UVA, our state flagship, or William and Mary. The only exceptions were going to the local CC, which has an articulation agreement with UVA.</p>
<p>It’s a combination, I think, of tuition rising, and of the recession making families more risk-averse and loan-phobic. But it’s not entirely a recent a phenomenon; as a faculty member at UVA, I’ve seen the quality of our students rising dramatically over the last 15 years or so. The downside is that lots of solid instate students now can’t get in.</p>
<p>Right now, the flagships are great options for upper middle class families. But with dramatic cuts in state support looming, they may not be great options for long. It will be interesting to see how all this plays out over the next decade or so.</p>
<p>Vandy, the parents need a retirement fund. However, your math is kind of off. 1. you forgot the taxes! Let’s say the government, state, local, federal, property, probably adds up to (and I’m being verrry conservative here) 1/4 of the income: now you are down to 60,000, and let’s assume 2 kids, so you’d have to save 20,000 per year of that, which leaves you with 40,000. Now, let’s add car insurance, health insurance, etc…</p>
<p>I don’t think your math is gonna work on this one ;)</p>
<p>As somebody already noted, until the student loan is allowed to be discharged in bankruptcy courts, the schools will continue to recieve financial aid from the students who borrow. The prices will continue to go up.</p>
<p>There may have been small changes in the past year or two (though, statistically, I seriously doubt it, not with applications hitting their highest point at the time the economy was at its worst.) I know it has serious impacted community college admissions (though it is still more difficult to get into the nursing program at South Puget Sound Community College than into Yale.) But 35 years, most people didn’t dream of applying to prestige private colleges and universities. Now, the gates are wide open, and costs are too low to stop the flood of applications.</p>
<p>**Quote:
Middle class families can actually afford Ive League Schools if they save early. A 80k a year family can save 10,000 a year. 10,000 * 18= 180,000. If a college is 50k a year, a student will only have to take out 20,000 in loans if the family doesnt save more. That amount can be easily paid off if you make over 70k a year, which most graduates of these schools will most likely make. **</p>
<p>I’m guessing that a family that makes 80K today didn’t make anywhere near that when the little darling was born.</p>
<p>And even if saving the $180K is doable, parting with it come September is another story.</p>
<p>There is a point in the income/asset level where need-based financial aid doesn’t seem like real aid, but is instead loans and work-study.</p>
<p>At that level, the parent (me, included), says:</p>
<p>My child is not getting into ivy-level schools, so all of that “no-loan, we help everyone under $200K income” doesn’t apply, AND</p>
<p>I am at the point where, with an EFC of 45-55,000, everyone with less money than me gets help, while I have to pay the same as Bill Gates. In other words, there is a sliding scale up to the EFC 50,000 point, at which it flatlines, since schools don’t charge any more than that.</p>
<p>Therefore, it all seems unfair, and I run to the merit-aid private or the state school. And my child, for whom a school like Bucknell or Colgate would have been a match, is at a third-tier LAC or a state flagship.</p>
<p>That happens to everyone at most schools with need-based aid. Loans are the biggest part of financial aid at most schools, which is why chasing merit aid opportunities is so important. Just because you have a low EFC doesn’t mean that the school will match it with anything better than a nice, fat Parent PLUS loan (which is almost the same as matching it by offering to let the parent wander around the building picking up pennies).</p>
<p>Just not our experience. We had a relatively low EFC and were treated well (though not equally well) everywhere. We took out no loans ourselves, and the kids ended up with quite manageable amounts of skin in the game.</p>
<p>I never thought I would say this but after seeing the difference between the course work and grades at our state college and that of the upper tier universities I would spend all the money on the private upper tier schools all over again. My daughter attends the state U and she has barely needed to crack open a book and she has a high GPA with a full credit load. Compare her work to the work that was required at any of my sons schools and it is laughable. I must say you get what you pay for.</p>
<p>I agree 100 percent!!! With above comment,you DO get what you pay for…though I do believe by having that opinion,we are touching the " Third Rail",lol</p>
<p>"Personally, I imagine that families in the 150k-250k income bracket will flock toward less prestigious schools where their children will get merit aid, as well as encourage community college transfers and trade schools. Spending $250k on an undergrad education is just absurd. "</p>
<p>-Agree. My D. has been on full tuition Merit scholarship at state UG. She could have chosen to go to Harvard as such as she has graduted #1 in her HS class. Going to Med. School next year (have choices of 4, couple in top 20, did not decide yet). She is going to be there with some kids who went to elite schools and who either accumulated debt or depleted family resources for their education. We are planning to foot D’s Med. School bill because we did not have to pay tuition in UG. We are in the bracket above.</p>