<p>From what I’ve heard…factor in the cost of couples therapy to the bottom line of the remodel costs.</p>
<p>Just sayin’…</p>
<p>;-)</p>
<p>busdriver, as an old house lover I can tell you that they are often MUCH better built than new houses. Our last house in CT was a post and beam built in 1790. My current house was originally built in the 1880s, partially burned down in 1913 and rebuilt immediately.</p>
<p>I love the look of the older houses, and how they are so solid. Many houses today look very cheap and the wood has a fake look to it, even in pricier homes.</p>
<p>But I would be concerned about the things I don’t know could go wrong, that generally would not be an issue with newer houses. The hidden hazards like radon gas, asbestos, foundation cracks, lead pipes and paint, poor wiring. Some of these beautiful old hotels that I stay at…that always seem to have that musty smell about them, I wonder about what kind of mold issues and termite problems they have. I think if you buy a very old home, you’d have to be pretty knowledgeable and get a highly qualified inspector.</p>
<p>Busdriver: cross posted with you :)</p>
<p>Another old house fan here. I need to live in something old to be comfortable.</p>
<p>Busdriver, they last forever, if they are cared for properly. You definitely have a sense of the issues involved. In my opinion, it is a life style choice.</p>
<p>I wondered if VeryHappy would tell us more about the farmhouse. If I am considering a house of that date: first I check the foundation. How are the sills? What about the stone the sill sits on? (I have been in cellars where the stones were missing all mortar and were falling out into the cellar. The structural engineer couldn’t get out fast enough) If additions were added to the original structure (post and beam?) were they adequately supported? How many lally poles? bug damage? I’m okay with powder post beetles but termites need some consideration depending on extent of damage. I want to be able to see everything above my head in the cellar, all the supports and framing. If someone has put up sheet rock or fiberboard or something else - I’m very suspicious. I check for damp and mold. and rot. I prefer an original dirt floor myself. Asbestos? If the house has a crawl space instead of a cellar (rare in CT, I think?) it still has to all be checked out.</p>
<p>I have the chimneys inspected. If it is a center chimney house that is also part of the structural support. I prefer chimneys that have not been “modernized” with liners, but that is a personal thing. I prefer to have them repointed or rebuilt. Mainly I don’t want the house to fall down or catch on fire. creosote can be a problem… the bigger the chimney the less a potential problem.</p>
<p>Walls: original plaster? I want it! However - what is going on behind the plaster? Can you be sure of date of wiring? Even if the box is relatively new, there may be some of that cloth-wrapped wiring. Who knows the answer and can tell you? What about insulation? again - there may be some nasty stuff. What about the pipes? maybe iron? which I have discovered doesn’t necessarily last forever. How do you find out? If the plaster has been replaced with sheet rock, it should be possible to find out when the renovation was done and what was done. Someone, somewhere has records.</p>
<p>I try my best to determine if there are underground oil tanks. Sometimes they were just left in place years ago when the system was changed. ditto abandoned wells.</p>
<p>roof: cedar shakes used to last a life time, these days not so much in my experience</p>
<p>windows: original? I want them! Do they need work? What about storms - original wooden ones? I want them, but again, do they need work?<br>
or replacement? what shape are they in and will they need work?</p>
<p>siding? original - okay I could go on forever, and a very long time before ever considering kitchen or bathrooms. </p>
<p>It makes financial sense to buy someone else’s renovation/restoration, if you can find one that pleases you. I am 19 months into what was supposed to be a six month project. And I really did think I knew what I was getting into, since I’ve done it before.</p>
<p>
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<p>Financially, where are you compared to where you thought you’d be? On par? 20% above? 50% above? Just be quiet and stop asking??</p>
<p>VeryHappy - Happy to share with you but not telling any friends or relatives, no matter how many times they ask :)</p>
<p>Right now we are almost double what we had originally budgeted. Fortunately, I had anticipated this happening and found a project that was much, much less than we could afford. It is not because we added any extras to the original plans that we are so over. The first contractors may have finished it on budget, but were cutting so many corners to get there we had to fire them, after consultation with our attorney. In the process I learned that some contractors sometimes finish a project with the deposit from their next project. In a very bad economy, where there is no next project, this can put the contractor in an uncomfortable position. I had paid them too much up-front. They came highly recommended by close friends and I trusted them. The second contractor really overcharged us to get it to a point finished enough to move in because I was going absolutely bonkers living in a brand new condo, which was beautiful (wood floors, granite counters) but not my cup of tea. The project probably could have been done on budget if I had had the contacts at the beginning of this project that I do now, but we were very new to the area. Now I am working with a wonderful wonderful crew who are extremely reasonable. There is just no telling what it will all cost by the time we are done, but I love this house and property.</p>
<p>This was a huge project: foundation jacked up and sills repaired, new addition for non existent kitchen and baths, chimneys taken down and rebuilt from original brick, windows restored, old plaster removed (couldn’t be saved) wiring and insulation installed and new plaster put up, lots of original exterior architectural detail (it’s a fancy house!) duplicated to replace lost bits. on and on and on</p>
<p>I promise I won’t share that info with anyone who knows you!</p>
<p>But that really is scary . . . . </p>
<p>I don’t know if we’re going to go ahead with the house our heart is telling us to buy, based on the location and potential. My head is pretty stubborn and logical, and I don’t want to get into a situation where we’ve spent considerably more than was planned.</p>
<p>And we’ve walked away from the 1812 farmhouse. It was obvious, even to us, that there were issues, so who knows what issues were hidden. We’ll let someone else find out. :)</p>
<p>The 1900 house is still a contender, however. And it would need a two-story addition, then a new kitchen and bathrooms.</p>
<p>“The 1900 house is still a contender, however. And it would need a two-story addition, then a new kitchen and bathrooms.”</p>
<p>So, the cost of the remodel is $200,000+?</p>
<p>Perhaps. I’ll be getting more info later this week. I suspect it’s less, but we’ll see.</p>
<p>I know that 1900’s house has some character…but if it needs a two story addition and new kitchen and baths…it sounds like the NEW parts are the essentials. I guess what I’m
saying is that if that is the case, why would newer houses not be a consideration.</p>
<p>We put a 2-story addition onto this house. It matches the architecture of the original mid 19th c structure. Some visitors have argued with me about its date. They are sure it must be original to the house. This makes our architect so very happy 
Inside the new addition are the first ever (inside) kitchen and bathrooms. I don’t like plumbing in an original antique structure (worried about moisture damage) and welcomed the opportunity to undertake a project where it all was consolidated in new construction.</p>
<p>If you decide to undertake the project, start a thread and we’ll have a great time.</p>
<p>edit: VH - here is my unscientific rule of thumb for old houses. Any kind of renovation costs twice per sq ft what new construction would. Adding a 2 story addition will equal the cost of a starter house.</p>
<p>edit: if you do high end kitchen and baths - it will cost more than a starter home. imho Mine used materials salvaged from another similar date house in the area that couldn’t be saved. That part of the project was labor intensive but not particularly expensive.</p>
<p>edit: VH - you may be much smarter about all this than I have been. I was definitely not the best site supervisor.</p>
<p>alh, my only experience has been to upgrade a 1967 kitchen to a 1999 kitchen. I strongly doubt that I’m “smarter about all this than [you] have been.”</p>
<p>Thumper, DH wants houses that are quirky, have charm, are different. The four bedroom 1962 house we saw yesterday (that had kind of risen to the top of my list because it didn’t need anything but new wallpaper, painting, etc.) did nothing for him. If it were up to me, we’d be moving to a condo, but he refuses.</p>
<p>I am really bad about giving unsolicited advice. This site is sometimes a blessing because it channels that compulsion away from family and friends. Having said that:</p>
<p>If you and H have been bitten by the old house bug - I have a strong recommendation that you approach buying in a different way. Decide what period or range of periods you would be interested in and expand your geographic area. Before I bought in CT (the house sold to finance this project) I looked at 18th c places from one end of metro north to the other. It helped me to see what was out there and to compare prices. It ALWAYS makes financial sense to buy someone else’s renovation if you can find one to fall in love with. Think about whether you prefer being in an antique in an historic neighborhood or in a rural setting. Or will you be happy with the one old house on a street where all the other homes were built much more recently. Please find out if the local historic commission will dictate what you do to your house. I refuse to buy in such a situation but many of my friends do. I think that always makes a project more expensive and stressful.</p>
<p>I would be amazed if you couldn’t find an antique, renovated to your standards, in move-in condition in an area you could enjoy. At your price. In my experience - once you start looking- the owners may start coming back to you with a better price, etc. It is a very specialized market, sometimes lacking serious buyers. Many back out after inspections.</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.historicproperties.com/results.asp[/url]”>http://www.historicproperties.com/results.asp</a></p>
<p>There is a CT page, but I can’t get it to link.</p>
<p><a href=“Historic Homes For Sale, Rent or Auction - OldHouses.com”>Historic Homes For Sale, Rent or Auction - OldHouses.com;
<p><a href=“http://www.historical-home.com/2010/11/historical-antique-real-estate-property.html[/url]”>http://www.historical-home.com/2010/11/historical-antique-real-estate-property.html</a></p>
<p>apologies if your realtor has already given you these sites</p>
<p>veryhappy
</p>
<p>About $2,000/year based on a house selling for $600K that’s in a flood zone.</p>
<p>You might want to consider looking in Litchfield County, or in towns like Sherman. A quick trip to Brewster for the train into the city from there…</p>
<p>I think VeryHappy should buy the lighthouse: [Find</a> a Home - Property Listing](<a href=“http://www.historicproperties.com/detail.asp?detail_key=Nefai003]Find”>http://www.historicproperties.com/detail.asp?detail_key=Nefai003) ;)</p>
<p>^^^OMG, mathmom, how did you find that??!!! If I show it to DH, I’m in trouble.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>OK, I’ll bite: What’s rip-rap?</p>
<p>No idea what rip-rap is, but that doesn’t sound too good. Maybe they mean riff-raff? Which sounds even worse.</p>
<p>Our best house purchases have been by buying homes built by builders for themselves and/or homes renovated by builders for themselves. There’s just a whole different level of quality that builders put into homes they intend to live in themselves.</p>
<p>Rip rap is those stones around the perimeter: they deflect the waves. Cool house!</p>