<p>Why have the rule if it is harmless fun, not necessary?</p>
<p>If you don’t like the rules, don’t go on the trip.</p>
<p>No need to get yourself all in an uproar @twoinanddone, take a deep breath! Take your boxing gloves off…the boxing ring is two doors down. b-(</p>
<p>Some folks take their role as chaperone very seriously. To be honest, I would rather that type of approach than the opposite. A group of kids who are not being watched can get into big trouble. Yes, in a perfect world, kids would obey the rules, all of the time, but as we know, they make dumb decisions. Even the best behaved kids can get caught up in the moment. </p>
<p>When my kids are away in a strange place, without me, I would welcome a chaperone who is is serious about getting my girls back to me in one piece. Not one who is nonchalant or who wants to hang out in his or her hotel room and let the good times roll. </p>
<p>^^^</p>
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<p>I agree. And kids are more likely to push the envelope when in groups. Breaking curfew, in this case (not leaving the premises, not drinking, etc) is a MINOR offense. The consequence should have been minor. </p>
<p>I doubt that, in advance, these kids were told: if you leave your hotel room for any reason, you will have your LORs revoked (and, again, this is a stupid punishment because not all will be attending schools where LORs are given - CCs, many state schools, some privates, etc, do not require LORs)</p>
<p>one reason I am againt zero-tolerance rules is because the adults wont/cant use common sense to apply rules/consequences intelligently (a student brings in a pic of his active-duty soldier parent and gets in trouble because his dad is shown with his rifle.) It is naive to give excessive and arbitrary punishments. It can do more harm than good. ( I find that women are often the worst with this issue…we could replace a bunch with a book if that is all that is needed.)</p>
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<p>Where did I say that the Bill of Rights gives students the right to receive a letter of reference? What I said is that school administrators can’t demand that students follow the rules while they’re busy breaking state laws. What kind of example is that? </p>
<p>We really have no idea what colleges will do, but that’s not something these children should have to worry about. The district has no business and, in all probability, no legal right to contact them about this incident. There are federal regulations that outline what information they’re allowed to share, and with whom. School districts can lose all federal funding if they’re caught violating those regulations, but perhaps that’s a risk they’re willing to take.</p>
<p>I actually think this ‘punishment’ is a minor one with probably no consequences except embarrassment to the student that the college has been informed she broke the rules. What are the consequences if the students were all just sent back to their rooms? Wouldn’t they just do it again in 15 minutes? Why not, if they really want to finish the movie and have fun and they know nothing will be done except they’ll be sent back to their rooms again? It’s like trying to keep puppies in a pen. When does it become a ‘big deal’ or a safety issue? In our district, they all would have been sent home immediately or missed the event the next day, but that is spelled out in district/state rules, as they not only broke curfew but had opposite sexed students in the same room (two violations). Yep, zero tolerance, but lots of warning that that’s the consequence. Maybe OP can tell us what her agreement to go on the trip said.</p>
<p>I expect my kids to follow the rules and not cause trouble for the chaperones, and certainly not blame them for ‘not doing their job’ when they are caught. My kids can’t decide on their own what are minor rules and what are important rules, they follow all the rules. My kids have gone to school in 3 states, and all have required a contract for field trips, more detailed for overnight travel. I doubt this was any different and that there were consequences set out in the contracts signed before the trip. </p>
<p>I still don’t understand why posters think the chaperones weren’t doing their jobs. They found the students. They reported them. They returned them to their parents ‘safe and sound’ but that doesn’t mean the students didn’t violate the curfew. </p>
<p>Don’t the schools have to send the final records to the college? If this is part of the final record, it will included. No laws being broken.</p>
<p>The school knew that they would have a bunch of grads on their hands and therefore should have either refused to do this trip OR come up with a list of consequences that would occur for various infractions. it doesnt sound like the school told these kids ahead of time that LORs would be in jeopardy for violations.</p>
<p>Plus, if these kids are 18 and graduated, the whole concept of thinking you can limit their actions more than you can limit chaperones’ actions seems weird to me (of course 18yos cant drink). Were chaperones given curfews? Were they told that they couldnt gather in rooms and watch TV? If not, why not? again, these students were no longer students at these schools…in fact, they were old enough to be chaperones themselves. </p>
<p>since these kids were graduates (and many/most 18), this trip was similar to any group trip that a community or church might organize. </p>
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Did I say my kids need to be watched 24/7? What I said was that when I’m responsible for other people’s children, I make it my job to know where they are. </p>
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District personnel apparently did attempt to enforce the rules. How many movies the children watched before the chaperones realized they were missing and rounded them up is unclear. However, OP did say they were watching “movies,” NOT that they got caught watching A movie. Nobody is quibbling with the chaperones’ right to break it up and send everyone to bed.</p>
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No doubt attitudes like yours are what induced the state of New Jersey to pass the laws it did protecting students from being dealt with more harshly than an offense demands just so they could be used as an example. The fact remains that no regulation has been cited allowing the district to violate the children’s privacy in this way; state law seems to indicate that they cannot. Are you advocating that these school administrators break NJ State law to discourage younger students from breaking school rules? </p>
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Teachers may have the right to withdraw their letter of reference, but I don’t believe they can legally disclose a student’s disciplinary record to whomever they please. FERPA regulations protect students’ privacy; if I was an administrator in the district, I’d be very careful about what my teachers disclosed. I understand that violating FERPA can cause school districts to lose all their federal funds. But I guess if your going to break state law, you may as well go all in and violate some federal ones as well.</p>
<p>Being 18 in high school doesn’t change the rules. Still have to have a parent sign permission slips, still have to agree to follow the rules. Can’t just claim to be an adult and do whatever they want. My daughter turned 18 in Jan and when she went on her trip in March, all the same rules applied to her as when she was 17.</p>
<p>When she went to France, she had to agree to not drink, even though it was legal for some students (those who were 18) to drink in France. She, and I, agreed to limit her rights. On school trips, kids give up many of their legal rights - to keep medication in their possession, to smoke, to take a knife with them, to take certain food with them. All legal things, all not allowed on the trip by agreement.</p>
<p>The trip agreement apparently didn’t cover breaking curfew or cite retracting LORs as a consequence for breaking the rules. So the district is out of line creating that consequence after the fact.</p>
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<p>I’m closing this thread since it is no longer about the original topic. If you wish to discuss chaperoning feel free to start a thread elsewhere. </p>