This should be required viewing for all familes:
We’ll be rewatching this very soon. Amazing documentary.
1 Like
I see the same thing at one of my kids’ schools. Many parents posting on the FB page, asking about how to take out more loans….especially active now with second semester bills due. I always want to post something like ‘please have your kid transfer to a more affordable situation’, but I don’t, partially because I’m not anonymous there. I’m helpful where I can be about financial aid, but sometimes have to bit my tongue hard (or sit on my hands so I can’t type lol.)
3 Likes
Quick update for you guys. My S25 was just accepted to Miami University with a 25K per year scholarship. He was super excited about this one. He might not be able to play hockey at Miami as it’s super competitive, but it checks all the other boxes for him; at least it appears to. Trip in the Spring for sure.
10 Likes
Here’s his final list of schools and where the apps stand as of right now. I added the awards in the hopes it helps someone out.
American University|Applied
Colby College|Applied|
Connecticut College|Applied|
Cornell Univeristy|Applied|
Drew University|Accepted| 23K per year
FSU|Applied|
High Point University|Accepted|7K per year (don’t ask why he applied here…)
Indiana University|Accepted| Nothing as of yet
Miami (Ohio)|Accepted| 25K per year
NJIT|Applied|
Penn State University|Accepted|Nothing as of yet
Princeton University|Applied|
Ramapo College of NJ|Accepted| Nothing as of yet
Rowan University|Accepted| 8k per year
Rutgers University|Applied|
Seton Hall University|Accepted| 20K per year
Stevens|Applied|
Susquehanna University|Accepted| 45K per year
Syracuse University|Applied|
TCNJ|Applied|
George Washington University|Applied|
Central Michigan University|Accepted| 6K per year
University of Delaware|Applied|
University of Vermont|Applied|
University of New Haven|Accepted |30K per year
UNC Charlotte|Accepted| Nothing as of yet
University of Rhode Island|Applied|
5 Likes
Thanks for the update and congratulations on all of the acceptances! Looking forward to hearing how your son narrows in on his college of choice!
6 Likes
Thanks! You guys have been such a great help with this process. I can’t thank you all enough!
3 Likes
My S25 just got his Ramapo merit aid offer last night and it was fantastic. He got their top merit at 14k per year plus 1k for being accepted to the honors program. At 15k per year (in-state), and with this year’s tuition amount, our cost would be about 1,800. He’ll definitely dorm if he chooses this school, so add another 17k to that amount.
He also got his U Delaware decision and he was accepted. He got their presidential scholarship at 13k per year. Free money is free money amd we’re grateful (truly!), but considering what he got from Ramapo and Miami (100k total) and a few other schools , this was very disappointing. Oh well. Can’t win them all.
He’s going to have a tough decision to make in a few months. We’ll see.
7 Likes
Totally forgot to add that he got his UVM and URI decisions as well. He got 17k and 18k per year, respectively.
3 Likes
NJ here, 5 kids went to college, the experience of ramapo vs. UD is very different. I know several who transferred out of ramapo because it’s kind of a suitcase school, UD is very fun. Recently one transferred to Stockton, the other UD. The highest regular scholarship from UD is only $17,000.
4 Likes
Thanks for this feedback. We’ve come to see the same differences between Ramapo and probably all the OOS big schools that he’s applied or been accepted to. His first choice at this moment is Indiana. Their Cyber & Global Policy program fits him like a glove.
Here’s the dilema. ~74,000+ in costs and no debt at Ramapo vs ~165,000+ cost and over 100k+ at IU when he graduates. And that’s if he gets the top scholarship from IU and gets into the honors college.
I get the potential fun of being at a big school, but none of that matters when you graduate and have to pay that all back. We’d be able to pay a large portion of the tuition while he’’d be attending an OOS school and afterwards with the loan, but why pay it if we don’t have to??? So many things to consider with the future of our economy and so many changes happening with the tech job market and AI.
From everything we’ve learned, Ramapo really is a great school. We all (kid included) loved the campus, dorms, and just the overall feel of the school. We’ve had some conversations with the Cybersecurity staff about outcomes etc and it all seems good. On top of all of that, he’s a hockey player and their club hockey is played at a pretty good level; and they want him. He’s been to a bunch of practices and has built a relationship with the team and coaching staff. I think being a member of the hockey team, would change the equation on the fun part. The players on the team all dorm together and do a lot of things together outside of hockey. Maybe a kid not involved in something like that might have a harder time with the fun part, but he probably wouldn’t.
The biggest thing for us is graduating with no debt. We’d let him take out his student loans amd we’d pay them all by the time he graduates so he graduates with a great credit score setting him up for success, at least in that regard. If he decides he’d like to do a masters, then that would be made all the easier by not being saddled with loans for an undergrad.
4 Likes
Hi Everyone,
Just a quick update. My S25 just got accepted to Rutgers NB’s School of Engineering for Electrical & Computer Engineering. He all of a sudden has begun to show definite interest in Rutgers so we’ll see what happens. I’m still stuck on Ramapo and the nearly full tuition grant he received from them, but it’s going to ultimately be his choice.
Can anyone tell me how Ramapo compares to Rutgers besides the obvious (Big10 School, nationally known, etc.)? I’m thinking of the total cost of attendance for the 4 years (not including any increases YoY). We’re looking at ~75K for Ramapo (7.2K tuition + 68K) vs. ~160K for Rutgers. We don’t expect any merit awards at all from Rutgers. These numbers assume he dorms.
Is Rutgers’ engineering program worth ~85K+ more than Ramapo? I know it’s a hard question to answer with so many variables, but I’m trying to justify the difference. The experience at each of the schools will be so different with class sizes and access to professors and maybe even the quality of the professors themselves, among other things. My idea is that an undergrad degree should be as inexpensive as possible. He was accepted into the Cybersecurity major at Ramapo and from what I understand, they have a well established presence with corporations in NYC and the surrounding area for internships, etc… Cybersecurity is a new major at Ramapo, but it’s part of the same department as Comp Sci which is well established. The same groups hiring Comp Sci majors also hire Cybersec majors.
What do you guys think?
3 Likes
Congratulations to your son on his latest acceptance! Paging @DadOfJerseyGirl for you.
ETA: @sablue, are your son’s preferences from this post still true or have his thoughts changed over the year? Chance Me Please! NJ resident, 3.74UW, 1120 SAT, top 15%, International Relations/CS, ~$40k - #22 by sablue
3 Likes
His ideas go back and forth. He still likes Ramapo, but he’s drawn to the bigger schools like Indiana, Miami Uni, Rutgers. Mostly for the sports culture, if he’s honest. His idea for his major has definitely changed. When we first started looking at this, it was all about IR and Global Studies, but as time has passed, he’s gone more towards engineering, Comp Sci, Cybersec, STEM type stuff. He’s been in his AP CS A class all year this year and that’s definitely helped shape his current thoughts. The Cybersec & Global Policy major at IU is the PERFECT program for him, but he ended up getting 7K per year from them and it’s hard to justify spending that much. IU is his top choice and he told me just this week he’d go there blind, without even needing to visit the campus. We’ll see what happens. This is tough to even think about right now. I imagine it will get tougher as he (we?) get closer to having to make a decision.
I think that others are better suited to addressing the cybersecurity/CS/STEM issues, so I will leave it to them (though I will say that IU is great for STM, but there is no engineering there, if that’s becoming an interest of your son’s).
Did you share the ~$40k budget with your son? Were there any conditions placed on using that figure?
I went into College Navigator to pull what I call the “sticker” price…aka tuition & fees plus room & board, as I find that’s the best way to do an apples to apples comparison, as some schools are more/less generous in budgeting for books, travel, personal expenses, etc. I did it for the schools that have accepted your son that are either in-state publics or that seem as though they might have more of the athletic spirit your son is looking for (some more than others, obviously).
These were my results:
- Ramapo: Sticker of about $32k - $15k scholarship = $17k
- Rowan: Sticker of about $33k - $8k scholarship = $25k
- Rutgers: Sticker of about $32k
- Central Michigan: Sticker of about $27k - $6k scholarship = $21k
- IU: Sticker of about $54k-$7k scholarship = $47k
- Miami (OH): Sticker of about $57k - $25k scholarship = $32k
- Seton Hall: Sticker of about $69k - $20k scholarship = $49k
- U. of Delaware: Sticker of about $55k-$13k scholarship = $42k
- U. of Rhode Island: Sticker of about $51k - $18k scholarship = $33k
- U. of Vermont: Sticker of about $58k - $17k scholarship = $41k
Other admits so far, but that I don’t think would have the sports spirit that your son is now looking for:
- Drew: $23k scholarship
- High Point: $7k scholarship
- Susquehanna: $45k scholarship
- U. of New Haven: $30k scholarship
Based on College Navigator, it appears as though there is a $15k annual delta between Ramapo and Rutgers, for a difference of $60k over 4 years. Now, perhaps tuition in the college of engineering is higher than in the rest of the school, I don’t know. But I’m not getting the same difference in price as you are.
I’m definitely not one that believes that a “name brand” school is the be all, end all. But I do believe in finding a school that is a good fit. If the $40k budget you originally mentioned is still affordable without loans, then I would look for schools that are the best fit that fall within the budget. If your son is most excited and interested in the big schools because of their athletic spirit, then I would be looking at the options that offer that (assuming that the school is otherwise a good fit). Students do best when they are in a place where they’re happy, and at the moment, it sounds like your son would be happiest at a school with spirit around sports.
1 Like
Hello @sablue.
To be honest, Rutgers is a much more well known and better respected name than Ramapo. That is not a knock against Ramapo, but just a fact that Rutgers is better known to employers. Is it worth $85k more to your family? That is a personal question which depends on your own circumstances and priorities. There’s no right or wrong answer.
Unfortunately, I don’t have stats about how much Ramapo engineering grads make vs Rutgers grads. I realize this might turn out to be a hard decision, but I wish you all the best.
4 Likes
Thanks again for all of that info @AustenNut !
He does know what the budget is and he has a few really good options within that budget. As far as no loans, there will def be loans for anything over 20K per year. We will cash flow up to that amount and borrow the rest, but the we’ve set a max for that as well based on total interest that would be paid based on what the current interest rate is for parent plus loans. Just because we might be able to pay something doesn’t mean we will. For example, PSU’s ~58K per is completely unreasonable to us so that won’t be an option. We didn’t really know how low the grants were until ater he applied. We’re rookies at this, but have learned a lot since we started this process.
I went to the Rutgers website and found the same tuition and R&B you di. I think what I was doing was including the indirect bill items to get a CoA from when we started looking last year, but I found the same thing as you as far as different values for books and travel, etc, from school to school. You’re totally right that the best way is to just look at those direct bill items. Makes it much simpler.
We are so torn between having him attend a school with a name that’s well known and having a little debt vs one that’s only regionally known and not putting ourselves or him in debt. Especially when that region is NYC Metro area. If we lived in the middle of Iowa (no offense Iowa!) this might be a diff idea. He’s currently leaning towards Rutgers and that’s fine, but I guess we’ll see!
2 Likes
Thanks for this. It will be a tough choice for him!
1 Like
I haven’t used this so can’t speak to how it works but it’s what is on my D’s college section link on her high school website. The interest rates appear lower than plus loans and might be worth investing deeper.
1 Like
Private loans usually have lower rates than parent loans, we use Sallie Mae because they offer co-sign release after 12 months (some don’t allow co-sign release), which might be of interest to the OP.
1 Like
Ahh, loans definitely make a difference. If you’re considering taking out loans, I urge you to make sure that you’re on track to meet your retirement goals and how educational loans might impact that. There are no loans for retirement.
Is your son willing to take out the amount of loans allowed by the federal government ($5500 first year, max of $28k over undergrad)? He could minimize those loans by working during the school year and summer. It’s always easier to spend someone else’s money, so if he knows that he has some “skin in the game” that may determine how interested he is in the college sports experience, and if your family is inclined and financially able, you could assist with the repayment of the student loans.
Has he applied for any of the colleges’ smaller scholarships (major specific, for students of a particular background, students involved with community service or leadership or whatever)? If there’s a separate app for those, they don’t always get a high level of competition. Earning some at Rutgers or Rowan could make a meaning difference. Ditto for Central Michigan (it’s at $21k, but the transportation costs will be higher than at the NJ schools).
I know that your son was interested in playing hockey at Ramapo and that your family thought that might make a meaningful difference to his experience there. Has he spoken to hockey players to confirm that?
Does he have any more apps outstanding or any schools from which merit/financial aid offers haven’t been given?
1 Like