If the wall/fence were much higher the kids could not see into the enclosure. However, the bars on the fence probably could have been closer together to keep a kid from slipping between the bars (if that is what he did). But then there would be the problem of a kid getting their head stuck between the bars.
Kids are climbers. Things happen. It is MUCH more likely the family would be in a car accident on the way to the zoo than that a kid would climb into the enclosure. We don’t outlaw cars even thought 10s of thousands are killed each year. We don’t outlaw bicycles because some kids get injured or killed.
With little kids, the usual guard rails are a nightmare. Small children can slip and go right under the lowest rail. That was my worry visiting Luray caverns and many other places.
With rails like that, you need to have hard metal mesh along the inner plane too. Kids can see through but can’t slip under and can’t get their feet in to use it to climb up on.
It is amazing what tiny spaces little hands, feet and heads can skip through. Preschools, zoos, and other places where youngsters are present have to design accordingly.
I was actually surprised the artist who created the sculpture was so forgiving that he not only refused to accept compensation for the damage, but even excused the boy on the basis of age.
Especially considering the commentary on many Chinese related forums from many Chinese parents/older adults…especially from generations older than current parents are harshly ripping into the parents of that boy for failing to “raise him right” so he would know not to touch/get too close to museum displays. Some of this is variants of “get off my lawnism” and some are perceptions that current generation of Chinese parents are getting too lax with discipline/guidance for the “little emperors/empresses” and being much more inclined to blame others first for their misbehaviors and associated negative consequences.
Perceptions which have some validity considering I have noticed more recent Mainland Chinese parents from the upper/upper-middle classes do seem to allow their kids to get away with much more than counterparts from just 15-20+ years ago from observations while in China and here in the US along with reports from Chinese newsmedia and reports from relatives/friends who live/make frequent trips to Mainland China on business.
An older aunt who raised 4 active boys ~one year apart from the '60s till the '80s(when they graduated HS) had a similar reaction* when she heard about the lego incident and felt the need to comment on it to mom. Then again, she was quite strict with kids/teens as I’ve gotten a glimpse while visiting her as a child.
And from her own sons’ accounts…she was much more lax with me than with them at the same age…likely on account of the fact she’s fond of mom as the baby sis and times have changed which made the larger society less accepting of some aspects of her strict parenting on her sons in the '60s and '70s. And no, she wasn’t a Tiger mom. In fact, both parents were much closer in attitude with some American parents whose opinions were at the other extreme: that “all colleges are the same” and the Ivy/elite pedigree is “meaningless.”
I wouldn't be surprised if she places 100% of the blame/responsibility on the mother** of the 3 year old kid going into the gorilla zoo exhibit and creating a situation where Harambe was killed on the mom/parents.
** Only because the father by most accounts wasn’t there. If he was, she’d assign the same amount of blame/responsibility on him as well.
WRT the Lego exhibit - I have a hard time believing it was “worth” $15,000. Wouldn’t there need to be a buyer and a seller to have a price set? I’d like proof that anyone would pay that much for Lego. I also was surprised that it took the artist only three days to complete. Nonetheless, it’s reasonable for someone’s art to be free from smashing while on display. On the third hand, Lego is really not a stable medium, if our carpet is any indication!
I’ve seen sculpture made of various non-hardy materials (e.g. a urinal fashioned out of lipstick (!)) and they need more protection than something more sturdy, if on display to the public.
Unfortunately, I think the zoo acted appropriately in these circumstances. I am sure the keepers at the zoo had very strong emotions towards Harambee, but having to make a quick decision to protect the child, they made the best decision they could.
Personally I don’t think the mother is guilty of neglect, but that she is responsible for this incident. It doesn’t matter if it’s a simple mistake and it doesn’t have to reach the level of neglect, as a parent you ARE responsible for the actions of your child. If you take a toddler into the fine china department of a department store, it doesn’t matter if you are standing next to them holding their hand, in that quick instant when they break that hundred dollar vase, you don’t get to say ‘but it was just a simple mistake’.
When you take your child into the local electronics store with their juice box, it doesn’t matter if it’s just a simple mistake, you don’t get to say ‘well, I didn’t think they’d actually turn it upside down and squeeze it onto the computer, they’ve never done that before’
I wasn’t a perfect mom by any means, none of us are, but I did take responsibility for things that were my fault. When my son was in elementary school he was outside with some friends and I would periodically look out the window to make sure all were OK. At some point, all the other kids were gone and my son was sitting outside in tears, so I went out to figure out what had happened. It seems they were playing with some rocks they’d found and my son claimed responsibility for breaking the window of a car parked nearby. I could have had my son flee the scene like the other kids or I could have claimed that it must have been something else that caused the damage, but instead I asked around to determine whose car it was, took my son to their house, had him apologize for what happened and then I told them I would be paying to replace their window. Yes, a simple mistake…something all kids do…I don’t feel I was at all neglectful of my son, yet it was absolutely 100% my responsibility.
Yes. One reason why the lego incident and moreso this incident is shocking is it is perceived or in the case of the latter…confirms fears/concerns from older generations of Chinese parents that the current generation of Mainland Chinese parents or adult supervising figures are getting far too lax regarding supervision/discipline.
Similarly, there was a lot of anger and vitriol among Chinese commentators…especially older generations of parents against the teen and his parents a few years back after he carved graffiti on a wall carving in an Ancient Egyptian temple while on an international field trip:
And this isn’t a commentary on ethnicity, but on differences between older generations and current generation of Mainland Chinese parents as the former regard the latter as getting far too lax about discipline/supervision and worse, in the case of the glass museum incident…parents encouraging misbehavior.
In some ways, this is very similar to the condemnations and get-off-my-lawnism between older generations of parents and current generation of American parents in the newsmedia/commentary.
And compared to greater culture of vitriol and feeling parents must be held accountable for all misbehavior of their children in Mainland China judging by these reports and online commentators, the condemnations/criticism of the mother and child on this thread and some American newsmedia outlets are exceedingly mild in comparison with the exception of the outrageous racism from some American commentators focusing on the 3 year old’s race.
I wish more parents would appreciate the value of holding onto their kids’ hands in public places, a practice that would have avoided both the zoo and Lego incidents. I realize it’s a hard thing to do all the time, but I see it being done less and less these days. Nearly every time I’m at the supermarket, I see a mother wheeling a cart to her car while her little kid or kids run ahead. Now my kids were temperamentally less adventurous than most, so they weren’t so challenging to keep an eye on, but even so, in a parking lot they knew they had to either hold my hand or, if I had no hand free, hang on to my sleeve or hem. It was non-negotiable. I can’t imagine having a three-year old running free in any public place, much less a crowded zoo.
The zoo mom goofed up, and she does have responsibility in the death of the gorilla. That doesn’t mean she’s an unfit mother, nor that she should be publicly vilified or subject to criminal action, but a mandated parenting class and some kind of compensation to the zoo, either monetary or via volunteering, makes sense to me.
Most three year olds at a zoo are going to want to do a little running around. I can’t imagine either of my kids being content to hold my hand the entire time we were at a place like the zoo.
In the case of mainland Chinese, indulgent parenting might be more common due to the one-child policy. It’s lead to a phenomenon called “Little Emperor Syndrome”. This probably helps to accentuate the usual generational gap in child-rearing practices.
"The Little Emperor Syndrome (or Little Emperor Effect) is an aspect of China’s one-child policy where only children gain seemingly excessive amounts of attention from their parents and grandparents. Combined with increased spending power within the family unit and parents’ general desire for their child to experience the benefits they themselves were denied, the phenomenon is generally considered to be problematic. Andrew Marshall even argues that it is shaping Chinese society in unexpected ways[1] that may culminate into a future “behavioral time-bomb.”[2]
Little Emperors are primarily an urban phenomenon. The one-child policy generally only applied to urban communities and, given the value of labor, one child families are not prevalent within rural communities. Economic development has not had as large an impact outside of urban centers."
I’m not sure that’s a definitive explanation for this recent phenomenon of badly behaving children and sometimes even parents. Especially considering the “one-child policy” had been in effect since the late '70s and the misbehaviors weren’t on the radar when I was in Mainland China at the tail-end of the '90s or from reports/observations of friends/relatives who live/regularly travel to Mainland China on business from the '90s to the present.
If this had really been an issue, this spat of misbehaviors and outrage/discussions of outrageous parenting to the degree it has been happening should have been prevalent when I was in Mainland China in the late '90-s as the oldest kids affected by the one-child policy are around my age and the economic boom was already gaining steam.
The gap I’m seeing in regards to perceptions of laxness with parental supervision/discipline among Mainland Chinese are between older generations of parents and parents of kids who were/are children and teens within the last 5 or so years.
Doesn’t matter in that context. The whole point and the reason for much outrage from many including older generations of Chinese parents like my aunt is that the kid shouldn’t have damaged it in the first place and put the artist in an inconveniencing position of having to spend 3 days to re-assemble it.
And if the parents themselves made that remark, that’d be regarded as a sign the parents are trying to minimize the damage/inconvenience to the artist/museum and their own responsibility for it. In short, acting like a child/teen who tries to excuse negative consequences/damage for his/her behavior by whining “What’s the big deal?!!”
The opposite tone from what would be considered appropriate especially among the older generations of parents…humble apologies, complete acceptance of responsibility, and offers to pay restitution which the parents reportedly did. And the artist was unusually generous in not only defending the boy on the basis of his age, but also refused the offered compensation from the parents*.
Unusual as most older generation Chinese parents would not have found that to be an acceptable excuse even for the kid....and certainly not if its meant to give the parents an out from being considered accountable/responsible for the kid's conduct.
** That strict aunt I mentioned before would have politely insisted the artist take the compensation to teach her boy(s) a lesson in responsibility for the consequences of one’s actions/behavior if they were in the place of that boy in that incident.
Extrapolated from an incident where one older cousin caused a dent on a neighbor’s new car during his HS years after he encountered an unseen oil slick on the cul-de-sac while biking and careened into the parked car. Even though the owner tried refusing the offered compensation for the dent on account of my cousin’s accident, she politely insisted he accept the compensation and took it out of my older cousin’s savings from allowance/part-time work earnings.
@Cobrat - just distinguishing it from the Zoo fiasco. The resulting damage in my mind is less since it can be put back together. Maybe that should be the child’s punishment - assisting with reassembly.
coolwater: Thanks for posting that. I had been looking for such a photo. Early this morning I’ d seen a photo of the updated fence, the one with mesh.
When the incident happened, the fence looked like the photo where the young boy, in a green shirt, leans over. I wish we had some better shots, but it looks to me that almost as soon as he got through the bushes, he was over the ledge. I wonder if he saw the edge of the pit or not. We have been speculating as to why, even the wildest child would jump into a 15 ft pit (or 12; I’ve seen it variously described) Of course, at age four, mine got to go off a high dive, during very closely supervised diving lessons, and I had been wondering if the kid was “diving.” Now, we seem to learn he is three and not four.
Like Bookworm, I keep trying to learn “how many kids” but even eyewitness reports seem inconsistent to me.
I saw a drawing of the enclosure, but don’t know if it is accurate. It says three ft fence, then four feet of bushes and then the drop. Does anyone have additional photos? I am interested in these wires that have been mentioned behind the fence. Thanks in advance.
This does relate to why so many commenters were outraged at the mother of the 3 year old kid who crawled into the gorilla enclosure because of her initial FB post. They perceived it as minimizing her responsibility for her kid’s actions, especially considering it led to the tragic death of Harambe by among other things barely mentioning him in that post. It also left some with the impression that she considered his death was a mere afterthought and with some…the impression his life was “disposable”.