Claim Karl Rove was leak in CIA outing

Parent Cafe
401

<p>Also, just a question - if Rove and Libby have freed their reporters from confidentiality, who is Judith Miller still having to protect? How does that person go to bed each night, knowing this reporter is sitting in a jail cell?</p>

<p>And don’t tell me Bush is playing some game of poker, letting the Dems string this out before he flushes out the hand and the Dems look stupid. Poker is a game - but people are rotting in jail. Why doesn’t he just say, okay, folks - speak up and get an innocent woman out of prison?</p>

402

<p>What do you mean, just before an election? Wilson went to Niger in February of 2002.</p>

<p>And this was a sandbagging mission, more than a year before we invaded Iraq? Eleven months before the infamous “sixteen words” in the State of the Union address? </p>

<p>Prescient guy, that Joe Wilson.</p>

403

<p>Greybeard, undermining governments has been the CIA’s MO for decades. They can do it abroad, and they can do it here–although they’re not supposed to be able to–if they’re allowed to get away with leaking to the press, which is one of their primary tactics abroad. Disinformation campaigns are powerful.</p>

<p>Hayden, your post seems to assume that Judith Miller is “sitting in a jail cell” to protect the Bushies. What if it’s not a White House source? What if it’s a CIA source, and that’s why the prosecutor is being so dogged about this?</p>

404

<p>Driver,</p>

<p>You’re suggesting that Joe Wilson was part of a CIA plot to undermine the government of the United States?</p>

405

<p>Greybeard, I suggested that way back in post #392, where you can find the WSJ link I mentioned. Have a cup of coffee! EDIT: I suggested that they interfered with an election, trying to torpedo President Bush.</p>

<p>

It’s more plausible than anything the anti-Bush Moonies are putting forward.</p>

406

<p>I just love being called anti-Bush moonies by Driver…it gives me chills</p>

<p>So, Driver, has Bush and his Administration ever ever ever made a mistake, ever misrepresented facts, ever said something not exactly true, or are they perfect in all they have said, done, represented, have they been ethical, forthright, honest, and what about other Republicans, do you see them as totally ethical at ALL times, never erring…</p>

<p>Just wondering</p>

<p>Greybeard, so when you wanna go to that moonie meeting</p>

407

<p>And gee, don’t we have more terror fears than a year ago…I think so…so Bush’s plan is working exactly how? While we “pursue” terrorists, more are recruited</p>

<p>And now that the Cia operatives appear not to be protected by our own Administration, well, they will be reall effective now. And anyone trying to recruit someone to give us real information on the ground, why would anyone risk their lives when even our own President looks like he could care less</p>

408

<p>driver, I think from Miller’s history, that it’s more than likely that her source is political, but not necessarily the White House. I think her source could be from the WH, but equally likely that it is from State or the Pentagon. She was close to a lot of the neocons.</p>

<p>Miller was one of the guidling lights behind the march to war, and was a proponent of the wmd’s being in Iraq. Many of her stories sourced her facts to senior contacts in the exiled Iraqi people, which probably means Chalabi. </p>

<p>The very last source Miller could ever have used would have been the CIA, since they were leary of the wmd story, while Miller bought it hook, line and sinker. That’s why she is so loathed by so many of the far left.</p>

409

<p>I am really suprised Miller’s attorney is so close mouthed, everyone else lawyers are yapping away…</p>

410

<p>

Well Hayden, she’s the only one of the reporters in question that didn’t write a story about Plame, isn’t she? Maybe that should tell us something about her distrust of the CIA, as you suggest.</p>

411

<p>actually she’s not the “only one of the reporters . . . that didn’t write a story about Plame”. In fact, only Novak wrote the story. Every one else just wrote a story about Novak writing a story.</p>

<p>driver, you tell us to be careful to only use facts in evidence, but you seems to be spinning amazing conspiracies about the CIA with no facts at all ! It is, after all, the CIA who pushed for the Plame grand jury. Why would they want to attempt to indict themselves?</p>

412

<p>"The Washington Times Foundation, a non-profit group associated with the Unification Church, held an awards ceremony in February at which Moon was presented with the Distinguished Lifetime Achievement Award for Freedom, Faith and Family.</p>

<p>“The Washington Times covered the event and said a lot of movers and shakers in the Republican party were there, including Hatch and Sen. Strom Thurmond, R-S.C., House Speaker Dennis Hastert, R-Ill., and Reps. Henry Hyde and Christopher Cox. Alexander Haig, former commander of NATO forces, turned up, as did Reagan-era defense secretary Caspar Weinberger.”</p>

<p>Sorry, citygirlsmom, it doesn’t sound like my kind of crowd.</p>

413

<p>So why would we be called MOONIES…</p>

<p>Nevermind…</p>

<p>I still haven’t gotten my question answered</p>

414

<p>OK, so let’s take a close look at Driver’s WSJ quote :</p>

<p>“The real intelligence scandal is how an open opponent of the U.S. war on terror such as Mr. Wilson was allowed to become one of that policy’s investigators.” </p>

<p>Joe Wilson went to Niger in February of 2002, having supported the decision to invade Afghanistan, and having supported the decision to go to war against Iraq after Saddam invaded Kuwait. So what makes him an open opponent of the war on terrorism?</p>

<p>Remember, this was thirteen months before we invaded Iraq a second time; if Bush is to be believed, this was long before we made a decision to invade Iraq. </p>

<p>“That egregious CIA decision [i.e. the decision to send Joe Wilsos]echoes what has obviously been a long-running attempt by anonymous ‘intelligence sources’ quoted in the media to undermine the Bush policy toward Iraq.”</p>

<p>What Bush policy toward Iraq? His demand for the return of inspectors? Do you really expect us to believe that Joe Wilson, or his wife, or anyone else at the CIA opposed that policy? (Remember, this was seven months before Bush went to the UN and demanded a resolution requiring Saddam Hussein to allow the weapons inspectors to return, and be given unfettered access to everything in the country, at penalty of invasion.)</p>

<p>After all these years, the incongruity of the drivel you find Wall Street Journal’s op-ed section still surprises me, in view of the high journalistic standards maintained elsewhere in the paper.</p>

415

<p>So who was the first to push the Wilson issue the week both the memo is circulated on AF1 while the pRes and team are in Africa. [Powell, Ari and Condi et., al]. Press gaggle comments by Condi are in the bottom third.
<a href=“Briefing Room | The White House”>Briefing Room | The White House;

<p>" Q Dr. Rice, when did you all find out that the documents were forged?</p>

<p>DR. RICE: Sometime in March, I believe. Is that right?</p>

<p>MR. FLEISCHER: The IAEA reported it.</p>

<p>DR. RICE: The IAEA reported it I believe in March. But I will tell you that, for instance, on Ambassador Wilson’s going out to Niger, I learned of that when I was sitting on whatever TV show it was, because that mission was not known to anybody in the White House. And you should ask the Agency at what level it was known in the Agency.</p>

<p>Q When was that TV show, when you learned about it?</p>

<p>DR. RICE: A month ago, about a month ago.</p>

<p>Q Can I ask you about something else?</p>

<p>DR. RICE: Yes. Are you sure you’re through with this? "
…Condi brings up Wilson without any related reason in the comments to that point. Her comments aren’t related to anything brought up in the gaggle so far, it is only related in her mind possibly because she had just read the top secret memo on wilson that had just been circulated on AF1.
Condi sure seems interested in putting the reporters on to Wilson, she goes further than that when she asks the reporter if he is sure he is through with this after he states he is ready to move on. </p>

<p>and on Ari during the Africa trip this press gaggle reveals
<a href=“http://www.usembassy-israel.org.il/publish/press/2003/july/071002[/url]”>http://www.usembassy-israel.org.il/publish/press/2003/july/071002&lt;/a&gt; .html
"But there’s a bigger picture here, and this is what’s fundamental – the case for war against Iraq was based on the threat that Saddam Hussein posed because of his possession of weapons of mass destruction, chemical and biological, and his efforts to reconstitute a nuclear program. In 1991, everybody in the world underestimated how close he was to getting a nuclear weapon. The case for going to war against Saddam is as just today as it was the day the President gave that speech.</p>

<p>Q: Ambassador Wilson said he made a case months before that there was no basis to the belief –</p>

<p>MR. FLEISCHER: No, he reported that Niger denied the allegation. That’s what Ambassador Wilson reported.</p>

<p>Q: Was that report weighed against other –</p>

<p>MR. FLEISCHER: And of course they would deny the allegation. That doesn’t make it untrue. It was only later – you can ask Ambassador Wilson if he reported that the yellow cake documents were forged. He did not. His report did not address whether the documents were forged or not. His report stated that Niger denied the accusation. He spent eight days in Niger and concluded that Niger denied the allegation.</p>

<p>Well, typically, nations don’t admit to going around nuclear
nonproliferation.</p>

<p>Q: But he said there was a basis to believe their denials.</p>

<p>MR. FLEISCHER: That’s different from what he reported. The issue here is whether the documents on yellow cake were forged. He didn’t address that issue. That’s the information that subsequently came to light, not prior to the speech.</p>

<p>Q: Walk us through how much, if any of this –</p>

<p>MR. FLEISCHER: It was based on the national intelligence estimate; it was based on contemporaneous reporting leading up to the speech, which with the advantage of hindsight we now know that the yellow cake ties to Niger were not accurate. But again, in 1991, the world underestimated how close Iraq was to obtaining nuclear weapons. There is a bigger picture here that is just as valid today as it was the day of the speech."</p>

<p>Ari has seen the INR, and the classified memo on Wilson circulated on AF1 during the Africa trip.</p>

<p>Condi’s comments of July 11, Ari’s comments as noted in the July 7th gaggle, linked above, on a different day during the trip and Powell observed holding the memo that we know was sent to him at the outset of the Africa trip seem to indicate an orchestrated plan to go after Wilson.</p>

416

<p>Election fraud of the Repub kind:
<a href=“http://www.seminolechronicle.com/vnews/display.v/ART/2004/12/16/41c2fdb042ea1[/url]”>http://www.seminolechronicle.com/vnews/display.v/ART/2004/12/16/41c2fdb042ea1&lt;/a&gt;
…
The programmer claims that he designed and built a “vote rigging” software program at the behest of then Florida Congressman, now U.S. Congressman, Republican Tom Feeney of Florida’s 24th Congressional District.</p>

<p>Clint Curtis, 46, claims that he built the software for Feeney in 2000 while working at a sofware design and engineering company in Oviedo, Florida (Feeney’s home district).</p>

<p>Curtis, in his affidavit, says that as technical advisor and programmer at Yang Enterprises, Inc. (YEI) he was present at company meetings where Feeney was present “on at least a dozen occasions”.</p>

<p>Feeney, who had run in 1994 as Jeb Bush’s running-mate in his initial unsuccessful bid for Florida Governor, was serving as both corporate counsel and registered lobbyist for YEI during the period that Curtis worked at the company. Feeney was also concurrently serving as a Florida state congressman while performing those services for YEI. Feeney would eventually become Speaker of the Florida House before being elected to the U.S. House of Representatives in 2002. He is now a member of the U.S. House Judiciary Committee.</p>

<p>At an October 2000 meeting with Feeney, according to the affidavit and BRAD BLOG interviews with Curtis over the past three days, Feeney inquired whether the company could build a “vote fraud software prototype”.</p>

<p>At least three YEI employees are said to have been present at that meeting; Curtis, company owner, Mrs. Li Woan Yang, and her executive secretary, Mike Cohen. Two other YEI employees may have come in and out at different points of the meeting according to Curtis.</p>

<p>Curtis says that Feeney “was very specific in the design and specifications required for this program.”…Upon delivery of the software design and documentation on CD to Mrs. Yang, Curtis again explained to her that it would be impossible to hide routines created to manipulate the vote if anybody would be able to inspect the precompiled source code.</p>

<p>Mrs. Yang then told him, “You don’t understand, in order to get the contract we have to hide the manipulation in the source code. This program is needed to control the vote in South Florida.” [emphasis in affidavit]</p>

<p>Mrs. Yang then took the CD containing the software from Curtis, reportedly for later delivery to Feeney.</p>

<p>In other meetings with Feeny prior to the 2000 elections, it became clear to Curtis that Feeney had plans to suppress the vote in strong Democratic precincts. In the affidavit, Curtis claims that in those meetings Feeney had “bragged that he had already implemented ‘exclusion lists’ to reduce the ‘black vote’.” Feeney also mentioned that “proper placement of police patrols could further reduce the black vote by as much as 25%.”</p>

417

<h1>He claims that at the time he developed the prototype software, he was under the misconception that Feeney simply wanted a program to demonstrate that Democrats could use such a program to steal votes, and that such a program might be detectable.</h1>

<h1>He claims that Tom Feeney stated he had “exclusion lists” (caging lists?) for reducing or blocking the “black vote”.</h1>

<h1>He claims that, in 2003, during his employment at the Florida Department of Transportation (FDOT), Raymond Lemme, the FDOT Inspector General stated he had tracked corruption “all the way to the top” involving the above allegations, and other YEI criminal activity in their contracts with FDOT.</h1>

<h1>He claims that he was fired from FDOT shortly after discussing the above matters with Raymond Lemme.</h1>

<h1>He describes how Lemme was found dead in Valdosta, Georgia, on July 1, 2003, with his arm slashed. (Wayne Madsen gives additional information about Lemme’s death, which was reported as an apparent suicide; Madsen’s clear implication is that Lemme was murdered)</h1>

<h1>He claims that he reported the above information to multiple federal and state agencies, including the FBI, CIA, and Department of “Homeland Security”, but received very little feedback or followup from these agencies.</h1>

<p>It should also be of interest that Feeney used a hired gun attorney for the Curtis/Yang law suit from the Bush presidential campaign though his only contact with the Bush family is Jeb in a failed gov. race</p>

<p>If the current LEAK investigation goes back to the CIA to include election fraud, then look no further than Florida and Ohio where dems have reems of testimony, documantation and information on voter fraud on the repubs.
Look what Coingate is revealing now in Ohio.</p>

418

<p>*Cheney gave the classic “non-denial” on Wilson, telling Tim Russert things like, “I don’t know Joe Wilson, I’ve never met Joe Wilson,” and “if he wrote a report, I never saw it.” “Sure I asked a question about Niger. I ask a lot of questions.” As Wilson stated in the July 6 op-ed piece, he hadn’t written a report: he gave four face-to-face briefings.</p>

<p>Wilson’s statement was taken written up and put away. According to the State Department memo on the trip, the Senate Intelligence Committee report and George Tenet’s statement on the matter, it never went any further.</p>

<p>Hersch, writing 2 years ago, said the reason Wilson’s report didn’t make it higher was because it only verified what the CIA was already saying. In other words, the CIA had been saying in many ways on many occasions that the case for wmd in Iraq wasn’t strong and that the stories from Chalabi et al lacked credibilitly.</p>

<p>That’s odd, because the CIA told the Senate Intelligence Committee that it confirmed that Iraq had been making an attempt. That’s in the main body of the report, starting around page 36, there’s a link way back somewhere above. The same for Tenet’s statement. Seymour Hersch doesn’t seem to know what he’s talking about. Again.</p>

<p>The State Department sided with Wilson and disagreed with the CIA, but it was the CIA that briefed the Administration. </p>

<p>Condi’s comments of July 11, Ari’s comments as noted in the July 7th gaggle, linked above, on a different day during the trip and Powell observed holding the memo that we know was sent to him at the outset of the Africa trip seem to indicate an orchestrated plan to go after Wilson.</p>

<p>Or an effort to understand what the press was asking questions about. Rice had already stumbled on Meet the Press when asked questions about it. Her answers clearly indicate she didn’t know anything about it. Besides, all you’ve described is consistent with the Administration getting ambushed on this and when someone asked what was going on, Powell says, one of my guys (Marc Grossman) got a briefing memo on this last month. Why don’t I get a copy and bring it on the trip to Africa?</p>

<p>As to the transcript, all it shows is that Rice and Flescher saw it or learned about it’s content from someone. What’s that got to do with Rove or Libby or anyone else.</p>

<p>As to the election fraud thing, sweetkidsmom, I take you’ve never meet a conspiracy you didn’t like.</p>

419

<p>Hi everyone, including Driver and Strict11. I have been off line for a few days busy with home improvement work. I posted a string of info comments mostly because I’m going to be too busy to watch this thread closely. but also if threats of Cia involvement in the pResidential election are going to be tossed around then it should also be noted that dems have the goods on Bush in that regard and willbe happy to bring it to the now ever ready ears of the newly inspired press.
excerpts on feeney
<a href=“http://www.onlinejournal.com/Special_Reports/120604Madsen/120604madsen.html[/url]”>http://www.onlinejournal.com/Special_Reports/120604Madsen/120604madsen.html&lt;/a&gt;
“An exhaustive investigation has turned up a link between current Florida Republican Representative Tom Feeney, a customized Windows-based program to suppress Democratic votes on touch screen voting machines, a Florida computer services company with whom Feeney worked as a general counsel and registered lobbyist while he was Speaker of the Florida House of Representatives, and top level officials of the Bush administration.”</p>

<p>Feeney’s desire to manipulate the vote would be manifested in his home base of Volusia County in the 2000 presidential election. According to The Washington Post, at 10 p.m. on election night, Al Gore was leading Bush in Volusia County by 83,000 to 62,000 votes. One-half hour later, Gore’s vote total had been reduced by 16,000 to 67,000 and an obscure Socialist candidate saw a sudden surge to 10,000 votes in a precinct with only 600 voters. The information on the Volusia optical scanner voting anomalies came from a leaked internal Diebold memorandum. In the end, Bush won Florida and the White House by a mere 537 votes in the most controversial U.S. presidential election in history.</p>

<p>Feeney had long been a voice in Florida GOP politics. He was gubernatorial candidate Jeb Bush’s running mate in 1994, a race in which Democratic incumbent Lawton Chiles defeated Bush. Chiles once referred to Feeney as “the David Duke of Florida politics.”</p>

420

<p>sshifting the focus to personalized attackes is beneath you strict11.
I realize this is what is taught at the GOP/USA two day journalism school(only costs $50).</p>

<p>I had the impression you were able to tell conjecture and guess work from conspiracy, don’t reflect your deductions on others. tghey are yours only. on others. Conjecture on who is involved hitting a nerve? Good night see you isn a few days.</p>