Clemson vs UTK vs Va Tech for construction management? [VA resident, 4.0 GPA, 35 ACT]

For this particular kid, honors housing in the first year was a primary motivator for applying to the honors college. A LLC might have served the same purpose, but you have to apply to those, too. So, kid didn’t apply to honors at UTK because if kid had gone there they would have likely lived at home. It wasn’t the decision maker between Clemson and VT, but it was a consideration.

For spouse and I back in the dark ages, the benefits of the honors college decreased over time - priority sign-up means less when you are a senior, upper level classes are usually small anyway, etc. For this kid, who will be starting in the fall as a sophomore (DE and AP covered the freshman engineering classes and a few beyond that), enrollment priority won’t matter much since after freshman year the program is pretty lockstep for a while. But, being in a quiet environment when jumping into sophomore engineering classes was a big draw. One of the benefits of the STEM LLC is that students will live and take classes together, making it easy to study, but that was not a possibility for this particular student. There are other students who turn down honors housing to live in the LLC, and I could imagine my other kid doing that, depending on what college and major that student chooses. Some colleges now do more with cool opportunities for upperclassmen, so under different circumstances I can see reasons to start an honors program later.

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At Clemson, I agree that honors housing is much nicer (the shoeboxes are not super appealing). At VT - honors housing is in an A/C dorm, which in itself is appealing. The LLC’s as well are in the nicer/newer dorms (I think, in part to entice freshman to join them).

It definitely depends on the kid and the program of study. Mine turned down the honors offer because it meant extra coursework and she’s already loaded up going for a dual degree. Luckily, she hasn’t had issues registering for classes as a regular student. She never would have done an LLC as they are 2-year commitments to living in the dorm (a huge advantage for some but she wanted the flexibility to live with whomever she wanted, and to live off campus). I think the LLC’s are pretty cool.

@OctoberKate - I was a little bored, and as a parent of a VT freshman, thought I’d come over to this forum, and searched “building construction”…

It’s been 6 months, and things change, but if your son is still interested in VT BC, I have some insight…

I have a freshman daughter at VT that is taking the intro to BC class over winter term. She’s actually a finance major, but literally her first day of class, she attended her “careers in finance” class and called me (I’m a VT finance alum…) and said “nope, that’s not it.” We have some ties to the construction industry (DH works for a national wholesaler for construction materials), and she took drafting as her elective all 4 years of high school (her senior year she even helped design a new addition to the HS). She started talking about building construction. Long story short, she talked to the daughter of a friend that is a BC major, and made an appt with the BC advisor, Shelton Norwood. He’s incredible. He explained the differences between BC & Construction Mgmt at VT. BC is their Proj Mgmt degree, which is more skewed more towards business classes. Construction Mgmt is in the engineering school and they get “the stamp”. At least for our daughter, she’s more interested in the business/personal side (long term, maybe she wants to be a custom home builder). In talking to others in the industry, sky is the limit with Proj Mgmt, where as the engineer folks sort of hit a ceiling. On the BC side, they have 100% job placement (I don’t know enough about the Const Mgmt side), and are ranked the #1 program on the east coast (behind I think Cal Poly, nationally). For the “Building Construction” degree, they don’t apply to the College of Engineering, even though it’s under their umbrella.

In Oct, she went to the construction job fair (as a freshman finance major). She had an in person internship interview the next day, and several more virtually. She had multiple summer internship offers and has accepted one locally (we’re in NC) with a firm that was at the fair. Her only previous work experience has been working at Chick-Fil-A. She will be paid $20/hr (she received an offer for $31/hr but that opportunity was in Raleigh, and would have required her to pay for housing) for a 10 weeks (40 hr/wk), and the company has indicated there could scholarship opportunities. When she spoke with Norwood, he told her stories of a few grads - making easily over 6 figures. Alot of these contractors are offering scholarships with acceptance of a post grad offer. It’s a bit crazy…

Again, she’s taking the Intro to BC class right now over break, because the subsequent course is only offered in the spring. She hasn’t officially declared BC as her major because we don’t want her to give up her spot in Pamplin (business school). She’s continuing to take the core business classes, which will count towards BC (BC requires lower level Accounting, Econ, etc. than business degrees requires, but hers will count, and her Bus Calc class will count for their Calc). She’s going to talk to her advisors in spring, but her plan is to double major in Real Estate (which is currently in Pamplin), along with BC. If they double major with BC, RE seems the easy/most complimentary option. Another BC parent suggested she take the 2 intro classes, work the internship, and then change her major. That seems like a logical pathway.

But so far, our experience is that it is a very well thought of program, and job opportunities are plentiful, and other parents rave about the professors & advising. Hitt Contracting from NOVA has donated a ton of money - they just opened Hitt Hall this fall that houses the construction programs as well as a new dining hall. They’ve also pledged $2M endowment for scholarships and they said “that’s just the start”.

Another factor is, while it’s early, where does your son want to end up post grad? There will be lots of recruiters on campus for job fairs…most of the ones at VT are in VA (definitely heavy NOVA but RIC & Hampton Roads too) but some from NC and other states. Clemson is probably attracting alot of ATL contractors…I’m not sure about UTK. Speaking of the job fair, VT had a waiting list of contractors…literally they don’t have enough room to house everyone that wants to come meet VT students. We were talking to a mechanical contractor a few years ago that really likes Clemson & NCSU kids…I can’t speak to Clemson but the NCSU only offers an engineering degree, for instance they can specialize in HVAC. So it’s a bit of apples & oranges when comparing these programs.

RE: Honors College…our daughter was accepted last year. We went to the info session, and frankly, the only advantage to her was earlier class selection. But otherwise, she didn’t feel like there were benefits, and they required additional classes and projects. I find at VT, alot of kids opt out that are accepted.

I know that’s alot of info, but since you didn’t get any specific info for BC…if you have any other questions, I’ll be glad to help. Or if your DS has moved on from BC and/or VT, just ignore. But long story short, if he’s interested in BC, it’s a smaller major at VT, everyone has great things to say about it, and again, they’re producing highly sought after grads.

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THANK YOU SO MUCH!

Seriously - this is hugely helpful!

He’s still really really interested in BC. We’re waiting to hear if he got in to VT - he’s gotten into the Construction Mgmt major at Clemson, and the Construction, Science and Mgmt major at UTK. We’re just waiting (not very patiently on my part) to hear back from VT.

I am excited to share your/your daughter’s thoughts with him when he gets home. We are VA residents, and VT would be so much less expensive than Clemson for him. (He got huge merit at UTK, so that would actually be the cheapest for us.) He loved Clemson when we toured and was just kind of eh on VT, but at the time we visited, we didn’t realize that BC was a thing - we thought they only had the construction engineering (or whatever it’s called) and he does NOT want that much engineering/math, he wants more business. So we didn’t try to find out anything more about it and when we’ve tried to do online info sessions, because it still falls under the college of engineering, it never gets mentioned in those general sessions for the college.

I’ve had a hard time trying to explain why I think VT is the better program for him and I think the notes you’ve shared really, really does a good job of capturing what I couldn’t. Thank you so much!

Ironically, last night he and I had a conversation about what he’s thinking, what’s next, and he said he thought maybe UTK had dropped below VT on his “top choices” list - frankly, this kind of shocked me because that’s not how he’s been leaning. So having some more info to share about the respect for the program, and the job placement, and how smoothly it’s gone for your daughter is really really wonderful.

I’m confident I’ll be coming back with more questions, but thank you again!!!

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If you have any other questions, let me know! I’ll be glad to try to answer. I’ll be honest, I feel like BC is WAY overlooked. I see engineering majors on the VT Parents forum who have kids struggling to find jobs (and have stressed out over the engineering workload), and the BC majors are turning down offers (with less workload stress).

This is a bit out of date as VT is no longer using these “checksheets”, but this will give you an idea of the course work, which you’ll see has a good amount of business classes:

I believe they changed the Calc class to a lower level math. Candidly, when DD met with the BC advisor, he indicated the course work wasn’t super intense (although I’ve told her while she thinks things like Calc aren’t difficult, she could struggle with construction principles. ha!). But, sometimes you don’t need to “break rocks” if you don’t have to do so…clearly by majoring in BC, they’ll be quite employable.

Re: the internship, she went to the job fair just to check it out, get a feel if it was something that interest her, and get some experience talking to recruiters. We absolutely did NOT expect she was going to have any interest, much less land an internship. She called freaking out with the first email she got asking her to interview. We were really shocked at how fast things happened, and the interest level. If you’re in NOVA, there are probably far more internship opportunities. A former teammate of hers from HS is a sophomore at NCSU and majoring in their Const Mgmt engineering. He reached out to her yesterday after she told him about her internship. He contacted the same company that has offered her a position, and has an interview. He’s a year older, but I don’t know if recruiters are going to other colleges like they are VT, and/or are the engineering kids just not savvy…I’m a bit curious what is different because from what I gather, the recruiters at VT were snapping up summer interns in the fall.

As for VT in general…I’m bias, I’m an alum. Frankly, VT wasn’t DD’s first choice bc it was OOS and she was all googly eyed over UNC. VT was really her #3. We’ve been talking about how a year ago, she had different aspirations. She ended up being waitlisted by UNC…CollegeNerd that replied above talked me a little bit off a ledge…:crazy_face:. NCSU was her #2, but she struggled to love it…but then after another VT visit, it was clear it was the right fit. Ironically now that she’s thinking of BC, that wouldn’t have been an option at UNC or NCSU (well, she would have had to be engineer - she’s great at math but doesn’t love it). She really loves VT, and she thinks it’s a beautiful school, especially after living there. It can be a bit ‘gray’ in the winter, but we think it’s far prettier than alot of red brick campuses. Again, I’m a bias alum & parent, but there is something special at VT.

Few last points - here’s a link to the spring job fair. If you scroll down to the student section, you can see who will be there…it’ll give you an idea of who is looking for VT students. Career Fair | Myers-Lawson School of Construction | Virginia Tech
And here’s some info about Hitt Hall and the investment they’re making: Virginia Tech dedicates Hitt Hall | Virginia Tech News | Virginia Tech

Again, any further questions, I’ll be happy to try to help.

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Thank you again! All of this is super helpful. As a parent of an engineering student who has put out over 90 applications for summer internships (and his GPA is 3.96 and he’s a CivE and MechE double major, so no slouch in the academics area although he is being a little picky on what he wants for the summer) let me tell you, the employability aspect of this is really, really appealing.

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Hey, me again. RE: VT BC, you may have already come across this, but since DD is switching majors, we’re sort of learning as we go about BC.

There appears to be is an accelerated program for a Master’s of Science in Building Construction Science & Management. If I’m reading the website correctly, there is an opportunity to earn a Masters while as an undergrad. I only have what information I found on their website, but my daughter is going to ask her BC advisor (Shelton Norwood) about the program, so she can plan accordingly her junior year. If there is the ability to get a Masters, especially without extra time, or money, it seems like a no-brainer to me. For more info, go here, and scroll down to “Accelerated Master Program”.

Here’s more info: Master of Science in Building Construction Science and Management | Myers-Lawson School of Construction | Virginia Tech

My daughter attended her Intro to BC II class yesterday. For reference, there are only 2 sessions, and she said there was maybe 50 kids in it. They graduated 18 in Dec with BC degrees (and 12 in Const Mgmt E), I’m sure that number is far higher in the spring…but still very clearly a small program. You also mentioned not finding an info sessions…I’d reach to the dept and ask for a virtual or in person one on one session. They seem pretty accommodating and my daughter has been impressed with her interactions with advising.

Hopefully you get some good news from VT soon. Predicting admission decisions will break your heart, but seriously, your S25 shouldn’t have any issues if he applied as a BC major.

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Well THAT’S super cool and interesting! I’ll have to tell him - that’s the kind of thing that can push the needle I think to move VT up higher for him. I’m planning on doing another in-person visit (again, assuming he gets in, I don’t want to jinx anything) and we’ll definitely reach out to the BC Department to see if they can get something scheduled to talk with someone or at least walk through the space.

And thank you for the size metrics. I think a smaller program will feel better for him. One of the things I think he really liked about Clemson was that it felt cozier, partly because it’s simply like 10k fewer students. I think a smaller, cozier cohort might help. When we visited VT last spring he was thinking of being a geography major, with a focus on urban planning (we hadn’t yet found their BC program, and he knew he didn’t want the engineering program). We were both really charmed by how personalized the Environmental Science college (where geography lives) visit was - it felt like a small family. So I think that could be a definite positive for him.

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I thought the Masters option was pretty cool too. Clearly the job market right now is super hot. I’m not sure the Masters matters currently for employment purposes, but long term, it could make a difference. And again, if it doesn’t cost additional time or money (which is HUGE IMO), why not if they can handle the additional coursework (which may not be a bad thing for my daughter to keep her focused :wink: ).

From what I gather, it sounds like it’s a fairly cozy cohort. Shelton Norwood is the primary advisor for those changing majors, but he also seems to be the advisor for the most, if not all, the students she knows in BC so far. The few parents I’ve spoken with have talked about how it’s a “family like” atmosphere. There is a “hard hatting” ceremony at graduation, and on the FB VT Parents page, they raved about how that’s their favorite part of graduation weekend. There are plenty of complaints about things among VT Parents, but so far I haven’t see anything negative about BC/School of Construction, only positive feedback.

I read closer the comments above and how Clemson’s program is in the ARCH school. My D said when she met with Norwood, he told her the BC program has bounced around a bit. It was under ARCH, and then in maybe in another college for a minute, but then they combined it with the engineering degree (who was already using the name “Mgmt” so they couldn’t use that ;-)) formed the School of Const, and stuck it under COE, but it’s sort of the odd man out there. And Norwood stressed to her they have a 100% job placement AT graduation. He said “lots of programs say they have 100% job placement but that’s after they graduate.” He’s (rightfully so) proud of that stat.

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RE: your second visit. You mentioned S25 was an athlete. We lucked out when we made a 2nd visit last Feb. I have a middle school son that wrestles, and both kids play lacrosse, and D24 also swam. The weekend we returned had a wrestling match v. Duke in the Moss Art Center. We attended that on Fri PM after going to a Pamplin info session during the afternoon (and grabbing dinner at Cabo Fish Taco). We attended the ‘official’ tour on Sat AM (where we ran into old friends from NoVA), ate lunch downtown, then caught the last half of the D1 Women’s lax game. We drove up to the Marching VA’ians field to watch the Men’s Club lax team play JMU for a bit, then came back to Cassell Coliseum to watch more wrestling (v. Mason) before heading home. With exception to the wrestling match in the Moss Center, all the athletic events were free.

Even though it was a bit cold & gray, that weekend sealed the deal for her (despite going to 2 wrestling matches, which are not her favorite). She could imagine herself there, and liked the energy. So if your kid likes sports, pick a good sports weekend… :wink:

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That’s an excellent idea (picking a sports weekend). Lots of things were not lined up particularly well when we last visited. We visited on a Friday afternoon - had a 11:00 info session with the Environmental Science college and then a 1:00 tour. Which wouldn’t have bad, except we left from our house… four and a half hours away. So we left the house around 5:45 and had a LONG drive before we got there. The info session was good, so that was a nice start, and then a Geography major went to lunch with us - and that was fine, but it was a Friday in Lent, and we don’t eat meat on Friday in Lent, so we just had the pasta and marinara sauce - which was fine, but I would’ve liked to try something more interesting. Then by the time our 1:00 tour rolled around, there weren’t very many students out and about walking on campus. So it just wasn’t the best and he didn’t get a great vibe from it. We did catch up with a friend of my older son’s, who then walked us around some more and that was fun but, still, didn’t feel as upbeat and school spirit-y as I know they are. So we need to try again.