<p>The guidance counselor will have to indicate on the recommendation form that the student took the most rigorous classes available at the high school. Ask the GC if this would make any difference at this point. It is possible that both classes are considered equivalent in rigor by your high school and the GC will indicate this.
If there is a difference, then consider the pros and cons. I agree with the others that if she’s going to be stressed and miserable with hours of extra work- then it may be more worthwhile for her to use her time in her other classes/activities. Also, since AP is fairly standard- and the students are pretty fluent by the AP/Spanish 5 year- the Spanish 5 class may have more creative leeway to pursue something your D might really enjoy- like more conversation or cultural material. She may be happier choosing something she is interested in.
Since language classes are so variable, many colleges require students to take a placement test before starting, so it may not make much difference at that point.</p>
<p>Cheermom, is your D planning to take other AP courses senior year? If she’s got some of the tough math/science APs she would probably be fine without AP Spanish. If she’s more of a social science/humanities kid, I’d probably have her take the AP Spanish course. I don’t think it would be a “big red flag” NOT to take the AP course, but I think it would strengthen her application to take it. </p>
<p>I know that you have concerns about Freshman Connection at UMD. A lot of my D2s friends started in that program. They all lived in luxury apartments at The View or The Varsity freshman year. They did feel a bit like second class citizens, but made friends, joined sororities and were firmly entrenched at UMD by the end of Freshman year. The program isn’t the ideal way to start college, but none of my D’s friends regret choosing Maryland.</p>
<p>Susanmw, congrats on the great acceptances for your triplets. I can’t even imagine how challenging the process was for your family.</p>
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<p>This is important, but again, look at the target colleges. For the “B student,” do they need “most rigorous?” Just be sure to balance the rigorous schedule with your student’s ability and motivation.</p>
<p>For both my kids, they always got A’s in French and then looked in horror at AP test questions. It was as if 6 years of studying a foreign language was just B.S. Did you ever go to a dance recital and the little kids acted as if they had never seen or practiced the dance before even tho they rehearsed for 9 months? That’s how the AP test was for my kids.</p>
<p>^^^
What Vitrac said.<br>
My son took the AP Spanish exam after Spanish 6 Advanced and bombed it. Luckily, he was a STEM-type with lots of good scores on those APs, so it really didn’t matter except that he had to take Spanish freshman year in college.</p>
<p>So just to chime in, my son is a strong Spanish student. Always took honors through 11th grade. Because he struggles with time management, his teacher recommended he skip AP Spanish and do the college credit/honors level version instead. The result is that he is finding it too easy, but I am not assuming that AP would have been a better fit either.
From my own experience, I took AP French my senior year, back in the Stone age. 
It was not too hard, just the same as every other honors French class. At college, I took the placement exam (required) and placed at the highest level - 300 level classes. There were 3 of us in that class who were freshmen. One girl had taken French since 1st grade in a special program. She is now a French teacher. The other person, besides me, was Haitian. This was a grammar class. He was a native speaker and struggled a great deal in that class. I came to realize right away that being a native speaker (especially if it’s a patois, or other variant on the standard spoken language) is not very helpful for knowing the rules of grammar and conjugation. For those of us who learned it “by the book” instead of as a native tongue, we ironically had it easier.
Anyway, my final thought on the AP Spanish, so far a rigor on a HS record, is that it is possible to take the class, get into college, and not bother to pay for or study for the exam. That seems like a very viable option if the workload is managable and the goal is to impress admissions.
PS I switched from a minor in French to a double major in French after I started filling the major requirements very quickly, which can happen when you skip the low level classes and I loved it!</p>
<p>All good advice, pros and cons. Many thanks to all!</p>
<p>I emailed the Spanish 4 teacher and got a quick response. Apparently Cheergirl “…struggles with prepositions and occasionally vocabulary, but gets A’s because she sticks with it and does the work…” Who knew? After all these years of being a mom, I still keep forgetting that sometimes the teachers in the classrooms do actually know more about the right academic fit for my child than I do.</p>
<p>Sooo, looks like we’ll stick with Honors Spanish 5. No shame there IMO. Other AP’s are Lang and Calc. Three recommended so it’s back to the course catalog tonight.</p>
<p>ddahwan–great story…words of wisdom! <smile!></smile!></p>
<p>momjr–Thanks for the support and kind words! I’m seeing exceptional kids at Cheergirl’s HS get Freshman Connection for Fall 2013. Staggering GPA’s and test scores, spectacular EC’s, and probably outstanding essays and L or R’s. I’ve made my peace with FC and vigorously rubbed Testudo’s nose on Saturday to let the UMD gods know! While its too soon to give up hope, Cheergirl’s test scores will probably be her weakness. So, I’ll probably be grateful for FC when the time comes!</p>
<p>D (my B student ) has taken APUSH, AP Calc A and B, AP English (2 yrs) and APES. So far she’s only taken one AP exam, Calc B, after <em>two</em> years of calc, and she did miserably. She’s gotten B’s (and a few C’s) in her AP courses but enjoyed being in them. She’s a lousy test-taker, and we haven’t pushed her to take any of the exams. For the “B colleges” she applied to, it didn’t really seem to matter that she hadn’t taken exams (she didn’t report them on the CA), but I’m sure the fact that she’d pushed herself in AP courses helped with admissions (and merit awards).</p>
<p>Pardon my ignorance, but what is Freshman Connection?</p>
<p>Freshman Connection at UMD is for those students who are accepted in the spring. They are given the opportunity to live off-campus and take classes on campus during a certain block of afternoon/early evening time during the fall semester. A very good friend of my daughter was in it last semester, loved it and had no problems acclimating.
We went to Accepted Students Day on Friday and while I thought my daughter was going to get caught up in the excitement of the day, the exact opposite happened. She felt overwhelmed by the large campus & the chaotic nature of the day. I didn’t think UMD did a particularly good job of changing anything from when we attended a large informational session a year ago. Our housing tour was led by a staff member who had difficulty answering the most basic of questions. I’m so disappointed because I thought we’d go down and have the day seal the deal for her. So it’s on to Elon Thursday…and I thought getting my twins into college was going to be hard. They were a piece of cake compared to this child!</p>
<p>Shulamit–You raised an excellent point. I learned alot about the AP process this semester as a result of Cheergirl’s extended bout of mono. </p>
<p>She has 3 AP’s, 3 Honors, and an elective. Her top priority when she recovered was to learn the course material so she wouldn’t be lost 4th quarter, and wouldn’t destroy her second semester GPA. The least important thing to her (and to me) was AP testing in May. And we decided she would opt-out of the testing this year. BUT, the school badgered her to take the tests…and here’s the reason why:</p>
<p>Before reaching the decision about AP testing, we spoke to the GC and asked if colleges (1) KNEW, or (2) CARED if AP tests were taken. The answers to both questions were “NO.” Armed with this information, coupled with the fact that each test was $79, she reached her initial decision to opt-out. TBH, she wasn’t taking AP in order to get college credit, she was taking AP to bolster her college apps. Big difference.</p>
<p>Eventually, she learned that if she takes the AP exams, she can opt out of the final exams, and is essentially done, for all intents and purposes. KA-POW! THAT was the incentive for my challenged test-taker to badger Mommy to write the check. And since Mommy bears the brunt of the test anxiety, Mommy gave in. </p>
<p>QUESTION: At the end of the day, who benefits most from AP testing (besides students who desire college credit, and College Board, which rakes in mega bucks)? ANSWER: The state, the county, and the school. On February 20, 2013, College Board announced that “Maryland students have achieved yet another NUMBER ONE national ranking in Advanced Placement success…The College Board said this was the seventh consecutive year that Maryland has led the nation in AP success.” </p>
<p>According to Governor O’Malley, this means that “Maryland has the number one public school system in the country.” Maybe they do, and maybe they don’t, I’m not equipped to know. Hell, I hope so…I’ve had kids in Maryland public schools since 1991! But, I do feel strongly that it takes more than AP data to reach that conclusion.</p>
<p>Bottom line, I’m not calling the AP industry a “scam,” but I am saying that it serves many other interests besides my own, when my children take AP classes and engage in AP testing. I could go on and on…but I won’t! Just to mess with someone’s head next year, it seems likely that Cheergirl will take Honors Spanish 5, but will still sit for AP Spanish exam in May 2014. Why? Because she can! College Board said so. :)</p>
<p>I came into this language discussion a bit late, but my since my S2 is a true B student and the teachers recommended 2 AP’s for senior year, and he is taking 3 anyway in the areas that interest him in STEM, then I have absolutely no problem with him taking regs English and Spanish 5.</p>
<p>He’ll take AP Physics C, AP Calc AB and AP Computer Science along with regular English and Spanish.</p>
<p>Every child is different…my S1 could not get enough of languages and not only took AP but also devised an independent study to gain more language knowledge. Do what you think is best for THIS child. Ask the child what they want to do!</p>
<p>^^ I agree with chocchipcookie. My DS, who is happily taking AP Chem, AP Phys C and AP Calc AB, wanted no part of AP in either English (AP Lit) or SS (AP Comp Govt or Econ). If the GC would have told him he needed another AP, he would have added AP Bio.</p>
<p>When his soph year teachers were recommending courses for junior year (that’s how it works in our school), EVERY teacher recommended him for AP. Individually, he could have done them. But not together. He and I decided which ones would be best for him.</p>
<p>P.S. In our HS, the school pays AP testing fees.</p>
<p>P.P.S. As I scour the Miami website and FB pages these days, I found a FREE online prep class for the AP Calc test. Two one-hour sessions per week, starting next week through the exam. And they are recorded if you can’t watch live. Sent DS the link in case he’s interested.</p>
<p>jaynebe–Good simple description of FC. </p>
<p>Essentially, it’s partially deferred acceptance. Obviously, we know dozens of families who’ve opted for FC and seems as if none have regretted this choice. Some choose to live in College Park at the View or the Varsity, as mentioned by momjr. Some local kids choose to live at home and commute to class for the fall semester. Others choose to attend community college fall semester and then continue at UMD in January.</p>
<p>jaynebe–Which option was chosen by your daughter’s friend? If she chose to live in CP, did she continue to live there second semester since she signed a lease? That’s my biggest concern. Do you finish out the year at the View or the Varsity, or sub-lease and attempt to transition to a dorm? </p>
<p>Wintriest–Good for you for supporting your daughter in the AP maze. Did her school push (or badger lol!) her to test?</p>
<p>Is it possible the students who are being offered Freshman Connection at UMCP despite top credentials did not apply by the priority deadline? One thing our guidance department stressed was that if you’re applying to UMCP, you really MUST apply by the priority deadline. It’s not “early action,” it really is the main cohort and anyone after that isn’t considered for merit scholarships and is competing for a few spots leftover after the priority cohort. Just a thought?</p>
<p>As to AP tests…I think schools vary even within the state, perhaps because some schools are focused on their own Washington Post “challenge index” and others are not. My daughter received very little encouragement to take AP classes and no pressure whatsoever to take the exams. We were told at back-to-school night that a substantial proportion of the students in the AP French class don’t take the test, because by May they know where they are going to college and whether or not that score is going to help them in any way. Some schools don’t give credit for it, or some kids may be at the maximum credits their school will give, or whatever reason. This didn’t seem to be an issue. They didn’t care one way or the other if the kids took the test.</p>
<p>I know the school up the road offers AP history to freshman, and sophomores routinely take one or more AP courses. At that school, it’s a matter of course to graduate with 8-10 AP tests under your belt. I didn’t even know that was possible, because in my day, AP courses were only available to juniors seniors and there were precious few of them. It never occurred to me to press my daughter to take AP courses until junior year, when she took ONE. Elsewhere, I’ve read that kids do not get their GPA weighting points for AP courses if they don’t take the exam! (I am not sure whether that school pays the fees…)</p>
<p>I also didn’t know until reading this message board that kids could sign up for AP tests for courses they hadn’t taken and that the tests were, in some cases, easy enough that one could get college credit for reading a prep book. (I found this depressing. I am quite sure I learned more in my Psych 1 class in college than a 16 year-old reading a Barron’s prep book, and it is a little depressing to think they’re considered the same, but, whatever…) Once my daughter had chosen a college and we could see how many credits and course requirements she could get out of if only she had taken AP history…we signed her up and bought a prep book! And she did do well enough on the test to get 6 credits, satisfy a general education requirement, and check two required courses off for her major!</p>
<p>So…I’m not huge fan of the APs. I think it’s a racket in many cases and the high school rankings place entirely too much emphasis on this aspect of curriculum. I don’t think a class has to be geared to the AP test to be a rigorous and challenging class! BUT, I have to admit, it was a very good deal for my daughter!</p>
<p>cheermom: My BFF’s daughter did FC at UMDCP. (They are not in-state.) She lived in one of the apartments you mentioned (I don’t know which one), and stayed there for the entire school year. Since then, she has lived in her sorority house (now a junior).</p>
<p>jaynebe: I remember the journey with your twins (esp DS). Sorry this time around it’s difficult too! And that your day at UMD wasn’t what you expected but it’s good to find out now. I will share your story with my neighbor who is sending her DS to Miami over UMD. While UMD engineering is highly ranked, she was worried about how overwhelming the size would be for him (and she is probably right). It was also the reason why I’m glad that DD picked UD over UMD’s FC program. UD is so manageable!</p>
<p>Deskpotato: My DD applied to UMD by the priority date (all apps were in by mid October!). She just didn’t have top stats, particularly ACT/SAT. That was the problem. My friend’s DD also applied by priority date; while she had top test scores, her GPA was lacking. My DS also applied by priority deadline this year - admitted into College Park Scholars - he had both the test scores and the GPA.</p>
<p>A friend of my daughter’s did freshman connection this fall, commuting from home. She didn’t choose to move onto campus in the spring although she could have. I think she enjoyed keeping her term-time job at the local theater school, and was just as happy to keep commuting. I am not sure what she is doing next fall.</p>
<p>Not sure that this is the right place to post but…does anyone have a college kid who went on Birthright Israel with Hillel? So excited,my daughter has been accepted for the summer trip!</p>
<p>My DD school is very selective about APs courses and does not allow them to take them if they are not sure they are sure to get 4 or 5 on the test. So she was only allowed to take this year AP Spanish (Groundhog Day) and AP Cal AB, but for next year she is approved for AP Bio, AP Enviro and AP Cal BC. My question is: do colleges really care about senior APs as much as junior APs?</p>
<p>Cheermom, my daughter’s friend lives in the View, staying all year. She loves it there and doesnt feel removed at all from campus. She’s met many great friends and they all decided to stay even though some of them had the option of sub-leasing…We passed by on Friday and it is no farther away (maybe even closer) from campus than most of the freshmen dorms! On Saturday another friend who was accepted to FC signed her lease for the upcoming year at the Varsity. Apparently, there are over 750 kids living there next year! If Maryland was a dream school for my kid, I wouldn’t hesitate to enroll them into FC.
Linymom, it appeared that this was going to be easier. That’s what happened when you let your guard down ;-)</p>