<p>Hey, Wisconsin has a lot of depts that are competitive with Harvard in quality and even facilities–sciences, languages, a bunch that Harvard lacks and most of the others are very good. What do you lose unless your goal is Wall Street? UW is not Texas El Paso.</p>
<p>We found it interesting to view dorms, but somewhat pointless, since there is such a range of dorms available at most colleges. You could see a dorm, and your child could get into a completely different one.</p>
<p>^^^ Agreed on the differences in dorm rooms. We’ve never cut a school due to not seeing one and there are several tours that don’t show them (others do).</p>
<p>I’ll also chime in that middle son definitely had high Harvard stats - but no interest in the school. IF he had applied and gotten in he’d have still chosen elsewhere for his desired fit. It’s not for everyone. No school is. Again, that’s what makes this thread so interesting…</p>
<p>We were in Cambridge visiting a friend when my son was a sophomore in high school. We walked around the Harvard campus for a little while, but not for a tour. My son’s first observation was that there was “no way” he would go there. He said everyone looked unhappy and stressed.</p>
<p>Another who understands why Wisconsin would trump Harvard. UW does have some excellent academics, available to those who choose them. The UW campus can also be perceived as a lot nicer. H and I saw the Harvard campus- far too gloomy for me. We happened to cross their quad in September on the afternoon they were showcasing their clubs. I understand why many would not want the Harvard experience. It is not for all elite students. Our son visited MIT and refused to go the few blocks to see Harvard (hence the parental visit on an east coast vacation when he was in college elsewhere). Son also refused to complete his Princeton application or visit Yale on the way to the Princeton campus. The atmosphere at some elite colleges is a turn off to some of the gifted.</p>
<p>Yes, my son visited U. Penn and refused to apply, even though he was a double legacy. He didn’t mind the city environment, but he didn’t like the pretentiousness.</p>
<p>We toured Princeton, but DD did not apply. She would not even tour Harvard or MIT. She applied and was accepted to Chicago, but went elsewhere following the money. </p>
<p>I would guess that a fairly high number of upper middle class kids who would be full pay are choosing the money over the status. They are smart in more than just books.</p>
<p>^ I couldn’t have said it better!</p>
<p>After visiting Harvard, my student thought it was too cold and unwelcoming. I think it was partly due to the lack of a student center. Harvard is obviously an outstanding academic institution, but it’s not for everyone.</p>
<p>Everyone’s got their hot points. I’ve been on tours where you’ve seen mock dorms, but more where you don’t. All information was available online (floor plans, detailed measurements, ceiling height, etc). A long line at the dining hall on move in day also wouldn’t alter my opinion. Not only are they serving new students unfamiliar with the flow, but often their parents as well. To be honest I don’t really understand the frustration over not seeing building X or facility Y. Tours are set up on any given day as instructed by the admissions office. If there’s something of interest you didn’t see we always double check when back at admissions if there’s a problem with exploring X, Y, or Z on our own. We’ve never been told no and sometimes been offered a guide if we wanted one. They can’t always anticipate what everyone is interested in seeing. </p>
<p>Personally, I look at the schools activities for the day before I plan a visit so I don’t run into something like move-in, visit from a well known person, accepted students day, etc. anything that is going to show the school in a different light. If I do run into a day with a lot of activity I certainly don’t blame it on the school when a quick check on my part could have given me the information.</p>
<p>I always like to see a dorm room on the tour, and when I was a tour guide, I liked showing them. But at most schools, it really tells you little about your own future living situation, because most of the time there’s a mix of grotty old dorms, flashy renovated or newly built dorms, wildly varying rooms within the same building, etc. This is one instance where a good res life web site that shows you ALL the dorms, dimensions, the odds of who’s going to live where, etc. can be more informative than seeing just one of the real thing.</p>
<p>Yes, instead of relying too much upon seeing one dorm room in one building, you would be better off checking to see the mix and amount of housing available through some online research. Are all of the freshman dorms old and un-renovated? Are freshmen forced to live in triples? How hard is it to get a room in upper class housing? Are students forced to live on campus a certain number of years? How expensive is off-campus housing? Does the upper class housing include kitchens? </p>
<p>I’ll always remember when Villanova showed us the oldest unrenovated residence hall on the campus and made all of the parents climb 3 flights of steps to see the one open room. Many people were huffing and puffing. It was housing for upper classmen. I thought that was strange at the time that they didn’t show us a newer residence hall, or at least one for freshmen. Then, later I found out that almost all of the freshmen residence halls were full of triples.</p>
<p>I think one of the values of seeing a dorm room/residence hall on a tour is not the room itself, but the information it evokes regarding gender distribution in the dorms/bathrooms. And yes, I’m one of those parents who embarrasses my kids by asking if the dorms are co-ed by room/floor/wing and if the bathrooms are coed. (I still don’t get the necessity of that one.) Another reason to split up parents and students on tours!</p>
<p>D14 hasn’t crossed any colleges off the list due to dorms, but she does have clear views about them. On one tour, the guide made a huge deal about two doubles sharing one private bathroom. D laughed and said that she would much rather have multiple separate showers, toilets and sinks down the hall shared with a bunch of girls than have a bathroom with the shower, toilet, and sink in one room shared by 4. “What would we do, put a schedule on the door?” Practical one, that D.</p>
<p>I made my son apply to Harvard because I thought he had a better chance of being accepted there than MIT which was his first choice. He liked it a lot better than he expected to when he visited for accepted students weekend and actually got to spend three full days with Harvard students, but he still ended up attending a different college (not MIT he didn’t get in), and that was fine too.</p>
<p>We saw dorms at some colleges, not at others. My older son thought it was pointless since “all dorm rooms are pretty much the same”. He didn’t really care about suites vs shared bathrooms and all the rest. As it happened at the college he ended up at, he visited a new dorm with tiny rooms on halls and ended up in an old apartment building with a huge one bedroom apartment that he shared with just one other person.</p>
<p>The most common reason I’ve been given by my daughter why she doesn’t like a school is “I don’t know it just doesn’t do it for me”. She’ll say the people are the nicest, the facilities the greatest and then follow up with the above quote. During the tour I’ll think she is not impressed and then several hours later she’ll say “I think I want to go there” No reason.</p>
<p>Our DD crossed off Claremont Mckenna after being turned off by the senior interviewer. The interviewer was what she called a “mean girl.” Talked a lot about partying and was very anti-intellectual. Obviously, she’s capable and smart because she’s in a highly selective school but there was no real love of learning that DD could see. DD felt that if that girl was who the college chose to represent them in interviews, then she really didn’t want to go there.</p>
<p>There were several others that were considerations prior to visiting but DD didn’t get a “good vibe” or didn’t like the city surrounding the school.</p>
<p>Just another thought about dorm tours. When I think about it, I think it’s amazing that any school would let random visitors go through the dorms when other students are living there. I don’t think most students would appreciate having strangers in their dorms while they are there.</p>
<p>Both of my kids ended up in dorms that looked completely different than the ones we were shown on tours at the colleges they ended up attending.</p>
<p>And another thought about tour guides. We gave less credibility to the personality of the tour guides than the administrative staff. They are the ones who really represent the university, and how welcoming or off-putting they were is more reflective of the school than a 20-y/o kid on work study. Their level of clarity, organization, warmth, and willingness to provide as much information as needed is important.</p>
<p>Just an aside about a school handling chaos. We happened to coincidentally plan a tour last Summer at Penn State on the same day that the sanctions were handed down against the school. The info. session staff literally led us past hoards of reporters to a quiet info. session room. Later, tour guides were wiping away tears before they took us on tours. But there were tons of volunteers, and no one missed a beat in terms of professionalism. It was pretty remarkable.</p>
<p>Just be careful about putting too much emphasis upon the helpfulness or coldness of the admissions staff. After you are accepted, you will never again deal with the admissions staff. If you want to judge the administration of a college, you are better off calling the financial aid office and seeing how you are treated.</p>