I think you captured well some of what I mean by the experience, but of course you are totally correct when you say it might not be for everyone, such as those who prefer always being in the middle of an urban area.
I think this is true for other students as well. For example, humanities and social sciences students to have long essays due for supervisions almost every week.
This did occur to me - hallowed halls and all that, not to mention even just drinking in the pub where Watson and Crick announced the structure of DNA (or in the one where Pink Floyd used to hang out in their early days, but that’s another matter!) - but again not sure if any of that is attractive to OP, given that they seem to view tradition as a “drawback”. Perhaps, they could explain exactly what it is about tradition that they see as a con? (Is it just things like wearing gowns for formal hall (formal dinners) for example, or other things?)
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Btw just as explanation for others, I’m sure OP understands this - students still get lectures with their cohorts in their departments, while the supervisions take place separately, usually in the colleges.
Actually, Cambridge NatSci students can also transfer to other STEM (e.g., engineering) and non-STEM majors (e.g., law, Asian and Middle Eastern Studies) but it requires more effort to make it happen and more limited windows to do so. (By contrast, it is nearly impossible at Oxford.)
Cambridge is famous the world over. Grad school outcomes are probably not going to be dependent on your undergrad education, at least not as far as these two universities are concerned.
Don’t you think Columbia is elitist? It costs $90k+ per year, for four years. Cambridge is less expensive, even including cost of living. I think you can consider also that NYC itself, with high ticket prices for nightclubs and shows, is very, very expensive. You could probably get the train to London and see a West End show for less. Are you getting enough financial aid so that 3 years at Cambridge will cost about the same as four years at Columbia? Remember to factor in the cost of living in NYC.
Consider the type of experience you want. Traditions are fun. May Balls are fun and an amazing experience you might never get at any other time of your life.
Having known a number of nerdy people who attended Cambridge and who loved the laid back and intellectual atmosphere you say you enjoy, you might not find it that easy to meet your fellow nerds at Columbia.
I’m definitely biased in favor of Cambridge, which is an absolutely beautiful small city. There is something very special about being in those surroundings. There is actually a lot more going on in that small city than you might think. The proximity to Luton airport, which is easy to get to from Cambridge, means you can take advantage of short, cheap flights all over Europe.
You have two great options, but I think Cambridge is a once in a lifetime opportunity to get more than just a top notch education.
Edit: In regards to @SJ2727 reference to a magical aspect, I believe they refer to the sense of history and beauty in the city itself. Many great historical figures studied in the colleges of Cambridge and it continues to be extremely influential, especially in the sciences. There is something to be said for immersing your mind and your body in an environment that continues, even in the present day, to feel ancient and modern at the same time, with all the benefits of amazing experiences that you simply can’t get in many other places in the world. You might find NYC exciting for a bit, but it can be very overwhelming after a short while. It’s down to deciding if you prefer apples or oranges I guess.
Agree with everything except the high prices for NYC shows.
NYC students get passes for free admission to loads of museums; galleries (commercial art galleries) have fantastic, often once in a lifetime shows which are ALWAYS free; many students usher at various venues so they see anything they want for free. There is no getting around the price of dorms and a meal plan and restaurant food is incredibly expensive, but the cultural life of NY can be at your doorstep. And that’s not including the free or almost free concerts, plays, etc. that take place on other college campuses in NYC. NY Public Library (always free) has both permanent exhibits and rotating exhibits of its artwork, ephemera, rare books, etc. which rivals many museums around the world.
Students who are paying big bucks for entertainment are no doubt eating sushi and going to clubs (drinking age is 21 and usually enforced) but they are NOT paying for the rest of it.
Student passes- yes!
Cambridge is indeed magical. But it is not urban (small, charming, historic city) and if that’s on someone’s wish list, students are NOT heading into London every time they’ve got a craving for whatever.
However, there are a lot of students at Oxbridge in general who sleep on a friend’s sofa after a night out in London. Speaking from the knowledge acquired from friends and family over decades, but no, they definitely aren’t doing that every weekend. Going out is pretty cheap in Cambridge compared to NYC, but of course, the options are limited.
But do students in NYC even go to shows regularly? Mine didn’t (she got discounted not free tickets), though did make fair use of the free museums (Cambridge doesn’t have the met and moma of course, but it does have the Fitz and some really interesting other ones.. the Whipple museum of the history of science is fascinating). Other than that - pubs (both college pubs and in town) and restaurants, not the variety of NYC of course but enough and who knows you may see someone perform as part of Cambridge footlights before they get famous! But - we don’t even know what OP is interested in doing outside of school, though I assume there are reasons they are attracted to the big city.
(I feel my bias is showing… but though I know NY very well I have no direct knowledge of Columbia other than a relation who studied there for grad school so that’s not directly applicable to the undergrad experience)
To be fair, if OP is not from the UK they may not have friends around to leverage, compared to many British students.
Perhaps this has been mentioned upthread already but you mention you’re from the UK. If you have intentions of staying in the UK post-graduation, then I would advise attending the UK school, and vice versa if you have intentions for staying in the US long-term.
Unfortunately, American employers, even white collar professionals, tend to be parochial and/or risk-adverse, and so unless you go into academia or encounter a very enlightened American, Cambridge is a bit of a black box for most others, as in… “hmm, Cambridge – I think it is excellent but I don’t know exactly how it stacks versus the US schools I know”.
Sorry for the late reply. Probably leaning Cambridge. I’m trying to stay unbiased but basically everyone I’ve talked to has said to go to Cambridge. The academics there are preferable to me. I’m not sure about the other factors; experiential is worse, culture is probably better. Columbia is also going through its fair share of issues at the moment.
I do kind of feel as though I would get a greater breadth of experiences going to the US. My (maybe incorrect) conception is that if I go to Cambridge my life is going to revolve solely on academics for the next few years, whereas there is more variety to be had in the US. I’m still on the waitlist at some other schools and I might prefer some of them over Cambridge. Ultimately I’ve been trying to stick with the mindset that neither of these is a wrong choice, just different.
I can summarize some common themes having friends in both the US and UK
UK: More academic, universities are about scholarship (in the sense of studying a specific academic discipline deeply). Oxbridge is communual but most other schools are commuter schools. The biggest things you aim for are thesis prizes and course performance rankings (in individual classes). Generally, this means the UK system is better for traditional academic subjects like Chemistry, Physics, Maths, Literature, Economics etc.
US: More applied. Universities are about employment outcomes and getting graduates ROI on their tuition, be it through “prestigious” jobs (UN, World Bank) or high-paying jobs (finance, consulting). As a result, most universitiy students spend only half or less of their time on coursework; the rest is spent on “applied” activities and extracurriculars, including labs, model UN, volunteering, finance and consulting clubs, leadership programs etc. The US system is thus strongest for applied subjects like Business, Computer Science, Public Policy (not Political Science), Engineering etc. which require hands-on exposure or projects.
One other advantage is that the flexibility of the US system makes getting research experience easier than in the UK, where apparently even Oxford undergrads have trouble getting, at least during term time: Reddit - Please wait for verification
I don’t know about Oxford, but Cambridge has Silicon Fen and I would imagine there are internships available. I don’t know if UK residency is an issue though /what student visas allow.
Going by what my D22 has shared with me, no undergrad does research as an EC or part-time job during term time. While there are some summer STEM research opportunities for undergrads in the UK, they are much more limited compared to the US.
My D22 did come across summer research opportunities at leading UK universities (Imperial, Oxford, Cambridge) but opted to do internships in the US and Asia instead. As an aside, Oxbridge STEM undergrads appear to be attractive to research labs outside the UK and it is not uncommon to find them in places like Caltech, Stanford, Kyoto, etc. during their summer breaks.
I asked my current Oxford student who basically said there’s not enough hours in the day to do all the work expected while maintaining a “non monastic lifestyle”. So, during term time, no research and no externships. (He actually laughed a bit.) Cambridge would be closer to this experience AFAIK.
In the US, at competitive universities, splitting your time between academic learning and experiential learning would be considered par for the course, so it’d be a major difference.
So, perhaps, on the one hand, 3 academically focused, physics/stem years infused with traditions that’ll make you part of a centuries old experience
OR
4 years where you learn many different things through very different approaches (lectures, seminars, discussions, research, externship, club leadership) as part of a “city that never sleeps”.
Both are superb choices, there’s no wrong choice here, and it all comes down to what YOU want. Lucky* you, an embarrassment of riches
(*I know you made your own luck here but hopefully you get my point )
IME, it would not. Academic term-time internships aren’t a thing in England and Wales - at least not at the Oxbridge-level schools. As noted, the time simply doesn’t exist. Similarly, term breaks aren’t synonymous with holiday/vacation; they are time to at least try to catch up on academics, which during the term is akin to drinking water from a fire hose
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Cambridge and Oxford may be different, but the experience at Cambridge would be more similar to the experience at Oxford than Oxford to a US college?
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