It will probably not interest you to know that most religious people (though, by no means all) consider themselves ‘conservative’ by definition. Here, we are not talking about your caricatured ‘fringe’, but rather your average American–it’s a distinction of Americans to be religious in fact. Most of us are. It is also safe to say that–more than any other reason–our freedoms devolved out of the frictions and blessings that accompany very religious people. There are counter examples to this freedom offered in our time by irreligious peoples.</p>
<p>By the way, I am an American, or rather a hopeful American and, regrettably, I have a visceral reaction to cynicism and hate.</p>
<p>My children are American citizens, and Canadians by birth. They also have a very positive, and realistic, outlook on life that leaves little time for hate.</p>
<p>The people we have brought on are YOUNG. They are earning upper middle-class money and buying homes even in this expensive area so it is out there if you know where to look. Also none of them went to expensive privates–they are all local state school grads so I don’t think they are carrying huge debts.
I am switching to a new firm in a few weeks and we will want to hire 10 people over the next year or two. That’s 10 jobs that pay over $100k with a little effort and training. We will have a hard time filling those as many people are afraid to work without a guaranteed income.</p>
<p>Compassion and the bush administration-two terms which clearly have no nexus.</p>
<p>An administration that has sent America’s sons and daughters (2000+ and still counting and counting and counting…) to die over a miscalculated war, based on lies and deceit with no end in sight and no plan in place. At least Nixon pretended he had a plan to end the Vietnam war, these clowns don’t even bother. I believe it’s over two years ago that W in his “member’s only” flight jacket announced “mission accomplished” (give me a break).</p>
<p>An administration that sat on its hands while New Orleans submerged;</p>
<p>An administration that does virtually nothing as gas and heating oil prices spiral out of sight;</p>
<p>An administration that “outs” its own intelligence officers to pursue their blind agression in the destruction of any perceived enemy (Jack Wilson how dare you speak against Dick and W’s plans)</p>
<p>An administration that abhores scientific inquiry (or pretty much the investigation of any topic) </p>
<p>An administration that longs for a time when evolution was a treasonous subject and women were chattel (and abortion issues, at least in part, do stem from the dawn of time as “property” issues and the view of women as chattel)</p>
<p>compassion and the bush administration? - LOL</p>
<p>barrons, I realize that for you this is all some partisan battle and who wins and loses “power”. Sorry for looking beyond that, I know you don’t get that concept. From my experience the party isn’t the issue, that’s just more of “meet the new boss, same as the old boss”.</p>
<p>BTW, this entire nation, this entire world is presently “losing”. No one needs to wait for 2008 for more of that. </p>
<p>In any event, I’m open to education, why don’t you tell me what “lies” I have referenced or is it just that any view that doesn’t agree with yours must be a lie (guess maybe I’ll get “Wilsoned” how dare I present a view different then yours here in the Dark Ages).</p>
<p>Would you consider hiring a Democratic left-wing liberal? I work plenty hard as a (substitute) teacher, and I only make 15.38/hour, at least according to my latest paycheck. </p>
<p>You did say over $100K/year and under 80 hours/week, right?</p>
<p>Oh, and you did say you valued education? DO you vote for better pay for teachers?</p>
<p>On another topic entirely:
I donate to the Union Gospel Mission here in Seattle (despite my religious beliefs as an atheist) because I support the vast majority of what they are doing (<a href=“http://www.ugm.org/AboutMission.asp)%5B/url%5D”>http://www.ugm.org/AboutMission.asp)</a>. Perhaps they proselytize–but they also provide showers and a place for the homeless to get mail and make phone calls. And <em>someone</em> has to do that.</p>
<p>Compassion implies the ability to stand outside oneself and see things from another’s perspective. This administration–with its intolerance of criticism, its reluctance to admit mistakes, its unwillingness to compromise, its myopic worldview–lacks the imaginative sympathy to qualify as compassionate. Not all conservatives lack this vision, but I’m now convinced that George Bush does. The irony, of course, is that the qualities that make compassion difficult for Bush also make him weak. Like any paper tiger, his strength is illusory, the product of a narrow arrogance that leaves him vulnerable to unexpected forces to which he must succumb (as in the Miers nomination) or against which he must battle blindly (as in Iraq). One doesn’t have to disagree with George Bush’s policies to realize he is not a good leader, which is part of the reason his poll numbers have fallen to the point that his approval rating is just above the percentage of people who identify themselves as conservative. When you squander the good will of the world and lose the approval of all but your staunchest supporters, it’s likely the result of a lack of vision–and vision is at the heart of genuine compassion.</p>
<p>I’m $84,000 in educational debt. My activities today include tutoring high schoolers, charity work, and driving a friend to a store who cannot take herself - all this, on top of law school work. I always vote for more funding for public school systems. I give blood as often as I can. I haven’t touched meat or fish in the better part of a decade. </p>
<p>But I’m an evil fat-cat. </p>
<p>May I kindly tell Laura et al. to shove it? Please, until you’ve met me, don’t tell me that I’m evil or lacking in compassion and a brain. </p>
<p>I’ve gone to school with liberals and conservatives. The liberals complain a lot, but the conservatives are always the first to volunteer for any community activity. Just a thought.</p>
<p>ariesathena considering you haven’t been on this thread before, why do you think I called you an evil fat cat?? Why did you call yourself one? In what group do you think you fit??
2. Excuse me, all you French haters…they were right not to enter the Iraq war, there were no weapons of mass destruction. The knew this was not a good war and would be impossible to win easily. Do you hate them, because they were right and we didn’t listen? I still don’t get why everyone hates them, they were right, we were wrong…or at least Bush and his admin was wrong. I personally was right.
3. More reasons I’m angry:
A country where they must keep a brain dead woman alive AT ALL COSTS, but refuse to offer health care to people who actually might not die, if they had health care when they need it.
A country where states rights are important, unless it’s Oregon where they voted 2 times for a Dignity to die Act for people who are dying and don’t want the pain for too long. Our compassionate government feels that they shouldn’t miss any of the pain and torture of dying a long drawn out death…Oh that’s right torture is okay in certain cases.
A government who believes gays should NOT be allowed to marry, but the right wing is worried they will proposition others…for goodness sakes they should be happily married and committed to one person if you feel that way. BTW Penguins have the same percentage of gay members as we have…it’s a natural phenomena.
A government where a veterinarian should be named the overseer of women’s health…,… Lobbyists should run the government and lead us in our energy plan (you see where that got us!) No conservation and a lot of high bills.
I’ll continue later…I’m still feeling a bit angry and know there’s more where that came from…a land of NO logic…but a lot of power.
Actually I though of where Bush’s idea’s for governing come from ! After watching “horror House” last night, where a Halloween haunted house scares children into becoming true believers in God and religion I realized it was very much like our current government! Scare the crap out of everyone and they turn to the admin to lead them to safely. Too bad it doesn’t work very well. Fema and Katrina blew that idea AND the fact there was info about the hijackers of 9/11 before the fact and this admin. and the FBI.hadn’t a clue how to read a memo or deal with it. Hero’s only in their own minds, not in facts. All you conservatives can try to whitewash this, but the facts are so clearly evident.</p>
<p>I believe Aries’ point was that your anti-conservative rants are offensive and insulting, whether one self-identifies as a conservative or is labeled so by you.</p>
<p>Ariesathena: up to now, I’ve thought you were fairly sensible. But remarks like this one:
“The liberals complain a lot, but the conservatives are always the first to volunteer for any community activity.”</p>
<p>are a ridiculous generalization.</p>
<p>I grew up among liberal Quakers and conservative Episcopalians (in suburban Philadelphia) and believe me, the Quakers were doing a lot more than the conservatives–but my brother-in-law lives among religious conservatives in Tulsa, and I see them doing very little for him, despite his clear needs (like affordable medical care).</p>
<p>But it frankly never occured to me that it was a political thing. I’ve always figured that some people give–emotionally and financially–and others don’t. Most of the teachers I know are pretty liberal; now that’s a group that puts their time and money behind their desire to help the community. But some of the best teachers I know are Republican…</p>
<p>And Bill Gates, a man whose politics I deplore (he gave money to Bush), has given billions to fund health care initiatives for Africa, a cause I applaud.</p>
<p>Some people give, some don’t; I don’t think it’s a matter of politics.</p>
<p>It can be a matter of politics though
I am fairly involved and while one of my favorite school board members is a <cough> republician- the people that I work with in the schools and the community are usually liberals- or libertarians.</cough></p>
<p>People satisfied with the status quo, people who think that there is a level playing field, people who think that those without- somehow deserve it, those people aren’t first in line to step in and work for change.</p>
<p>Most good people will be most aware of people like themselves, that is, birds of a feather fly the same friendly skies…therefore, when lending a hand most of us will most often see people who reflect our own philosophies and styles, with a few exceptions. </p>
<p>The issue at hand, the OP, made an accusation tirelessly repeated and amplified throughout this thread. To the effect, </p>
<p>1) conservatives have no compassion
2) even seeming compassionate, conservatives wish the worst
3) Religious people are much worse, having no a shred of decency or compassion. </p>
<p>A quick glance though this thread will support my summary.</p>
<p>This is a delusional projection and can only be understood in the light of someones unrestrained need to vent their hatred. The counter examples to these premises are legion my family is an extreme counter example amongst innumerable others.</p>
<p>Good people help others, there is no political test of goodness that I am aware of.
Irrespective of this shared fundamental goodness, this hateful venting is almost uniformly anti-religious, one might even say bigotedly so.</p>
<p>A famous man once said, my father causes it to rain on the righteous and the unrighteous.</p>
<p>more answers:
So my anti conservative rants bother you??? I have no real influence in your life, so my views are my own. The conservatives have taken over the country and influence every damn thing in my life. Please, they are driving me and many others crazy…DOING THINGS WITH MY TAX MONEY IN MY NAME THAT ARE AGAINST EVERY THING I HOLD DEAR…and saying they are moral and it seems, above the law. I am allowed to rant and rave…and yell it from the street corner while holding my little candle which kept blowing out. As I said, I am mad as hell and not going to take it anymore. Their clock of propriety is unraveling and we have seen the decayed body which hides beneath their tattered robe. And it looks mighty like the anti christ.</p>
<p>Woodwork said," Good people help others, there is no political test of goodness that I am aware of."</p>
<p>I agree with this statement. The trouble is the Republican party has tried to market themselves as the party with higher morals in more ways than giving to charity. Hence the marketing label of “compassionate conservative” That’s all it is - a marketing label but it has become a divisive label that creates polarization. A party that lords it superiority over the other one. That doesn’t mean that individuals that support Bush believe the same hogwash. </p>
<p>There is a lesson to be learned about a party that is in absolute power ( all branches of the government ) and yet needs so desperately to squash it’s opponents. Unfortunately it will be learned at a great cost to all of us.</p>
<p>I think Liz has it exactly backwards. “Compassionate conservativism” was indeed a PR concept, but it was more of a “me too” slogan than one that “creates polarization” by “a party that lords its [moral] superiority over the other one”…that has long been the province of the Democrats. Genuine compassion and posturing exist on both sides.</p>
<p>I suggest reading
George Lakoff* Dont Think of an Elephant: Know Your Values and Frame the Debate*
Very instructive on how language is used by those on different ends of the political spectrum- how we look at things very differently- it made a lot of sense to me.
an excerpt from a reader
<p>emeraldkity4
Loved that post! It’s all verbiage that makes people take umberage…however while the neo cons run my life it’s more than words, unfortunatley it’s their actions, too. Having said that I totally plan to think about how things are said and reword their slings so they show how misguided some of them are. Nice one!</p>