OP - have you done a deep dive into the graduation requirements for each school? I think you will see significant differences in the four year plan of study between ND and Cornell and one may appeal to you more than another.
You’d need a common data set with a common methodology for all three schools, Dyson, Nolan, and Mendoza, to do it directly.
Peak and College Transitions both provide a common data set with a common methodology, but it isn’t specific to the business schools.
I’m not aware of an alternative meeting those criteria that reports at the business school level.
As to Dyson versus Nolan, Cornell’s data says Johnson graduates with a Hotel Administration degree place 35.4% into Financial Services, Johnson graduates with an Applied Economics degree place 61% into Financial Services.
OK, so Peak has ND materially above Cornell per capita (1.57% to 1.15%), CT has ND just behind. CT doesn’t publish what it is using for the denominator, but Peak has the numerators at 178 Cornell to 141 ND, a ratio of 1.26, and CT has it 279 to 154, a ratio of 1.81, which explains how the order could reverse. Like if you used Peak’s denominators (15503 and 8973) with CT’s numerators, you would get 1.80% Cornell to 1.72% ND, which is consistent with Cornell ending up just ahead in CT’s per capita rankings.
As an aside, this is an illustration of why you can’t simply mix different data sets and methodologies, obviously Peak and CT counted IB placements in a different way and it made a material difference to the comparison.
Anyway, you could pretty easily explain either CT or Peak if per capita IB placement rates went Dyson > Mendoza > Nolan >> rest of Cornell > rest of ND. This would then also be consistent with Dyson >> Nolan when it comes to Financial Services generally.
But are you saying there is data from Cornell showing it is actually Nolan >> Dyson when it comes to IB placement rates specifically, despite it being Dyson >> Nolan when it comes to Financial Services? I’m not seeing that in Cornell’s database, but I am open to being pointed to that data.
Why - both schools publish data which I listed above in pictorial from their website.
Here are the links.
Student Outcomes – Central Career Services | Cornell University
In fact, Cornell is actually New York state’s land grant university:
Of course it is an unusual one in that it is (mostly) private in structure, and of course New York did also create the SUNY system. But still, it is very true Cornell has a long history particularly producing college graduates for the state of New York, which by extension means particularly producing college graduates for NYC.
I thought I already explained, with an illustration, why I think you can’t simply mix reported data which is coming from different datasets and/or different methodolodies.
Data is available for both schools. Nolan enrolls more students than does Dyson.
Interesting to note that Nolan students can take Dyson courses on a space available basis since both are parts of the SC Johnson College of Business. Also, seems reasonable to assume that both Dyson & Nolan students have access to the same companies/interviews.
I am not really interested in spending more time on this, but the data is available online.
My point is that for the OP who wants, if I recall correctly, IB in NYC, then Cornell is the better choice versus Notre Dame Mendoza overall and because many ND grads take jobs in Chicago.
In the end, the student can end where they want to be from all three, but more likely statistically from the two.
These things aren’t linear - like first Cornell Dyson kids get jobs, after them Mendoza kids, after them Nolan kids.
Guess what - the student can go to either. They may get a job on Wall Street. They may not.
It’s really that simple. Both give them possibilities.
Where does the student prefer.
It’s like if an average salary at one is higher. OK, statistically, you have better odds to make more from school A than B - but there will be kids from School B who make more than School A.
Bottom line - the student can succeed from both and should choose their favorite. If they prefer Cornell, this is the tradeoff of apply to Hotel School vs. business - which OP hasn’t said why, but I’m guessing will be because it was the easier admit.
I’m assuming @Publisher @NiceUnparticularMan and @tsbna44 are done with their off-topic debating and that any further posts by them with address questions made by the OP
OP - here’s the required core course list at Nolan: Core Courses | Cornell Nolan
That’s a lot of classes specific to hotel administration if that isn’t what you are actually interested in studying.
Cornell also hase a number of out of college distribution requirements: Distribution Requirements | Cornell Nolan
That combination will limit your classes if you are wanting to do a deep dive in finance.
Transferring into Dyson is nearly impossible.
I think you’ll have more flexibility with your undergrad curriculum at ND but I will say the food is much better at Cornell and IMO they have the nicer location.
You really can’t go wrong with any of your decisions. You have gotten into great schools! Congratulations!
Not an issue as Nolan students can enroll in Dyson courses as both are part of the SC Johnson School of Business.
Dyson AEM majors get priority in registration and courses can be at capacity and closed to students outside the major. OP - I don’t have a good sense of how many classes are impacted but you can reach out to Cornell and ask. They should be very responsive to these kinds of questions.
I think OP will get a great job from either school - I think he/she should consider this more of a type of school choice. They are educational equals - but does he want fun sports and community or the more competitive New York vibe of Cornell? Neither is bad, but they are very different schools. I went to Cornell and after my son went to ND, I looked back and thought I’d have enjoyed ND a lot more ![]()
This is not a surprise. But note that the OP would be attending the Nolan School of Hotel Administration at Cornell.
In any event I would suggest that the student not choose a school solely on the chance of slightly increasing odds of getting a high finance/IB job as those are few and far between.
IMO the OP should focus on finding the school where they feel they can be happy and thrive over the next four years.
I hope OP comes back and explains why they applied to Hotel school vs. b school.
I have my suspicion.
I bring this up, because if the goal is unchanged but was simply to get into Cornell, well then they knew this was a possibility and they chose to pursue it.
So that would lead me to Cornell - that they got exactly what they hoped for.
If they applied for and got into Dyson, would we even be having this discussion? But in that case, they made a choice - if my hypothesis is right - to pursue this career via an alternative outlet.
It’s why I wish people put major over school - because if IB doesn’t work out, then what do you have - a hotel admin degree - and are you planning to work in hospitality?
It’s still a great degree, maybe just not the direct route.
IB is not a major, students from many majors go into IB. OP can share why they applied to Nolan or not, IMO it’s inappropriate for any of us to speculate on their motivations. OP asked that we give input on which school is best for ‘high finance/IB’…which obviously includes non-IB options.
I agree with momofboiler that OP should look at each curriculum and see which appeals more. If OP wants to live on the east coast post graduation, I would lean ND or Cornell. ND will offer a better student experience, IMO.
Cornell Nolan places well in IB.
Cornell Nolan is a business school in the same business school (SC Johnson) as Cornell Dyson. Students are permitted to cross-enroll (with preference for each school’s students).
Notre Dame Mendoza places many students in Chicago; OP seems to prefer the coasts.
If OP is open to living & working in Chicago, then both are solid options, but, for NYC, Cornell is the better option.
USC, as OP noted, has budget/funding issues which have resulted in cutbacks. The other two options are better unless OP wants a West Coast placement.
Notre Dame ALSO places many graduates in New York. In fact for Mendoza specifically, their data says New York state just edged out Illinois for the top destination (148 to 147!). California is a different matter, only 16. But for NYC specifically? That is definitely part of Notre Dame’s “footprint”.
I note I’m not sure some people always fully grasp the role Notre Dame plays specifically in Catholic circles. It is a top national college target for many very successful Catholic families, and the alums are typically very proud, and very loyal. The Notre Dame connection was very obvious in my wife’s not-Chicago bank, I saw it in my not-Chicago law firm circles . . . it is absolutely a thing that is not at all constrained to the Chicago area.
And not to get too down in the weeds, but while Boston does have Boston College, and of course DC has Georgetown (although Catholics sometimes have interesting views on Georgetown in my circles), and Philly has Villanova, NYC does not have a similar competitor for NYC Catholics (it has some very good Catholic schools, but not quite at that level). In that sense, I think Notre Dame has long sort of been NYC’s most-favored Catholic university, and I think that is basically why Mendoza ends ups splitting so many of its placements between Chicago and NYC like that.
Now, of course Cornell is obviously more specifically focused on New York, and again is actually New York’s land grant university. But again, Cornell Nolan is not all of Cornell, nor indeed Cornell Dyson. And although some people have asserted that still means at least parity between Nolan and Mendoza when it comes to IB placement, I don’t see them as having ever come up with the data necessary to show that.
Everyone - but particularly those I called out by name - need to refer to my earlier message. As skimom often told her skikids, “I wasn’t asking.”
