OP mentioned ruling out publics because they wouldn’t consider his excellent test scores. Perhaps UCs would otherwise be on interest and, if so, the CC transfer pathway is very realistic.
But, yes, we don’t know. They may prefer private schools for various other reasons. Regardless, the current list is VERY reach heavy, so this would provide a good safety option. Again, IF the student would potentially be interested. Maybe he’s not.
They are not on the list because Bay Area parents know the predicament of applying to a respectable UC (which are test blind, so that 35 ACT score will not help) with a 3.66 GPA. Thus OP is looking for OOS schools which will consider the ACT score to boost admission chances.
Unfortunately, UT Austin will not be a good option for OP.
How do you know this? I didn’t see it mentioned at all by OP.
It’s mentioned very early on.
I guess this reply was not clear enough?
I missed that reply - that makes more sense. It wasn’t mentioned in the original post which listed lots and lots of small private schools. But if UC is a goal then I definitely understand the appeal of starting at a California Community College to transfer into a UC. I just saw the list of lots of private schools and thought it was out of the blue to suggest a California Community College - but sounds like that may be a good option.
OP’s list looks like a USNWR ranking list…
All I’m suggesting is to have a conversation and cover all possibilities.
Your son sounds fantastic.
Some of the schools don’t seem to make too much sense- Skidmore, for example- not the place to study engineering if that’s where his interests shake out. Hillsdale- has he researched it at all? A very specific kind of student.
If you have no financial constraints, your son will have terrific options. If you could let us know what has sparked his interest in CS, engineering- is pre-med just a “everyone who does well in science says they are premed” or is it a genuine, informed interest-- that will help.
Has he spent time outside California-- i.e. does he know what living in Middlebury VT would be like? I love Middlebury- both the college and the area-- but it’s not the kind of place I’d suggest for a kid who doesn’t want “real winter”, and a somewhat rural setting.
Ditto some of your other schools on the list.
That is really a variant of the general preference for colleges that are reaches and disdain for others.
Some UCs and most CSUs are likely admits at 3.66 unweighted GPA.
Your student won’t have an issue getting into great colleges.
But I don’t understand if they want to be an engineer (potentially), why you have schools like Skidmore, Wesleyan, Grinnell, etc. on the list.
If they want a small STEM school, he’d be a near shoo in for Rose Hulman for example - and likely RPI and WPI as well.
The bulk of your list - if engineering is a possibility - doesn’t come close to working.
And applying to more schools where your #s don’t match up doesn’t necessarily increase your odds.
I would take a step back and a deep breath.
Figure out - what does the student potentially want.
If engineering, you have to start again.
Now it’s - what do they want - if it’s small, then we find small and mid size schools that will be “safe”.
WIth engineering, the where you go is not overly relevant short of a few schools. Arizona or UVA - it’s not going to matter in other words.
So you have BC on your list. There was a recent student who had to transfer from BC. Know why - he went there for pedigree but even knew the year prior he wanted to be an engineer - and that couldn’t happen there - so he’s left.
So first figure out - where does engineering fit - and then go from there.
But short of Hillsdale and maybe Mac and Skidmore, without an ED, this could be a strikeout list - although I see you added Rutgers and Ohio State - which then make more sense for admission, but not matched up with the rest of the list.
I’d summarize with that you need a quality list for your situation - but this appears simply to be a quantity list.
Thanks
Thanks a lot for all your responses. Let me see if I can collate all the questions and respond in a single post.
UCs are definetly in the running and the reason I didnt include them is because I understand their rubric to some extent. UCs publish data by school that removes out the guessing game. His UC GPA is likely to be 4.2-4.3 at the end of 12th Sem 1.
My goal is to understand how other schools use GPA in their holistic admissions rubric so we can make an educated guess and not overshoot or under optimize. Thanks @Bruno99, I am not sure if he is in the top 10% at school or not. His counselor just said the school doesnt rank which quantile the kid falls into. I know Naviance had this feature to analymously list GPA but this district doesnt use that anymore.
Not planning to apply to all or specific schools but wanted to educate myself how to match academic fit prior to forming a well balanced target, reach, safety schools later this summer/early fall.
@thumper1 please see the rest of the courses.
| 9th Grade | 10th Grade | 11th Grade | 12th Grade | |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Maths | Honors Pre-Calc | AP Calc BC | AP Stats | AP Multivariable |
| Chemistry | Chemistry | AP Chemistry | ||
| Biology | Biology | AP Biology | ||
| Physics | Physics | AP Physics C | ||
| Computer Science | AP Comp Sci | |||
| Economics | AP Economics | |||
| English | Freshman English | Honors English | Junior English | |
| Language | Spanish II | Spanish III | AP Spanish | |
| History | Honors Global Studies | AP World | AP US | |
| Others | AP Environment |
@cy7878 Honestly he was over streched in 10th grade, JV basketball, AP Calc BC and Physics. Hindsight is always 20-20 and we had to balance it out in his junior year. Rigor is not only taking the toughest courses but taking them early on and in doing so risked ‘non-As’ and a lower GPA. That probably was the 1st time he felt challenged in math since his middle school and had to develop better organization skills and study habits. He is currently scheduled for 2 summer courses(AP Multivariable and AP Micro Econ) at a local community college as those are not offered at his school. So community collge is not ruled out.
@blossom The list is not ordered but I did weigh in the Urbanization degree, rural vs town vs city. The list was from the most selective(by admit % and yeild %) institutions based on 2023 IPEDS data. Its possible some of the schools will be filtered out but I was more curious to understand how Skidmore(26% admit rate) picks students when they dont publish their GPA.
@tsbna44 Rose Hulman is definetly on our list and their publish the 50th percentile GPA(4.06) so I am able to make a guess the likelyhood of his acceptance. I am trying to learn here if there could be another source of data for helps him cross his 3.66 uGPA hurdle.
What is it about these colleges that made you put them on the list?
I agree w/what others are saying about engineering. If doing an engineering major is a strong possibility, then you should eliminate any college on the list that does NOT offer an engineering major.
Personality-wise, the colleges on your list run a wide range of campus vibe.
Is there a target $ amount per year that you are looking to pay?
Given the currently strong downward trend in computer science jobs in the job market right now, one might want to consider outcomes for graduates at the college in their various majors.
Also, if data science is a strong area of interest in terms of possible major, then remove any colleges from the list that don’t have data science as a major. However, a lot of LACs do have data science as a minor.
Some things to consider…
https://www.wsj.com/lifestyle/careers/computer-science-majors-job-market-7ad443bf
In a challenging job market where you go matters. Access to alumni networks, name recognition and reputation matter.
Employers value diverse academic backgrounds including humanities. Don’t get too hung up on CS if your student has more eclectic interests.
I’m assuming you forgot to put English in the 12th grade year. Also, if he plans to apply to any UCs, he will need an arts course and I don’t see that either. Is AP Environment considered a social studies course? I ask because some colleges will expect to see four years of social studies. You have the other content areas listed for four years.
You need to find some sure things for admission where your student will be happy to attend and are affordable…and where he can thrive academically…especially if premed is a possibility.
I would suggest that you look at the Colleges That Change Lives list of colleges. There are some excellent smaller schools that might be better choices than some of the ones you currently have on this list.
I agree…who made this list? I know students choose varying college types, but this list seems very random to me.
In addition, it’s nice that you are doing some research for your son, but I do hope he is in the driver’s seat in terms of choosing where he will apply to college…assuming realistic admissions expectations, and affordability.
I’ll just add a couple of things.
Why is it necessary for this kid to take summer school community college courses?
It seems you are trying to get a firm feeling for where this kid will be accepted when he applies. Please…understand, you likely won’t get this for any college where he is on the line. You will get this for well chosen sure thing colleges, but not for all colleges. There are just too many factors you don’t know about the class admissions at these colleges. Remember, the college is building a class of freshmen students. You have no idea how your kid’s application will be in comparison to the hundreds of others received in terms of meeting institutional goals.
I’m going to tag @AustenNut . He is very good at estimating chances and I’m hoping he can do so for this very lengthy list of schools you current have.
UC’s will only see his GPA through end of summer after 11th grade - his senior year grades won’t matter in the admissions process.
I think you are on the right track as far as UC’s go -in the sense that with his 3.66 GPA CS/DS/Engineering are a likely no at top UC’s - but UCSC/UCR/UCM are all possible to likely if he decides to go the UC route.
I third and fourth the suggestions to focus on fit for your student. He sounds like a great kid with so much to offer - have you visited any of these places? Are you able to swing some trips this summer (between his classes!) to visit campuses and get a feel, at least for a few? Maybe the furthest away? Does he really not have any preference for location, weather, amenities (clubs/food/activities)?
He’s the one who has to spend 4 years of his life there - being happy wherever he lands will make a huge difference in his academic performance as well as his mental health.
If your son is seriously considering engineering as a possibility, eliminate these schools:
With respect to the current list, these are my guesses as to what your son’s chances might be at these schools that offer engineering:
Extremely Likely (80-99+%)
Likely (60-79%)
Toss-Up (40-59%)
Lower Probability (20-39%)
Low Probability (less than 20%)
Looking at my guesses, it might feel dispiriting. First off, low probability does not mean impossibility, though the odds of any of the schools in this category coming through are definitely against your son (and against almost all other applicants). Secondly, your son is obviously very academically strong. Most colleges in the country would be likely or extremely likely admits for him. It just so happens that the schools on this list are among the most competitive to get into in the country, which is why they are in the bucket they are in.
In looking at your son’s interests, it sounds like he’s undecided about what he wants to do but knows that he wants something in a STEM area, including engineering as a possibility. Is that correct?
Has your son visited any college campuses? If so, what were his impressions?
Some questions he may want to think about (and then if you could share his thoughts) are:
What size classes does he think he will do best in?
What size school does he prefer?
How does he feel about urban/suburban/small town/rural locations?
Does he have any climate preferences (including, potentially, the amount of sun a location receives)?
Are there particular states or areas of the country he prefers (or prefers to avoid)?
How does he feel about Greek life (fraternities & sororities)?
How does he feel about significant enthusiasm for intercollegiate sports?
Are there any particular interests that he’d like to pursue while in college, outside of academics?
Will there be any other influencing factors on the college decision (like religion, politics, etc)?
Knowing more about your son’s interests can help the board to provide targeted suggestions of schools that will be a good fit and strong in his areas of interest.
Just an fyi, these are community college courses, not AP courses. They may or may not be transferrable to whichever school he ultimately attends. There is no AP version of Multivariable.
You give yourself other options - and frankly better odds - to sub in the high pedigree LACs with schools like Union and Trinity (say a match) and Clarkson (a safety, albeit regional) - fine LACs that offer ABET accredited engineering programs.
Obviously, CS programs are offered in more places of course - and all schools have pre-med.
We don’t know the school rank - but in general, a 3.66 UW will be a reach for much of the schools.
Since you prefer private and are ok with ED, you might look at mid size schools like Rochester and Miami as well - these are difficult admits but not the top.
If you’re going to med school, there where won’t matter. For engineering, the where likely won’t matter but he’d get into plenty of wonderful schools - small like you laid out or mid size and large.
And if he wants to study CS, it’s at so many places - and many today require you to pass a series of tests to get hired - regardless of the where. My nephew studied Poli Sci at Arizona and works for a large, well known company in NY. He went in as a mid hire - but had to pass all the tests.
Bottom line -with your student, there is no shortage of possiblities.
However, do we know what your student wants. You prefer small and private but then are talking about UCs which are large and bureacratic.
I would take your son around to different schools - schools that are urban, suburban, rural. Large, mid size and small.
How does he feel about cold weather, etc.?
All these things - I’d first focus on, what does he seek in a school and build up from there.
Rutgers is different than a UC which is different than suburban school like Wesleyan and which different than a school in Iowa like Grinnell, which is in the midst of an area without a huge Asian population. And would that be comfortable.
So that’s, to me, first step - and then of course, if engineering is a possibility, only visiting schools where it’s offered.
Good luck.
Dartmouth engineering is 4 academic years (12 quarters) for the AB degree which is non-ABET-accredited. To complete an ABET-accredited BE degree typically requires 1-3 extra quarters. Note that Dartmouth is more limiting than many other schools in terms of overload schedules if a student wants to consider doing that to shorten the number of quarters to graduation.
Brown also has both non-ABET-accredited and ABET-accredited versions of engineering majors, but the ABET-accredited majors can be completed in 4 academic years (8 semesters).