D3 Admissions for the average excellent student athlete

Athletic Recruits
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Let’s talk about baseball, since that seems to be the sport in question. Most D3 teams are going to settle in at around 30. If the positions were evenly disbursed, which they are not, you’d have room for 3 to play each position. Obviously they are not evenly divided, and you are likely to find 20 field players and 10 pitchers (give or take).

If you assume in the NESCACs, the teams are given two slots and three tips (again, this can vary) there is room for a walk-on or two each year. There also is room for a cut or two. Then there is attrition and injury . . … If a stud walks on, they will find him a spot. But there is absolutely no guarantee that if you try out, you will make the team. Remember, the level of play at most of the academic D3s (Cal Tech excluded) is a significant jump up from high school.

The take-away is that, yes, teams can and often do have room beyond the tips and slots. Your question is will every baseball team have extra room, and the answer to that is “no.” It really just depends. You need to talk to the coach to determine what the needs for any given year are. For example, the Claremont teams seem to over-recruit. That is because their coaches don’t have that much sway with admissions. The same is true for Chicago and MIT. So, if if your kid has the academic chops to get in at one of those on his own (no mean feat), POSSIBLY there is a better chance to walk-on that at other schools. By contrast, I would think walking onto one of the Little Three would be a tough go, as they tend to perform well on a consistent basis, and plenty of good players really want to play for those teams.

It can happen, however. A kid from our area did not do the baseball showcase circuit and did not play on an uber competitive club team. That said, he was extraordinarily fast. He made a D3 baseball team and pinch ran for a year, before quitting to focus on track. But he was very fast, and for that to work, you would need quite a bit below a 7.0 60.

If a baseball team has had a down year, and a down recruiting year, it is POSSIBLE that an admissions office might suggest that you speak to the coach. If that does not happen, I believe the adcom will look at the baseball experience in the same way it would any other EC, like the school play or band. A leadership position on a high school team, such as captain, probably would be received like any other high school leadership position.

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Addressing baseball specifically for academic D3’s, including NESCAC schools, MIT and CalTech. There are recruited athletes and non-recruited athletes. Recruited athletes receive official support from the coach with the admissions process. The support can include an almost assured admission’s spot, subject to the AO’s final approval, but for which the AO gives a fair degree of deference to the coach. The usual quid pro quo for this is the student must apply ED because the coach’s spots are limited. Some coaches may offer “soft” support, that is they will write a note to the AO which the AO may consider as an enhancing factor, but the amount of deference given to the coach here is minimal. The NESCAC schools and many others have “slots”. MIT and Caltech coaches do not have slots. They only have a limited number of support letters that they can use for their recruits, which based on our conversations with the MIT and Caltech coaches, is more than just a small tip, but it is not a slot. The athlete must have the same academic qualifications as any student.

Non recruited athletes receive no support from the coach. The coach may encourage the applicant to apply, and there may be a walk on spot for them on the team, but as far as the AO is concerned, they are just another applicant with an athletic EC. Most baseball (and other programs) do have walk-ons, students on the team who got in without coach support, but there is a try-out and cuts. The prospect of walking on varies by school, by sport and by the team’s needs for that year.

You will not get coach’s support without reaching out to the coach. Most coaches will recruit from camps and showcases. Having a club pedigree helps. Most coaches want to see video. If you are a 4 year varsity baseball starter in a competitive baseball state (say California) on a competitive baseball team (perennial top rated team in the most competitive division) with great stat’s and honors, a coach might be interested in you and may not have to see you in person (just video). If you are a 4 year starter on a small private school team that is mediocre and plays in a mediocre league, you’ll get no love from a coach until he sees you.

If you are serious about going this route (and assuming your son is not a senior), I would highly recommend attending a showcase, like Headfirst or Showball, or a well attended school camp, to both get some exposure and to see where your son stacks up. D3 players still need to be able to hit baseballs thrown in the 80’s, and pitchers need to pitch in the 80’s. It is pretty obvious within the first couple of hours which kids are the studs, which kids are delusional and then there are a whole bunch in the middle, which might be the worst place to be because you might get on a list, but are never the first choice(s), so you are a victim of the recruiting musical chairs late into the process.

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Thank you @gointhruaphase - that is really helpful. Kiddo is a sophomore. So still early to be picking out schools or seriously contemplating that he would even want to play college ball. I just am a deep dive researcher and can’t help the scenarios running through my mind.

Baseball sure seems to be unique in its recruitment. Btw, Kiddo stands out as a hitter - very quick hands, hits for power, Solid obp. Got playing time on varsity as a freshman (at a small school) because of his bat.

If I had to guess, he would apply to Harvey Mudd, and other small schools with strong stem. So far he has the academic chops to be on that path, but as you say, that is no mean feat to get in.

I guess my concern is that if he goes to a small stem school, the likelihood of there being a club level baseball team for him to play on is nil. So if he doesn’t play on the school team he is done.

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@BKSquared - wow, thanks for that information. Very helpful. My guess he is middle of the pack non-pedigreed player with a spike of skills at the plate (I haven’t seen him hit 80 mph, though), but academically he is a stud who tests very well.

For the showcases, is that better done between sophomore and junior year? There is no way his school is on any coach’s radar. But he grew up in a baseball hotbed and held his own even though he didn’t play in the summer.

Btw, I feel funny posting this info about him, because it makes it seem like I am pushing/delusional. I really am just curious. And figuring I can’t be the only one wondering what the realities are for the non-phenom kid who just wants to play.

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@CateCAParent, I think you are doing the right thing and you most decidedly are not delusional. Plan now. If going into senior year, your kid decides not to play at the college level, well, that is an easy bandwagon to jump off. Conversely, if your kid wants to play come senior year, and you haven’t planned, you have a lot of time to make up. Now is a good time for setting up a recruiting plan.

  1. Hitting is an important skill, and good hitters will have a place on a team. However, for college, I have observed that it is better to be a good hitter than to have a good eye. Make sure that you support him with a good hitting coach.
  2. If there are any tournament/travel programs with tryouts, give it a shot. It is a time commitment for sure, but you are going to see and play a higher level of baseball. My personal view is to avoid Daddy Ball, and go with a professionally run team. If you are at a small school, you might be warping expectations by the level of competition.
  3. If you live near any D3 schools, go watch a practice. That can give you a good idea about the level of play.
  4. Make a spreadsheet of potential D3 schools now, including any team within the realm of possibility. Make plenty of columns to record your written communications, but start now by filling out the recruiting questionnaires for any school that is within range. I say that you should do this now, because it will force you think about the options. But more importantly, if you have a long list of schools (and you should), filling out the questionnaires takes forever. Record on your spreadsheet the login/password information for each questionnaire, because you almost certainly will have things to add and change (test scores, awards, caption, better times, secondary positions, etc.).
  5. I would plan for Head First as a showcase. As far as others, you need to play amateur psychologist as to how often and where. I feel that you should attend at least one small showcase to get your kid ready for the better showcases. I wouldn't throw him into Head First to start. Most D3s will be looking for recruits in the summer between junior and senior years, so that summer makes sense. On the other hand, some kids have committed by then and a handful of schools have finished by then. If you have the money, I would do Head First camps in both summers.
  6. Be sure to make tapes. If your son has quick hands, this will show up on tape. If you go to a hitting coach in advance of this season, tape a session, and edit it down to two minutes or so. If you can make a skills tape, all the better. You should consider making game tapes during the season, if you don't do it, the opportunity will be lost.
  7. Make a college CV.
  8. Plan to visit some schools and make sure to set up a meeting with the coach in advance. Talk to the coach about recruiting. Send him the tapes and bring your college CV with you. Really, meeting with the coach is the only way that you can assess where your kid stands recruiting-wise. Remember, there is a difference in the skill level of D3 schools, and you may find just the right place for your kid this way.

9 High school baseball on the web is a good resource.

Good luck.

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@CateCAParent After reading this and thinking more about it, there is a process in place for any non-recruited athlete to investigate opportunities to play in college which is better than just show up and see if you can walk on. Players have to investigate the status of team rosters, check out player backgrounds and see if they are within range or not. There is a way to communicate with coaches (online recruiting forms), and for a player to shown his or her stuff (showcases, camps). Coaches have to sift thru the forms, watch tapes, communicate with players, etc. There is a system and a process. Not perfect, but not a brick wall, either.

Your son is a strong student, I believe, and perhaps doesn’t want to sacrifice the academic side of college to play his sport. I see several kids a year at our HS make a different decision and attend schools far different than what they would choose if academics were the priority. I have also seen kids who attend a school with a stronger academic reputation as a ‘recruit’ and get cut or never play. The kids headed for d1 start that road pretty early (they don’t play for our HS, they play for a club team). I don’t have any anecdotes of kids who went to a strong academic school and ended up walking on. Sorry!

Hockey is the only sport I know of where high school players routinely elect to play a year or two of ‘juniors.’ There are normal try outs and one has to pay to play for a weaker team. Almost every college hockey player does this now prior to college, and hence the average age of college male hockey players is 2 years older than the average in the schools. Superstars in HS will go straight into college; the rest will play juniors. Gives a chance for kids on an upward trajectory to still grow more and if in a good league, get noticed. Most kids in juniors still do not get recruited. Some kids play simply because they want to play a bit more very competitive hockey and are willing to live with a family in Fargo to do so.

Our HS sends a kid to play juniors maybe once every five years or so. Most kids want to hang up there skates after HS, or seek a college with intramural or club opportunities )and for club is NO guarantee of making the team in hockey. For sure). My oldest played club hockey for one year and stopped because it shadowed varsity (traveled all over the place) and he wasn’t willing to tank his GPA. So he switched to intramurals and loved it. Did he pick his college because of a chance to play? No. Not at all. Youngest son had it as a factor, but wouldn’t sacrifice a single thing on his wish list for college (major, strength of program) to play hockey. The only hockey recruit I know is now a senior and ‘committed’ as a sophomore. Going to a hockey powerhouse, and is a great student. Yet, as a sophomore, was able to pick a college? I have to wonder if the same choice would be made now, as a senior. So, not perfect for the recruits, either.

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‘their skates’ not ‘there skates.’ Ugh.

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My S’s track after learning a bunch of stuff through my D, who started 4 years at a NESCAC on the softball team. She was a STEM major and is currently working at a well known lab in the NE – so you can play a sport and pursue STEM at a high level at a D3. Full disclosure on S. He did receive multiple “offers” (coaches telling him after an academic pre-read, “if you commit to applying ED, you are virtually guaranteed admissions from XYZ”). He got pretty far with some Ivies but did not make the final cut. He opted to apply SCEA to his top school where he got in and chose to be a student rather than go the athletic recruit route, so I cannot give you info on the “last mile” of what happens after you accept an “offer”. Any info on walk-ons is based on observations my daughter shared with me about her friends on the baseball team and her experience with the softball team.

S played for a competitive big school program in a very competitive state. He also played for a very good travel club that has several well known alum’s in the majors. The HS program/coach was not a factor in recruiting. The travel organization’s head was well connected, but his focus was getting his top players into D1 baseball factories and junior college feeders. He helped as best as he could, but he just did not have the personal connections with the academic D3 coaches. What HS and travel ball did was provide high level baseball competition.

S attended Headfirst summer of sophomore year, as well as Stanford’s big camp, which was scheduled right after Headfirst (more likely Headfirst scheduled their California camp right before Stanford’s). Many of the same coach’s and players attended both. My D had done Showball, but I feel Headfirst is better organized and there are fewer players, but maybe Showball’s baseball program is better than the softball one. Prior to the showcases, S had filled out the questionnaire for every school that was going to be at the showcases that were academic and athletic matches for him. He also sent emails with a short summary of athletic and academic stat’s plus a link to a skills video (fielding, hitting, pitching) to those coaches. At Headfirst (and Stanford) he was able to talk to several coaches one on one and get on radar screens, although at the time not one was willing to make any type of commitment. He is young for his grade and was a bit undersized. His pitching velocity was clocked at 76-78 and his bat speed was also high 70’s.

He maintained email communications with several of the coaches through the year and sent updated stat’s (athletic and academic). He went to the same 2 camps summer of junior year. He had grown about 4 inches, put on 20 lbs and got his pitching velocity to the 83-85 mph range. His bat speed was also up past the mid 80’s. At this point, coaches approached him, even ones that he had not communicated with in the past. He was offered OV’s to a number of schools, but he narrowed it down to 4 because of the travel involved and time away from school. The coaches offered full support after each OV as he passed all the pre-reads prior to the OV’s. He informed all the coaches of his decision the week of Oct 15 so that they had time to move down their list. I think they were all appreciative of this.

At D’s NESCAC, there were “captain’s practices” each fall that were open to all for baseball and softball. The potential walk-ons (and freshmen recruits) were assessed by the captains and existing team members, so the coaches had some working assessments when the season started. The walk-ons had to try out and not all made the cut. There are limitations based on needing to get practice rep’s in as well as hard costs (primarily uniforms/gear and travel/accommodations expenses). Once they made the team, they were full members. Walk-ons could and did beat out recruits for playing time and starting positions.

I totally agree with @gointhruaphase that it is best to attend a “small camp” first to get a feel for what goes on and to start benchmarking. We started with Stanford and Showball for D, and it was a bit overwhelming for her.

Good luck.

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Well there are D3 sports and then there are D3 sports: the top schools are amazing and advanced and will blow your mind with the coaching and level of achievement. Your better programs are going to have made arrangements with incoming students to ensure they stay excellent and do not have any difficulty filling a roster with qualified student-athletes.

The bottom of D3, however, is not always like that. (At all, in some cases.) Plenty of terrific schools are average or even bad at one sport or another and will take a look at anyone who wants to come out. @gointhruaphase is correct: there are a lot of levels of play and depending on your son’s realistic level of skill (be honest with yourselves!) if he really wants to play and he’s a fair player then he can find a school.

If he wants to use his sport to help get in much will depend on the individual school. If they don’t care about sports then the coaches won’t have much pull. And if they’re a top program the competition for tips will be fierce. Talk to the coach to determine what sort of place they are, what space the program is in and where your DS might stand in that world.

Look at schools you might want to attend and then check out how they’ve done in conference the past few years. Schools with a history of being bad in many sports, or bad in your sport, or always featuring a ton of freshman on the roster, or a new coach every other year are likely going to be willing to take a look at walk-ons.

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Your child is always welcome to try to walk on, and if that doesn’t work to try a club team. Many club teams are very competitive.

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@StPaulDad Agree completely. My D20 watched a YouTube video of the team at a school where he had been briefly communicating with the coach. At first he thought that pigs would fly before he would make the hockey team for that school. He changed his mind quickly after watching the video and turned into Mr. Hockey Snob - ‘no WAY I am playing on that pitiful hockey team.’ So, ya, there are lots of bad d3 teams out there. And they are not all at little schools 10 states away. Also true that some club teams can beat many d3 teams (and do!).
The tough part is aligning the academic and sports hopes and dreams. Seems one usually wins over the other.

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Not every school has walk-on tryouts, and not every school has club teams. My daughter’s school has 24 varsity teams (although 6 teams are some kind of track). I think there is one club team at the school, ice hockey, but no varsity hockey team. Baseball is big there, but no club team.

If it is a small LAC, there might not be enough players to support a varsity team and club teams, and there may not be enough schools in the region to have good competition for club teams. Club teams may also be funded by the players, and if they have to travel far can be pretty expensive.

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Thank you everyone for your contributions to this thread! Always amazing the knowledge and experience and generosity out there.

Is there a source out there that tracks club teams?

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There are a few super elite club teams and there are some national/super regional organizations, but those are often franchise systems. The quality of the teams, the coaches and the tournaments they play can vary significantly even within a local region/city. The best sources are going to be families that already have kids in the system in your location. What your son’s goals are will shape the factors you want to consider. It sounds like from the posts so far you want your son to get more competitive rep’s, develop a “resume” and perhaps get some club help in the recruiting process. Here is what I would consider:

  1. Costs. There are team fees/dues; uniform costs (not always included in the dues); cost of travel (big difference between a team that more or less stays in its own metropolitan area vs one that routinely travels hundreds of miles).
  2. Coaches. You can go from "dad" coaches to former major leaguers. You see a lot more dads at the youth level (up to 14U), but most serious club teams that have HS age players will have professional coaches. Most of these will be HS coaches moonlighting over the summer, former college, and/or minor league players. Keep in mind, the older the team, generally expect less instruction. The demeanor of the coaches and their personal interaction with the players are important. There are some great positive coaches out there who try to mentor the kids to plain jerks who are just cashing a check. The quality of coaches can vary within the same organization, although some organizations do a better job of vetting coaches than others.
  3. Facilities/Instruction. This can be all over the map. Some organizations have their own indoor batting and pitching facilities. Many will rent or barter for the use of HS facilities. Some are almost "virtual" teams that only play tournaments. The ones that have their own facilities have a business model that generates separate instructional/lesson/batting cage revenues. As a sophomore, don't expect a lot of practice or instructional reps from the club team as part of the basic package. This is not necessarily a bad thing. The batting coach that clicks the best with your son may have nothing to do with the club team. The last thing you want is conflicting instruction.
  4. Playing time philosophy. This is pretty important because it can set the tone for the season/experience. Some teams are trying to win every game/every tournament. The coach plays who he thinks are the best players. The players further down the bench may only see limited action in lopsided games or meaningless pool play games. Some people like this because it replicates the real world of HS and college ball. There tends to be more drama in the dugout, and even more in the stands, as people (read parents) may have very different opinions on ability. My S's organization took the opposite position. There were try-outs and cuts, and the philosophy was if you were good enough to make the team, PT should be more or less equal, including at bats. This made for almost 0 drama as the substitutions and batting order was pretty much a mechanical process. The only deviation was in the single elimination phase of tournaments that have "championships" where winning meant more overall PT for the team.
  5. Roster size. This is pretty critical too because it directly translates into PT. By your son's age, expect the roster to be between 16-20 because there will be 4-6 kids that are pitchers only. 12 position players is pretty reasonable because of fatigue (especially hot climate teams), injury and schedule conflicts. We had more players summer of junior year because so many kids would be pursuing showcases and camps outside of club baseball for recruiting purposes.
  6. Quality of tournaments. Part of why club ball is to get in more rep's at a higher quality level. For D1 recruitable kids, they want to be on teams that qualify for major tournaments that attract D1 coaches and pro scouts. For D3 kids, it is less important. I think the best bang for buck in terms of exposure are the showcases like Headfirst and school specific camps. Your son is guaranteed to be seen by coaches of schools he is interested in academically for multiple rep's. In the "big" club ball tournaments that we have been in, the players play on multiple fields all over town. You do see coaches and scouts, but they are likely following kids already on their radar screen. If your kid is not being followed, you are relying on pure blind luck that a coach of a school he is interested in happens to be at your field when your son does something memorable. Might work for a pitcher who lights up the radar gun, but not so much for a position player.
  7. Organization track record/connection. Many club teams will put on their web page "alums" that are in pro ball and are/have been in college ball. There is often someone(s) within the organization who has good connections with a variety of college coaches. They will be more helpful than the average HS coach in the recruiting process, but don't expect miracles. They might be able to put in calls for you direct to the recruiting coach to get you on the radar screen, but it will come down to a pretty personal assessment by the coach.

Our family made some great friends and great memories from our kids’ club ball experience. Yes, a lot of musty La Quinta rooms and McD’s, but we would not have given this up for all the vacations in France (well maybe 1 would have been nice). Also my kids have a great knowledge and appreciation of music from the 60’s through 80’s since I controlled the car stereo. Have fun!

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“Also my kids have a great knowledge and appreciation of music from the 60’s through 80’s since I controlled the car stereo.”

Lol, we do some road trips now, Kiddo can belt out Hall & Oates with us like a pro!

We have dabbled a little in more “local” clubs when he was younger. I hear you on the difference of club and coaching styles. Fortunately, while kiddo hasn’t wanted to do the tournament circuit, he has had a hitting coach since he was itty bitty, and that coach is definitely more of the inspirational, instructional kind. It became an important personal activity for kiddo, transcending the utilitarian baseball skill-building component of it. It really kept him centered, much like I imagine martial arts does for other kids. He kept batting practice up year round, even though he played other sports in other seasons.

On the baseball front, though, having that coaching consistency has been key – especially since he has primarily only had dad-coached teams. We have had to tell him year after year to completely ignore what hitting advice he has gotten from his team coaches.

Now as a high school kid, though, as a result of his personal coaching and lack of club ball, his hitting skills are a mismatch to what you would expect from a kid with his limited playing history. That’s what makes this question particularly interesting to me – does the recruiting system have a way of evaluating outliers that don’t follow the club path? The Showcases seem like the key.

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Yes, and school specific camps. There are camps and facilities that help you put together recruiting film. The Stanford camp did that, and I believe Headfirst does it now too. Besides plain video, a lot of camps and facilities have devices that will measure certain key biometrics on speed, power and quickness.

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I just want to point out that those stats cited from the NCAA do not say that the top 1% or 5% of athletes are the only ones who play in college, although perhaps for certain popular sports that is close to reality. The statistics say nothing about how many high school athletes actually go to college in each division and how many try to continue their sport.

But I don’t know anything about baseball or athletic recruitment, and I am still amazed that I gave birth actual NCAA D3 athlete. (Different - and less competitive - sport, got in on academics, wasn’t sure he wanted to play in college, but loves it and intends to play all four years.)

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@CateCAParent Can’t speak for baseball, but all of the club teams at the schools my son is eyeing have a Facebook page. There you can usually see their schedule, maybe some video highlights and I think I have seen a roster or two. My kid isn’t into Facebook so now I am ‘following’ a bunch of college club hockey teams for him.

There is one club team which is hoping to establish a varsity team, and a couple of the players were on my son’s HS team a year ago, so they are trying to get my son to apply, which is a new take on ‘recruiting.’ LOL. That was pretty tempting because it is a good match school for him…but point is some club teams are hurting for players.

My oldest had a blast playing intramural hockey at tOSU. Since so many kids from his HS team went to tOSU, he was able to play with about 10 of his HS teammates. It was remarkably competitive for an intramural team. They would have been the intramural hockey champion of 2013 if it weren’t for an unfortunate bench-clearing brawl which disqualified both teams from the trophy.

39

My son just graduated from a CMS school and played a different sport. Each school has their own admission slots the coach can use. So although a roster is filled with CMC or Scripps students, weaker Mudd students can be recruited, if that makes sense. Coaches have only a certain number of spots for each college. My son always had several Mudd students on his team, and they didn’t drop the team nor seem overloaded. But I know the Claremont Consortium has many club teams, and I would imagine there is one for baseball too.

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Baseball isn’t listed as a club sport at CMS. https://www.cmsathletics.org/club_sports/club_sports/index