Democrats make it very hard to vote democrat.

<p>fwiw: it sounds like Prop 2.5 is similar to Calif Prop 13, which limits RE tax increases to no more than 2% a year, (based on home prices, btw, not core inflation). Since the market is (ahem) stagnant this year, RE taxes will be flat year-over-year. </p>

<p>Of course the downside to (mainly) relying on income tax receipts (ala the flat-broke Golden State), is that when incomes decline, as they have recently on the Left Coast, so do tax receipts. Of course, it didn’t help that the then Gov & Legislature baked in a lot of new programs in 1999-2000 using tax receipts from Dot-Com options. Once the bubble burst, the options were worthless, and so was that large tax stream. But, the enacted programs march on, and now we have a deficit of $14B.</p>

<p>Prop 13 does allow for full re-evaluation to market value for tax purposes once a parcel is sold…does Prop 2.5 do the same? (Just wondering…)</p>

<p>I used to like McCain. Seemed like a smart honest guy with extraordinary life experiences to draw from: Then;

  1. He walked around Baghdad, claiming it was safe, while surrounded by a troop of armed guards. Huh?
  2. He talked about the possibility of being in Iraq for 100 years or more. Huh?
  3. He might light of a tense situation by singing “Bomb Bomb Bomb - Bomb Bomb Iran” Is this supposed to be funny? Is he losing it??<br>
    So he’s dropped pretty far down on my list…would vote for any of the top three dems over him. The other republican candidates are pretty pathetic IMO.</p>

<p>Barrons, I’m shocked. :)</p>

<p>While I’m not an Edwards supporter, the size and cost of his house is a disingenuous red herring. FDR & the Kennedy’s came from a level of wealth that makes John Edwards look penny ante and somehow their credentials as defenders of the working stiff were never questioned.</p>

<p>I’ve met Edwards twice and I’ve found him to be energetic, charismatic, smart, and sincere. I would vote for him if he were the nominee but I predicted over a year ago that he’d get caught in a Hillary-Obama crossfire and not be able to break out.</p>

<p>As for “honest” John McCain, one might wish to compare clips from the 2000 campaign to the 2008 campaign. He now never talks about immigration or campaign financing unless he absolutely is pressed to but otherwise his posture with respect to the Republican establishment over the last seven years is exactly that of Monica Lewinsky to Bill Clinton during one of their assignations in the Oval Office. </p>

<p>McCain wants the nomination badly and is willing to do anything to be seen as next in the Republican line of succession…I do enjoy watching <em>them</em> have messy primaries for a change.</p>

<p>Hindoo: I have seen/heard Edwards off-stage (and in real life). I agree that he comes across well-- just seems really relaxed and comfortable with who he is. I thought he was great on the David Letterman show last night. </p>

<p>Have to agree with cartera45 on the total cost of that big house, certainly relative to other politicians, and to real estate in other parts of the country. I doubt his house is worth more than the Clinton’s home(s). And, despite the square footage, it’s a fairly non-descript house from what I can tell (based on pictures I’ve seen). I’m also pretty sure that square footage includes an indoor gym/basketball court/swimming pool he put in. If I had the money, I’d sure put in my own indoor swimming pool, too-- in a heartbeat. ;)</p>

<p>What is the brouhaha over Obama’s house? Did the “slumlord” Rezco (sp?) gave him the money to purchase that house-- or he got a good deal from Rezco on the house? Not sure of the details, but I think he paid a little less than $2million for that house a few years ago, and he got a deal on it-- from Rezco. So, yeah-- Edwards’ house was a relative bargain, in comparison. ;)</p>

<p>“Hindoo: I have seen/heard Edwards off-stage (and in real life). I agree that he comes across well-- just seems really relaxed and comfortable with who he is. I thought he was great on the David Letterman show last night.”</p>

<p>Call it what it is here, ok? The man IS sexy. Edwards, I mean. Not Letterman.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>Oh, I get it. I admit, I had to read that twice before I did, though. ;)</p>

<p>Well, I don’t like McCain (in, particular, his stance on the Iraq War) and would never vote for him if he were the last person on earth, but you have to give the guy credit for sticking it out as a POW, when he could have easily gotten out so much sooner. I also think it’s incredibly honest of him to talk about how long we’ll stay in this war, if he has his way. Amazingly stupid and, hopefully, self-destructive (w/regard to his campaign)-- but wow-- gotta give him some kind of credit for that. On the other hand, maybe he’s just losing it. ??</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>Well, yeah, that too. More importantly, what is up with the fact that he never seems to age?? I don’t get that.</p>

<p>I despise those Republican fat cats with their huge houses and indoor pools.</p>

<p>[YouTube</a> - John Edwards on the Late Show with David Letterman: 1.22.08](<a href=“http://youtube.com/watch?v=cI3IgwnA2x4]YouTube”>http://youtube.com/watch?v=cI3IgwnA2x4)</p>

<p>dstark and zoosermom, thanks for your kind words. </p>

<p>dstark, and again Chevda, correct me if I’m wrong, I think the way they do prop 2.5 it is compute the valuations Jan 1 to compensate change in property values, then they set the tax rate so that the total revenue increase is 2.5%</p>

<p>Don’t ask me. I was really describing prop 13. :)</p>

<p>At least Edwards has a house that he claims as a residence. Does anyone really know where Hillary and /or Bill live? What kind of places are they??
How many?? Price range? Who does their gardening and cleaning? etc, etc, etc…</p>

<p>First it was Edward’s hair, now it is his house…:eek:</p>

<p>…Yet the Clinton duo gets so many passes on so many unanswered issues (past and present) by their fan club. I don’t get it. :confused:</p>

<p>1sokkermom: Excellent point. But do we really want to get into the Clinton’s real estate dealings? Yikes. That would probably deserve its very own thread. ;)</p>

<p>“The good news is in the big picture the President really is pretty powerless on anything that really matters day to day.”</p>

<p>No disrespect intended, but wow. I mean just Wow! </p>

<p>I voted for Gore, but I could not in my wildest dreams have imagined the extent of the damage that Bush, the “compassionate conservative” who worked “across the aisle in Texas” and his administration could have inflicted on our nation. </p>

<p>In 2000, we had a budget surplus, we were the world’s only superpower, our currency was the most desirable and stable in the world, better than gold. Unemployment was almost eliminated. We were respected worldwide. </p>

<p>The amount of damage that this president has done to our worldwide stature is immeasurable. We are in a war that had nothing to do with 9/11 and that we didn’t need to be in. Getting out now will potentially cause the deaths of hundreds of thousands of Iraqis. We no longer have healthy relations with Russia, and the cold war seems to be restarting. By naming the Axis of Evil and taking out Iraq, we stretched our military to its limits, and have motivated both North Korea and Iran to build up their defenses against us unchecked. We now face a nuclear North Korea and will soon likely face a nuclear Iran. Both of those nations saw what we did in Iraq and were motivated in their own self-defense. We have sent thousands of our children to their deaths for a war that didn’t need to happen over weapons of mass destruction that didn’t exist. We are facing a much more threatening Iran that really is building WMD, but there is little political will and potentially not enough military power left in this nation to confront them. Face it, we are no longer the superpower we once were. </p>

<p>We have blown our budget deficit sky high because nobody asked the average citizen to contribute to the war effort with a temporary tax surcharge. I would have gladly paid it. The only people who have paid for this war are our fine soldiers who are getting screwed left and right. We have devalued our currency so now even the oil nations don’t want to hold our dollars and are moving into gold. The Canadian dollar is worth more for the first time I can ever remember and it’s just embarrassing because we’re just better! Bush goes to the Saudis and begs for more oil production, and it’s just embarrassing. I just read that Israeli travel agencies will no longer take bookings in dollars and it’s just embarrassing. In many parts of the world, we are viewed as arrogant and stupid because they see those qualities in our leader. Many of the students from the middle east who formerly would get their education in the United States and then return home and have fond memories of their lives in the US are now going to Australia instead because they are finding the US hostile. There was a recent article in the Boston Globe that almost all flights to Brazil are booked solid with illegal immigrants returning home because the money they send home is no longer worth that much and they could have a better standard of living back in Brazil. That is just embarrassing. </p>

<p>I’m an engineer. I used to work in commercial businesses but now I work in the defense industry. I never worried about outsourcing because at my level, I prefer to compete at my full salary with the most talented Indian and Chinese engineers who really want to work here at full price. I have no problem with a brain drain because we are the greatest civilization that ever was and this is the best and freest place there ever was to live. The best would always want to come here. But as we become a less desirable and dare I say embarrassing place to move to, I wonder if the world’s most talented will still want to come here. Then I have to compete with the world’s most talented who are willing to work at 1/2 price in Asia. Or maybe our currency will be devalued so much that it’s really full price in Asia. </p>

<p>Barron, the President matters sooooo much that I just want to shake you until you see it. Again, no disrespect intended and sorry for flaming.</p>

<p>Yep. What he said. ^</p>

<p>I have a feeling that some of the Clinton real estate “dealings” may rear their ugly heads if the duo wins the nomination. Do they really think that everyone has forgotten about whitewater-gate ?</p>

<p>After 8 years of total and utter incompetence, God help us if in the grand scheme of things we really care about real estate dealings, Monica, whether a candidate inhaled, whether a candidate is black, female, sexy, a former POW, a Mormon, a Christian or whatever. </p>

<p>Who do we think has the vision, intelligence, experience, credibility and most importantly political skill to lead, govern and get our nation back on track from our disastrous current predicament?</p>

<p>Re post #254: Well said!</p>

<p>ClassicRockerDad: Agree. ^ Of the three Democratic candidates left standing, any of them would certainly be a vast improvement over Bush, but I do think trust is also a key issue. And while Hillary is smart and capable and definitely has the intelligence to move us out of this mess, I do think she presents a trust issue-- at least for me. I just don’t trust her. I like Obama very much, but I think he needs to focus on the issues and less on the rhetoric. Hillary’s attacks thus far are just a glimpse of what’s to come for him, and I don’t think he’s done well in response. </p>

<p>So here’s yet another plug for my candidate of choice: Edwards-- smart, capable, decisive, focused, definitive on the issues and always has been, and he is far superior in these debates, most especially this last one in SC. I also think he has good plans, and they’re viable plans. I think we got a real insight into both Hillary and Obama the other night, and it sure wasn’t pretty. </p>

<p>Of the Republicans-- and heaven help us if we get another one up there-- if someone put a gun to my head and forced me to vote for one, I’d have to vote for Ron Paul, even though Mitt Romney <em>looks</em> tailor-made for the part. :wink: McCain will keep us in this war forever, plus he’s too old. Ron Paul probably is, too. Hopefully, we won’t have to worry about the Republicans this go round.</p>

<p>Post #257 is well said too.</p>

<p>Here is squeaky clean John McCain, taking how much in campaign contributions, and helping a guy who cost taxpayers over $3 billion.</p>

<p>"Founding Member of the Keating Five
Back in the old days, defendants in famous trials got numbers – the Chicago Eight, the Gang of Four, the Dave Clark Five, the Daytona 500. McCain was one of the “Keating Five,” congressmen investigated on ethics charges for strenuously helping convicted racketeer Charles Keating after he gave them large campaign contributions and vacation trips.
Charles Keating was convicted of racketeering and fraud in both state and federal court after his Lincoln Savings & Loan collapsed, costing the taxpayers $3.4 billion. His convictions were overturned on technicalities; for example, the federal conviction was overturned because jurors had heard about his state conviction, and his state charges because Judge Lance Ito (yes, that judge) screwed up jury instructions. Neither court cleared him, and he faces new trials in both courts.) </p>

<p>Though he was not convicted of anything, McCain intervened on behalf of Charles Keating after Keating gave McCain at least $112,00 in contributions. In the mid-1980s, McCain made at least 9 trips on Keating’s airplanes, and 3 of those were to Keating’s luxurious retreat in the Bahamas. McCain’s wife and father-in-law also were the largest investors (at $350,000) in a Keating shopping center; the Phoenix New Times called it a “sweetheart deal”</p>

<p>Hillary is no worse than McCain.</p>