Several of the schools that you are considering that have full tuition scholarships consider music as part of those scholarships. Emory is definitely worth while if her music is of high enough level that she could be a candidate for an audition based music program. We know students who had excellent music ECs that did receive the scholarships at Vandy and Emory.If she plays a less represented instrument even better.
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I like your approach - as long as you have an assured, $45K safety that she’d be happy to attend - then you are looking at this properly.
Schools with no merit - whether an Ivy or Gtown - are out.
I would first make sure I want to go to the school before wasting time. Too many kids pick on pedigree but not likability - and you want likability. You have to be there four years, day after day.
USC is far larger than a Vandy, which is far more urban than a W&M, as examples.
If I was simply looking at acceptance, I’d start with W&L - because the Johnson Scholarship seems best of the best.
But the Wash U Danforth, but the Vandy Ingram, Corneiluis Vanderbilt and Chancellors are also worth a go.
There are others like Davids (Belk), W&M 1693, UVA Jefferson, UNC Moorehead Cain - that are all possible - but less likely. The question becomes - how much work can she handle?
I would not U MIami, Tulane and I don’t believe American has one anymore - although maybe I’m wrong - they had the Frederick Douglas.
Many schools have a one off. For example, my daughter didn’t win any at W&L but got in. She chose low ranked College of Charleston - where she had 3 endowed scholarships - Ketner and the cohort groups (Charleston Scholars and International Scholars).
Providence has the Roddy for pre-med hopefuls.
Many schools have full rides - and if she’s an NMF, the list expands.
You don’t need a reach per se. There are kids like your daughter walking around at just about every flagship, if not every flagship.
So it really comes down to - how much can she handle? Some burn out at 5 schools and other 25. Writing essays takes a while.
But depending on her major, the “name” may be over hyped - so given that most important - I know i can go here - where she applies is up to her - but I would lean toward W&L (not on your list) and then Vandy, WUSTL, Emory. I would shy from Tulane and Miami. I might look at Davidson if you like small - and even add SMU - which has the Presidential. You also have some top schools, major dependent, like Ga Tech, with Stamps.
But you might find out you can’t do as many as you want.
The focus should be on those schools that will hit $45K - not these - which are additional nice to haves so pick a few if she wants - and then see how she feels. Watch the deadlines - some - like Emory - are very early.
Good luck.
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I would strongly suggest that you run the net price calculators for each college under consideration. They are currently set up for students entering college this fall…and that’s not your student. So, use as guidance only. If the NPC comes out WAY above your price point, then this needs to be a discussion with your student.
I think it’s very important for kids to know BEFORE they send any applications, that if the money isn’t forthcoming to bring the cost to the family price point, the school will need to be dropped from consideration. And there will be no guilting the parents into saying yes.
Your student needs to understand your financial limitations.
Are you looking at any public universities in your state? And why the consideration for selective colleges?
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Yeah I have zero concern about my daughter having misconceptions about what we are willing to pay. We made it clear sophomore year and she has processed it and internalized it over time. Also, she nor I are not fixated on selective schools either. We are interested in a good value. And if spending the afternoon writing an essay for the equivalent of a lottery ticket that could result in full tuition scholarship to a school that is a good fit for her, be in Emory or Fordham, seems well worth it.
I’m mostly interested in how parents guided their kids in building their reach school lists. I kike the idea that others have about prioritizing ones with slightly higher chances of large merit first. I feel good about the targets and safeties she’s chosen. Just wondering how the pacing plays out this fall and how much energy it takes to add an additional lottery ticket/reach school. I’m imagining it will go something like: (1) Get apps in at safeties and targets in September and October. (2) In late October and early November, apply to as many reaches that she is interested in and has the energy for. Hoping with ACT already out of the way, 10 to 12 apps will be manageable.
I like what you did.
Thinking 3 buckets
- Colleges that will assuredly hit $45k and assuredly admit you. Could be one or more. This is your most important bucket. If you applied to one school, this would be it. If you apply to 20, this is the most important. But you decide.
- Schools that you like that likely get to $45k. It’s not a reach but as an example, a U of Alabama has auto merit - so you know whrrr you stand up front. Some very good LACs are throwing out money. Top publics like Florida and FSU will be there full pay as will Purdue. Others like Ohio State will likely get there. I’m not thinking of any ‘reach’ privates but this is the idea.
- Last bucket is reaches that likely won’t get there but may - the ones I me ruined above - the WuSTL, Vandy, Wash U etc.
How many the student does in each doesn’t matter as long as they are satisfied with one from the first And many kids choose safeties over reaches. A reach (and it’s not if you get in) - it’s not important
But a student from Virginia - they have UVA and W&M - reach schools that cost under $45k but if you live in Iowa, they are $65-90k so a lot depends on where you live And major. Tulane may be a reach but if you want to major in Supply Chain, ASU and Michigan Stae are 1 and 2.
Since you asked, my kid applied to 21, got into 17. I’d have classified five as unlikely and she got into one But like you we were a full pay family and I had a budget like yours ($50k) and this school came in $81k and it came off without discussion
My daughters final four were 3 safeties and a match she ended up at the 16th ranked of 17 she got into We visited 30 schools and this was 4th and I told my wife that day she’d end up there We also got into schools, then visited and she realized she didn’t like them. UGA - top Honors, UF, etc came off due to too big.
Had she gotten into a reach at $50k like Emory or Rice, would she have chosen it ? No Her bff at Charleston got into Penn, Rice and Vandy.
My other kid chose a safety over a reach he got into because he visited the safety with friends and saw he could get a single room with shared bathroom with one and that sold him.
The point is - each story is different. The # in each bucket (the buckets I used) anre differebt. And many don’t apply to reaches at all. Heck some top kids may apply to one safety and be done - the in state flagship, a football team they follow or a local.
But for her list - I don’t know where you live but let’s say it’s Iowa and she prefers U Uowa over Ohio State, then no need to apply Ohio State even tho the ‘rank’ is higher and it might make cost. If she liked Iowa, every other app could be a reach.
I don’t know your state nor major so that’s for example purposes. But I think she can make her own bucket story dependent upon some factors I raised money wanted safety options plural to have choice. Others don’t need that. They are good with just one safety.
Hope that helps.
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I have a question a little off this topic.
What if you could get a full tuition or more at a school that wasn’t at this level? Would that be of interest? If you want full tuition/merit, it may be more likely at other schools - and usually when you earn one, they come with enrichment.
There was recently a student that one a full ride for security studies at East Carolina. He was deciding between UMD (so he had the academic chops), JMU and others - and lo and behold this came - decision done.
My kid was enrolled at her school and a week or two later got some endowed scholarships - bringing our cost to minus $1250 a semester….we got a check. She got them because another student or student didn’t take it - one chose the Presidential at SMU I believe so we didn’t go there for it but what if your daughter earned that up front - would a free tuition at Charleston (as an example) with 10% odds trump a free tuition at Vandy with 1% odds. I don’t know the odds - I’m just making it up.
You titled it as reach but I’m wondering - would a free tuition with enrichment trump - free tuition at a top rated school? Or would mixing some in at least be something of interest to give a better chance?
The answer may be no and that’s absolutely fine - but just wondering.
Thanks
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If she got full tuition off at more then one school, we’d for sure visit each and she what she she feels as the best fit. For her, that’s somewhere on the east coast if possible so geography matters. Also, I know she wants to be in company with more intellectual types, and those students tend to be at honors colleges or more selective schools.
We just went through this exact process, down to the dollar value and similiar stats. As someone noted above, we considered most targets as reaches due to our need for merit aid. I did not stop my daughter from applying to any true reach schools, but I letter know that if she got in, the chances for aid would be slim. One bit of advice missing above is to use the common data set to see where her stats fit- a good way to seek aid is find test-required schools where she is well above the 75th%ile. My daughter wanted NYC so I showed her how she would fit in the middle of NYU and Columbia ‘s stats, so she wouldn’t likely qualify for aid. So we found Fordham, she applied “sideways” (ie being true to herself and writing the essay in one shot). We were blown away by a full tuition scholarship and she will likely attend!
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More intellectual isn’t necessarily at an Honors College and all Honors Colleges are different.
But some schools have a cohort of Honors. Not sure your daughter’s interest but mine was in two - so these are small groups, they have enrichment - like sessions with diplomats/ambassadors, an included May trip abroad after Freshman year, and other things. So there’s Honors - but these are a sub group. So as I noted - one boy, now doing medical research with the MUSC, went there over Vandy, Penn and Rice. I don’t think he felt dumbed down. Her scholarship came from an interview weekend.
But lots of schools have Honors - don’t assume they are more academic. Many kids join them for benefits (dorms, early class registration) but don’t even partake - and eventually drop.
There’s also learning living communities at schools. Don’t know her interest - but sure she might score big money at Emory. But it’s far more likely at Charleston - is why I asked.
Perhaps she can win the 1693 at W&M but she likely has better odds at an Alfond at Rollins.
The Morehead-Cain at UNC is fantastic but perhaps the Eugene du Pont Memorial Distinguished Scholar Scholarship at Delaware is less competitive from a stat POV.
Then there’s programs - people think Alabama is a large public with big greek life and sports - but it will easily hit your budget (minus $20K) - and they have Randall Research, McCullough Pre Medical, Blount Scholars. These types of things are all top level kids, small groups, etc.
So she can find what she wants in many places - some will be easily attainable and others will be impossible. Some will be really really hard but not impossible.
If schools that have special programs interest her, I’d gather them - pick a few brutally hard and a few less hard - but that big focus has to be one (preferably two) schools that are $45K or less and then others that likely are.
There’s no right or wrong answer - but personally, unless one is ok with constant rejection, I probably wouldn’t overload in the impossible. But even the scholarship that the student won at East Carolina - very easy school to get into - but a very difficult scholarship to get.
So that’s what you have to think about.
If it’s just - we’d love a lower cost - with her stats, right now you can be as low as $20K at very good schools - but she’d say - they’re not reaches. No, they’re not - they’re safeties with a ton of smart kids that buy kids like her in - so they end up with a mix- lower stat kids because they’re easy ins - but a ton of really high stat kids that they bought in.
I don’t mean to pivot from your initial topic of only reach schools - but it sounds like - low cost would be considered - and that could be via a full tuition or full ride - but there are other schools where they would buy tuition down to a single digit level based on her accomplishment. Sure there are tradeoffs - but at schools that buy you in, there will be tons of smart kids.
There’s also “2nd tier” schools - LACs for example - that kids choose because they are bought in - half the price of others - and i’m sure you’d find smart kids too - and partiers and more, etc.
Hope that helps.
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That’s such a great outcome! My daughter would be over the moon about that opportunity..NYU is her dream school, and I went there but things have really changed! I really prefer the Fordham campus in that it’s an actual campus. Manhattan can be for weekends.
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Those are all good insights for a logical person. But most teenagers don’t make decisions that practically. So the lowest price won’t be where she goes unless it’s a place she’s interested in and there’s often no rhyme or reason. Alabama is a hard no and the whole state of South Carolina is great. Georgia and Massachusetts are okay, Vermont is not. There’s no way to reason with some kids at this age. I don’t have that much control but there are signs of maturity. It was NYC only and now she’s interested in large flagships too. Go figure! Anyway, hopefully she’ll go to the most affordable school of the ones on her list . But we can afford up to 45k and made that agreement with her, so if there’s one she really prefers then she can choose that.
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ha ha - so you’ve basically said - $45k or less - we’re in.
So Bama is out - how about Florida? GA ok - SC great. How about North Carolina or PA , etc.
Does she prefer cities or rural, what size? Sports, etc
Give a bit more.
But would schools like Wash U or Vandy be out then because they’re not East Coast? Is an Ohio ok or too West, etc.
We can see what full rides - or under $45Ks exist - but they might be too big, etc.
But then you’re into a match me and maybe fill out the template and note - also looking for schools with full rides.
You’ll get what you’re looking for.
If she likes urban, then Charleston could work - it’s in SC. It’s an unlikely but possible at $45K - but with her stats, she might get interview weekend and it could go down from there. Off the free path, but Furman is known for huge merit so I think $45K is possible. Don’t know the size she wants - but it’s the kind of school - 2nd tier LAC - they don’t get enough kids so they discount heavily - and it’s a fantastic name. So that’s (for one state) two schools - one with potential huge scholarship - and another that’s not assured $45K but has great odds.
If we knew the states to consider, we can probably find more. Knowing the type of school (size can help too). U of SC - for large school - a great bet too. Honors is possible there but it’s a great school either way - but none of these three would be academicky but all three would have lots of smart kids.
Thanks
My daughter would start at Lincoln Center, we are visiting next week for the first time. 
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Another school to look at: UMN Twin Cities Honors-w aid $36/yr. Not a reach but quite highly ranked and it looks like a very fun school. The honors program student reps did seem quite intellectual.
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University of Oregon honors 45.5 (tuition, fees, room, board) w aid.
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Yes, there is an Amtrak station in Newark very close to the Delaware campus, and you can use that to conveniently get anywhere from DC to Boston. Lovely campus, nice-sized college town, easy access to larger cities . . . really an enviable set up.
In my experience with my S24 and hearing about his friends, talking to other parents, and so on, a lot of kids do start burning out a bit on the process. They may swear they will have no problem giving each of a gazillion applications their full attention, they may even believe it before they get started, but as it grinds on they may start cutting corners, may not really giving every part of every application the time and individualized attention it should get, and so on.
But 10-12 is a very reasonable number as long as she starts early and paces herself. And some are a lot easier than others. It is really more a matter of how many supplemental/special merit essays they have to do.
And in fact kids chasing merit might do more than 10-12. I do think she should make sure not to put a lot of energy into a bunch of long-shot merit reaches before getting to the more realistic ones. But again if she prioritizes the more realistic merit opportunities, starts early, gets them done to her satisfaction, and then has the time and energy left for a few more reachier applications by their deadlines? Cool.
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If I had to choose my favorite college considering the student vibe/personality, the academics, cost/value proposition, the campus look and feel, the surrounding area, and overall gestalt…most days I would probably choose Delaware. I hope OP’s D considers it!
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There is an Amtrak station on campus that goes to nyc. There are ways to get to Philadelphia, and 3 hour train to get to DC. UMASS was also on the table with similar merit.
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Sorry - not specifically to @Mwfan1921 but to OP and other posters for thoughts in general.
One thing about Delaware - I don’t think it’s likely to hit $45K if OOS.
But - for the “Emory” type home run scholarship school, they have the Eugene du Pont Scholarship | Merit Scholarships.
I think it goes in the - I’m unlikely to attend here bucket - but there’s a very small chance to hit $45K, either with normal merit or the Dupont which you have to be out of this world to get (but perhaps easier than a Vandy/WUSTL type….but perhaps not (they might have less of them so it might be a harder get).
We don’t know what state OP lives in - but assuming it’s not Delaware. This upcoming year, tuition, room and board is about $59K and will be higher next. They show direct bill of $59,194 but perhaps things like a cheaper dorm or lesser meal plan are available but you still have to eat.
They’d have to earn the Trustee Scholarship, which is $12.5K to $15K so by then, they’d need the max to squeeze in. There are Honors Scholarships too but hard to get.
So this is an unlikely but you never know. For access to Philly/NYC, at that budget, a Temple or Stony Brook or to go more LACish New Paltz might be better choices - given access to Transport. Rutgers might be possible too…might - need to look more.
But back to OPs theme of hail mary, that’s sort of UD with an outside chance at regular reaches - but I don’t think OP initially intended these type of schools but moreso perceived academic monsters.
But it has veered this way.
That’s why OP should do a match me - because we now have a region they like - but some states they love, others they are ok with and some are out.
My advice is to keep your expectations in check. While your daughter sounds amazing, the number of superior applicants out there is crazy. Schools like Vanderbilt tend to give their big awards to those who were also accepted to Harvard (I know somebody like this).
Emory is the same, offering their big awards to those getting into higher schools. That being said, somebody mentioned music and if your daughter is at a high level that might work…I don’t know but it’s worth a shot. Just keep the expectations in check.
I think there is a chance that Delaware could be affordable. I also feel that way about the U of South Carolina. Apply and see!
Has she considered the University of Richmond?
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