<p>D2 spent 2 summers in Detroit for ABT summer intensive. She danced at the Opera House, and it was still beautiful. The area around it had few cool restaurants and bars, and the ballpark was right next to it. We stayed outside of Detroit(Dearborn) when went up there.</p>
<p>My boyfriend lives in Indian Village in Detroit. His street is very nice but largely abandoned-- real big, historic houses, and the surrounding neighborhood is quite scary if you go in the wrong direction more than a block. Entire blocks are completely abandoned, most of the houses have giant burn holes in them and are boarded up-- many have suspicious looking squatters skulking around. His house has been broken into several times and he’s had cars stolen right out of his driveway. I don’t mind being right downtown during the day, but we avoid going to his parents place because it’s just so bad around there. </p>
<p>There was a story going around a while ago that they had hoped to bulldoze some of those abandoned blocks and use the land for farming to make Detroit more sustainable. A big issue there is that there are people in extreme poverty who get food stamps, but can’t afford a car to get to a store that will accept bridge cards, and the public transportation system is not incredibly useful-- it is not like the comprehensive systems you see in other cities. I imagine that would never be realistic but it would be nice if they do /something/ like that, to get rid of the detritus and put something there that would help the city, there are entire blocks of houses that are so ruined I don’t think they can ever be repaired that are just sitting there and becoming crack houses and brothels and piles of ash.</p>
<p>I live in a “nice” suburb about 45 minutes or so from Detroit proper, and it seems like a big problem is that even if they put something in Detroit to draw a crowd there to help with the economy (I am thinking along the lines of shopping, something Detroit lacks and something my city has been adding to attract tourism), the people in the surrounding nicer suburbs they need to attract are so scared of the crime they’d go just about anywhere else before they’d go there. It seems like they have a lot of problems they would need to fix before they could really do much to help the economy, but they can’t really do anything without helping the economy first because there is no money.</p>
<p>That’s interesting about Hartford when West Hartford is so wealthy. </p>
<p>I’m not giving up on Galveston, Texas yet. Like Atlantic City, it’s located on a beautiful stretch of oceanfront. They’re not making more ocean front, so whether it’s a matter of gutting what is there like AC or building up like Galveston, I think those cities will be back.</p>
<p>Of course, I’m not moving to either place.</p>
<p>I recently heard an interview on NPR with a city planner for Detroit. She was explaining how her schooling was all about building cities and they were basically having to make it up as they went along in shrinking Detroit. Interesting but sad.</p>
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<p>lololu, I loved the show. We know a few of the actors and were so disappointed and dismayed to hear that it was cancelled. It was a beautifully written and acted on-location drama, with realistic storylines and authenticity that is lacking in most police dramas. The picture of the city of Detroit that the show portrayed was, I agree, one of beauty, even in the desolation. I know that the production was very involved in some community service in the city while there filming, and looked forward to continued support of those organizations. How sad that that now won’t be possible.</p>
<p>How can you beat Michael Imperioli and James McDaniel? I liked that it was about very real crimes in a very real city.</p>
<p>Ema:</p>
<p>You brought up one of the practical points - as the people living in the neighborhoods decreases the ‘local’ businesses within reasonable walking distance depending on that marketplace go under leaving the remaining people without much in the way of local businesses. The schools are affected in this way too.</p>
<p>I thought I read that part of the plan for dozing 25% of the city would involve relocating people so they’re more concentrated like they used to be rather than how it is now where people who once had closeby neighbors are finding themselves in a lone home on a block and not as safe as they used to be. If they can be offered relocation to a nicer home in a safer neghborhood with more convenient access to shopping, schools, etc. then it seems that many people would be happy to take them up on it - especially since there’s no real neighborhood left to stick around for.</p>
<p>Are you from CA, dad? I only ask because the decades-long decline of many old industrial cities is nothing new. I took a look at the “America’s 150 Forgotten Cities” link <a href=“http://web.mit.edu/dusp/dusp_extension_unsec/people/faculty/lhoyt/Hoyt_Leroux_FC.pdf[/url]”>http://web.mit.edu/dusp/dusp_extension_unsec/people/faculty/lhoyt/Hoyt_Leroux_FC.pdf</a> My H’s hometown is there (of course) and I suspect mine would be there had they not decided to annexed tons of new subdivisions. I know the relieved feeling on driving through a formerly ‘bad’ area to find clear vacant lots instead of old vacant buildings. In some big cities they gentrify these areas, but that’s not an option in other cities.</p>
<p>It really makes you wonder how things could have been different. What should southern boom towns be doing now to prepare for their eventual decline - bank $$ for the future decline? Hope it doesn’t happen, and deal with it when it does?</p>
<p>ucsd<em>ucla</em>dad: That makes sense, I think a lot of people would be willing to relocate for those incentives… but where would those incentives be in Detroit? Some of the surrounding suburbs have those things but the city itself? Not so much.</p>
<p>Treetop:</p>
<p>I’m in Cal. now but have lived in other places (not ‘from’ here) and I’ve traveled extensively including to most of the more major cities in the country including Detroit and other cities in Michigan. I’ve seen some of the decline in other cities but it just seems that Detroit stands out with the desolation. I haven’t seen it like that in other cities that have had some decline including some of the others on the link a poster included in this thread but maybe it exists and I just don’t know. I assume the impact on Detroit is because it was so heavily dependent on the auto manufacturing business along with the support industries for it, which employed a lot of people, that when that collapsed in the area due to competetive pressure from both other global auto companies and from more business friendly locations in other states drawing the auto manufacturers out of the traditional locations in Detroit and relatively nearby cities, there was a domino effect on the collapse and a more severe impact than some other cities that have had decline.</p>
<p>I haven’t read the WSJ story on America’s most dead cities, but I would question the inclusion of some of the towns on the list.</p>
<p>I viewed two travel/style TV programs within the past year or so about Galveston, including a Rachel Ray ‘40 Dollars a Day’ episode. The other show was about a middle-aged interior designer and decorator whom travels the U.S. to tour grand homes and hotels. Neither show had any bad things to say about Galveston, no surprise there.</p>
<p>As for the New York towns, clearly Buffalo is a victim of de-industrialization. Both Buffalo and Albany have been outpaced by the creation of affluence in the suburbs. Buffalo fares well when compared to Detroit because Buffalo retains the classic assets of urban infrastructure.</p>
<p>My guess is that the Detroit situation is made worse by the lousy municipal government and the historic indifference of state government. And of course racial antagonism in southern Michigan inhibits progress too. And I get the distinct impression that Ann Arbor is considered the cultural (and possibly commercial/financial) heart of that part of Michigan, not Detroit. By the way, the Mayor of Philadelphia has proposed similar ‘controlled shrinkage,’ with a plan to raze large swaths of abandoned blocks.</p>
<p>If they can be offered relocation to a nicer home in a safer neghborhood with more convenient access to shopping, schools, etc. then it seems that many people would be happy to take them up on it - especially since there’s no real neighborhood left to stick around for. </p>
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<p>People are not at all trusting of a long-corrupt system. There is such a culture of mistrust that sticking with what they know is preferable to leaving it & getting sc***ed. </p>
<p>I agree with the observations by LakeWashington, although I am not sure that the state didn’t care about Detroit so much as Detroit refused any assistance by the state (considering it meddling by outsiders) … although I may be wrong on this.</p>
<p>The problems in Detroit are just overwhelmingly entrenched. Mayor Dave Bing is trying to change things, and the emergency school manager, Robert Bobb, tried to change things. The new school manager, Roy Roberts, is a highly respected former GM exec who has his work cut out for him. I truly hope the men & women who are trying to change things will make progress.</p>
<p>EK, the Fox is BEAUTIFUL. Years ago, I saw The Pretenders there while the theater was undergoing renovation. When I went again a couple years later, I was astounded at the quality of the renovation. You will be pleased with the experience. The area around the Fox is very nice, and the area around the RenCen is vibrant. You should visit Greektown, especially if you like baklava. The Detroit Institute of Arts is first-rate, if you are an art fan. Dearborn is a typical suburb, although its ethnic make-up is different in that it has a huge Muslim population. It is a very interesting area … I think you will find it intriguing.</p>
<p>If you have any spare time while in the D, pm me … maybe we can meet IRL for lunch.</p>
<p>Kelsmom, I as read post #31 I was thinking ‘isn’t there a significant population of Arab Americans in and around Detroit?’ and then I saw your statement. Aren’t many of these people fairly well educated entrepreneurs whom human capital would certain aid a rebuilding effort?</p>
<p>The Arab American concentration is in Dearborn, rather than in Detroit. I know it’s hard for some to understand the distinction, but suburbs & city are separated in so many ways. There are Arab American business owners in Detroit (party stores & gas stations come to mind). However, I don’t know that the Arab Americans in the area are necessarily in a position to affect change. We do have a wealthy Arab American population in northern suburbs that is perhaps in a better position for that sort of thing, but I am not sure that rebuilding Detroit is any more a priority for them than it is for any other group (ethnic or other type of group) … not meaning this in a bad way, simply as an observation of how things are in the area; this is not limited to any ethnic group. Again, there has been a Detroit/non-Detroit split for many years. The dynamic is hard to expain.</p>
<p>I live in the Detroit area. One of the most amazing things is the complete absence of things like supermarkets and movie theaters in the city itself. Years ago I heard it called history’s first “ex-city”…the first time a city and its suburbs have traded roles. Yes, there are pro sports and few museums in the city, but for most pople it’s a corpse waiting to be buried.</p>
<p>There was a great article in the May 2011 GQ about the crews that knock buildings down. There are supposedly about 72,000 buildings in Detroit awaiting destruction.</p>
<p>Here’s another interesting phenomenon…the culture clash between black suburbanites and urban blacks moving into their neighborhoods: [Foreclosures</a> helping change color of some suburbs - macombdaily.com](<a href=“http://www.macombdaily.com/articles/2011/03/01/lifestyles/doc4d6682ba4eb15206944482.txt]Foreclosures”>http://www.macombdaily.com/articles/2011/03/01/lifestyles/doc4d6682ba4eb15206944482.txt)</p>
<p>My family is from Detroit and I was born there. My maternal grandmother moved there from Canada with her family around 1901. They were called “10-cent immigrants” because you could take the ferry from Canada for a dime, and come to the U.S. to live. She grew up near Dearborn, that was farming country back then. My grandpa moved down to Detroit from the farm and joined his brothers working in the city. Both my parents were born there and grew up in Detroit in the 20s and 30s. It’s amazing and sad to see a once-great city in such decline.</p>
<p>EK, if you have time on your visit, Greenfield Village and museum is very interesting. You can see the laboratory where Edison discovered the lightbulb, which was moved there.</p>
<p>Schmaltz, you are so right! And the clash of which you speak is one I was thinking about earlier today. I have spoken with several suburban African Americans who have shared their feelings with me … they are not pleased with the people who have been moving into their area. I understand, because we are having similar issues in our neighborhood as a result of foreclosures. I don’t see it as a racial thing (the ones in my neighborhood are lily white), but a socioeconomic thing. But it is definitely a new & different phenomenon around here.</p>
<p>And I second Greenfield Village & LOVE the Henry Ford Museum.</p>
<p>I am back from my trip & I apologize but my " host" wouldn’t leave me alone for 10 seconds- even staying at the hotel with me!
I did get to go to Greenfield Village which was very interesting although I got a little worn out- the weather was perfect though, not hot at all.</p>
<p>Even though I was prepared for it, I was surprised by the amount of closed businesses, several of the restaurants that my host had planned on were closed ( in Dearborn) although there was a good grocery store by my Dearborn hotel that had a fantastic salad bar.</p>
<p>My Detroit hotel was right across from the fireworks so we could see them from my room, very impressive.
The preparty/fundraiser before the concert was in Chelios chili bar upstairs which was great, old fir floors, aged brick wall, nice atmosphere except the music which was so loud I almost needed earplugs.</p>
<p>Concert was in the Fox theatre which was obviously painstakingly redone, although I had an issue with the ushers, they were seating people through the whole concert- very distracting especially with shining their flashlights.
In Seattle, they don’t seat people during innings at the baseball stadium so I wasn’t used to the audience restlessness. ( Eddie however, did acknowledge the Detroit crowd by bringing out his electric guitar )</p>
<p>While as a white woman I felt by far to be in the minority, everyone was very courteous ( & the youth were much more polite than I think they would have been in Seattle), although when a huge crowd of teens began jumping up and down along the waterfront before the fireworks, I wasn’t sure which way the mood was going so I went back inside.</p>
<p>Obviously the area needs some sort of industry- but what? It was really sad to see the conditions of many buildings.</p>
<p>^Michigan governor was advising our pres. he called her to be part of his economic team. Looks like the whole country was forced to follow Michigan lead into the “heights” of deepest economic hole. Great future!</p>
<p>MiamiDAP, Detroit has a long, long history of “living” outside of the state … that is, all control of anything “Detroit” is internal. This has been the way things are for MANY years (of corruption and questionable practices that haven’t helped the very long downward slide). The governor had no say in what went on for the most part (although she did appoint an emergency manager for the schools a couple years ago). Our new governor is working far more closely with the mayor than others in recent history have been able to work, and a new emergency manager was recently appointed for the schools. To say that Jenny from the Block had anything to do with the way things are in Detroit is unfair (and I am no fan of hers).</p>
<p>EK, it is a sad tale of a once proud city … although even when my Dad grew up in Detroit there were some pretty rough areas. The area around Wayne State is actually a lot better than it was in the past. When my Dad was young, the Cass Corridor was actually worse than it is today. But the poverty in the city has really gotten so much worse. Lack of education (by choice, because the schools are awful, etc), lack of jobs, lack of reliable public transportation … so many reasons for the way things are today. There are leaders who are trying to help, but it is a daunting task.</p>
<p>You were wise to move away from the crowd during the fireworks. It is always a good idea to exercise caution around crowds. For the most part things are fine, but any crowd anywhere can take a turn for the worse quickly (as we saw even in Vancouver).</p>