Do they have to take physics? [high school student, aspiring pre-med]

[ucbalumnus]

@ColdWombat

When I taught neurobiology, I’d always ask how many people in the class had already taken college physics so I could get a sense of their background (it was usually not many). So in the 2nd week of class I’d have to give a crash course on potential energy, voltage, current, etc. since there’s no way you can understand an action potential (and thus much of the course’s content) without it.

Seems like a physics course with E&M should be listed as a prerequisite for that neurobiology course.

[bigelom3]

For the physiology class I took at Grand Valley, we were recommended to have taken a course in physics beforehand (or at least have a good understanding of physics).

[ColdWombat]

Yeah, I would have loved that. But bio majors usually leave physics til their senior year, after they’re done with all their chem. Even biochem majors often leave it til senior year. In a class of 25, I’d usually have <5 who had taken college physics. I also had to teach the action potential to freshman A&P students, but I just accepted the fact that they wouldn’t understand it as well as if they were upperclassmen and I’d had the time to do my little physics primer. This is true of everyone who teaches these classes, and we do have to get creative! It does help if they’ve had physics in HS, at least.

[ucbalumnus]

@ColdWombat

Yeah, I would have loved that. But bio majors usually leave physics til their senior year, after they’re done with all their chem.

Why would they leave physics until their senior year? Seems like if the department made physics a prerequisite for neurobiology courses (or a prerequisite to declaring the major), that would give them incentive to take it earlier.

[ColdWombat]

It’s just what bio students have always done in my experience. Not sure why that’s the custom. I think it’s because they usually have 3 years of chemistry to take, they leave physics for last. I know that’s why I left physics for last. In their first year, most bio majors are taking at least 1 bio class, chem, calculus, and gen eds. Physics is too much for them, especially if they’re just learning calc. Some of them struggle with calc. The ones who don’t are done with math by the 2nd year, but they also add more bio and that’s the dreaded ochem year. It’s easier to teach neuro to people who have had college physics, but any exposure to physics is helpful. Sometimes I’ll get a chem major that has taken physics, or someone with AP credit. Neuro classes would be underenrolled if college physics was a prereq. But this is a bit of a tangent.

[ucbalumnus]

@ColdWombat

It’s just what bio students have always done in my experience. Not sure why that’s the custom.

Seems that some biology departments go against this custom by recommending physics in second year, and listing physics as prerequisites for neuro courses:

Neurobiology

https://neuroscience.berkeley.edu/academics/undergraduate/declare

In any case, having physics in high school is a good thing for a biology major or pre-med to have before having to take physics in college, whether they do the latter sooner or later.

[mountainsoul]

She doesn’t have to take physics but it will give her options in college. My daughter was also not crazy about taking physics and planned to major in bio with research/PhD as her career goal. I made her take physics senior year because I thought, for the tier of colleges to which she was applying, it would make her a competitive applicant.

Senior year she took AP Bio 2, IB Biochem, and Adv. Physics. I let her take a lower-level physics course because her schedule was already quite rigorous and she didn’t love physics. Biochem was only a 1-semester course so for that semester my daughter was taking three periods of science. But it worked out well for her.

In college, she could choose either a chemistry track or a physics track to fulfill the major requirements. The choice for her was easy—she took the gen chem sequence and orgo. But, if for some reason she couldn’t start the chemistry sequence or changed her mind, she had a basic understanding of physics and could jump right into those courses too.

I understand your concern about your daughter being overloaded since she is taking a research seminar, but that class may not be as much work as you think. At our high school, the first semester is spent conducting research, reading journals, etc. The second semester is dedicated to presenting the project at a research symposium. If a student manages their time well, there can be a lot of downtime.

[Justamom23]

I’m very late to this discussion, but in case this helpful later: my son didn’t want to take physics in high school. Both parents told him he should. He declined, because there were other classes he wanted to take, and took bio, chemistry, zoology, and AP Biology. He’s now studying biology at a UC. We’ll never know if taking physics would have made the difference between a rejection or waitlist and an acceptance at some of the places he applied - but it all worked out fine.

[ucbalumnus]

@Justamom23

He’s now studying biology at a UC. We’ll never know if taking physics would have made the difference between a rejection or waitlist and an acceptance at some of the places he applied - but it all worked out fine.

What does he think about taking the required physics courses in college for the biology major without having had high school physics?

[thumper1]

@ucbalumnus

What does he think about taking the required physics courses in college for the biology major without having had high school physics?

I’m not the writer of this post…but my kid never took physics in high school either (or calculus…imagine that?). She took both her freshman year of college (engineering major) and didn’t think twice about not having either in high school. She actually liked both courses.

[Justamom23]

I’ll have to report in later - he’ll take physics next year as a sophomore (took care of chemistry and math this year, plus some bio and GEs this year).