<p>I hope those were low-carb buns. A 40 minute run is very good. And to top it off with another 40 minutes. I see that you were also supporting the economy with a shopping trip.</p>
<p>Grrrrr… Downtown is packed with people. I got hungry after reading this thread and wanted to get a hot dog from Dog in the Park, but the line was too long! Based on how fast this bus is going, it will take me twice as long as normally. The only good thing about the recession was traffic or i should say absence thereof.</p>
<p>Soo, based on your local holiday traffic, how is the economy going in your area?</p>
<p>We are now starting to experience slower roads and very full parking lots ALREADY.</p>
<p>In the resort areas within a drive from here, the real estate and hotel bookings are going up. I have been told it is the younger people, who see IPO’s coming and so forth.
Oh, to be young again!</p>
<p>I will report on the local mall traffic after my morning haircut appointment tomorrow. I dread it. :eek:</p>
<p>“You really need to let me in on this little secret of yours. Your mother is only going to live so long and whatever money she has is only a loan anyway.”</p>
<p>Oh, it just keeps piling up, and thanks to some of my political “friends”, she may be able to keep virtually all of it forever. (Then I get to give it away!) (Though if I do that, I won’t be able to inherit the “job creator” title.)</p>
<p>mini,</p>
<p>I don’t mean to offend but you seem very fixated on your mom’s money. It’s a little strange. Many boomers have aging parents with considerable resources. I don’t think we all fixate on it. I do have an older brother who is similarly fixated on my parents’ estate. He is quite politically liberal yet enormously fixated on their resources. It’s just odd. My other siblings and I seem to be somewhat more engaged in just living our lives, earning our livings, supporting our kids as best we can.</p>
<p>I guess if your mom’s wealth is such a source of anguish for you that you insist she revise her will right now to insure that all goes directly to social causes or to the Federal Reserve immediately upon her death. That should really free you up to focus on other things in life.</p>
<p>Isn’t it great that nothing prevents any of us in making explicitly clear to our aging parents that (1) we don’t ever want their money, and (2) we don’t think society should allow us to inherit their money, and (3) we want their money to go to what we believe are worthy causes xyz.</p>
<p>It’s comforting to know that if we are deeply angered over tax law in the country we can at least take decisive steps to make sure that we are not personally enriched by them.</p>
<p>I am sure mini will respond brilliantly when he is able to take time away from his very busy and seemingly completely altruistic life’s work:)</p>
<p>But I read the above sentiment a lot in various places and want to respond myself, even though I may be interrupting.</p>
<p>Some seem to argue that we can rely on charity to take care of poverty in this country. Right now we have increasingly serious hunger. You have written hunger is not a problem except in cases of abuse but I provided some links in another thread that refuted that claim. It was a surprise to me to learn how serious an issue this is becoming. I had no idea.</p>
<p>Charity is not taking care of these problems, which are getting worse. I believe the government will have to do something for poverty to be adequately addressed. A few wealthy individuals who decide to pay more taxes aren’t going to solve this problem. A few wealthy individuals who give their parents’ estates to charity aren’t going to solve this problem. Individuals who point this out aren’t necessarily fixated on “other people’s money” but instead fixated on how to solve poverty and hunger. </p>
<p>IMHO people are going to have to start sharing if there is to be enough to go around. It is unfortunate, again imho, that we have to force people to share but voluntary charity is not successful in this country.</p>
<p>We can decide poor people deserve their circumstances because if they were smart and hardworking like us… they wouldn’t be poor. That seems to be a serious argument. Even if you believe that argument, I can’t understand not supporting programs for children who can’t help being born into less than desirable circumstances. And as poetgrl has pointed out on other threads on this board, we really have to help their mothers to help these children.</p>
<p>Even if we decide we are justified in not caring about the less fortunate in the short term, there are self serving long term advantages to providing for those who have less than we do. That requires a lot more words. And I can’t explain it as well or as concisely as everyone else on this thread.</p>
<p>ps- my feelings are a little hurt you didn’t respond to #106 :(</p>
<p>In the spirit of giving and Christmas,our Church has a giving tree…Needy/poor families and their children fill out ‘tags’ with things they need/ want for Christmas, and parishoners purchase the gift and return it to the church for delivery to those who asked… The tag i pulled off asked for an IPAD!!! An Ipad!!! Not socks,not a warm coat,not books, or toys,or something educational,but an IPAD…</p>
<p>I guess the economy is getting better. ;)</p>
<p>^^And because of this you won’t support government programs to address poverty?</p>
<p>This is an argument against the government making sure no children go hungry or do without adequate medical care?</p>
<p>I am off to bang my head against the nearest wall</p>
<p>Huh? “Are you talking to me”. …because i probably do more to help those in need then most of those who rant and rave here…i fully support helping children and families in need of food and medical care…i have a HUGE problem when i am volunteering at a food bank or soup kitchen WITH my children and some in need are wearing $ 200 UGGS and talking on their Iphones…</p>
<p>qdogpa: Apologies if you weren’t responding to my post. For all I know you don’t even bother to read my posts 
and certainly you are under no obligation 
I think a lot of time in real life people frequently are making all kinds of silent lists, lesson plans, etc while they politely pretend to listen to me.</p>
<p>Unlike most here I never studied logic or debate so frequently I’m probably completely unintelligible but what I was trying to say was that charity isn’t adequate to address poverty and it seemed to me you responded by saying either (1) there isn’t really any poverty - or (2) “the poor” are stupid and it doesn’t do any good to offer charity. #1 contradicts my argument but I am pretty sure poverty does exist and is getting worse. #2 could be seen as supporting my argument</p>
<p>Some years ago I read an at least semi-scholarly article that might be of interest to you. If I can find the link I will post it. If anyone else is familiar with this type of “research” maybe they could help me out? The article was about the different attitudes of high and low income parents regarding dressing their young children. The main point seemed to be that high income parents had no qualms about dressing their children as ratty as they pleased because, on the whole, it would not negatively impact how their children were treated outside the home. But low income parents were very concerned that the better their children were dressed the better they would be treated. There were some studies that seemed to confirm the low income parents worldview. I am not commenting on the validity of this article but found it thought provoking.</p>
<p>There are lots of arguments that people aren’t really poor if they have electronics. I think there are lots of problems with that idea but the smart people who post here could clear that all up very quickly. That would be best. But if they don’t and you have any interest I could tell you what I think after the weekend. ;)</p>
<p>“Last edited by alh; Today at 08:47 AM. Reason: trying to get it correct since some here are paying attention to grammar!!”</p>
<p>Lol</p>
<p>Alh…you write exceptionally well…your arguments are logical…and you are well informed.</p>
<p>Social Class in America is one of the better shows ever produced about our society.</p>
<p>Edit: I am going to relist the clips.</p>
<p>Buying someone a 200 dollar pair of UGGS when they have no food or in need of a dentist visit is ridiculous…priorities people…not unlike the homeless who ask for money, i say i’ll buy you food or an article of clothing at a nearby shop,not one has taken me up on this offer. I believe we as a country need to house,feed ,clothe and provide medical assiatance to everyone,but it makes it is ironic when the needy have more expensive stuff then those who donate time/food, to help them</p>
<p>I think I’ve heard just about enough about 1%ers being “job creators” when I have personal, firsthand experience that it just isn’t so. And lowering taxes on them - speaking from firsthand experience - won’t create a single job. Not one. The government creates jobs; the private sector ships them abroad. </p>
<p>And I am also tired of hearing about how 1%ers “earned it”. I have firsthand experience that this simple isn’t true. </p>
<p>Now the plural of anecdote isn’t evidence. </p>
<p>Whatever. I don’t have problems with people keeping their ill-gotten gains, whether they “earned them” or not. I really don’t. I do have a problem with a nation of hungry children, and people dying from inadequate health care, and where political power has become a matter of “one dollar, one vote”.</p>
<p>[People</a> Like Us: Social Class in America - YouTube](<a href=“http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLC6D871A2A8C3C8EF]People”>People Like Us: The Official Playlist - YouTube)</p>
<p>Plus I love this clip…the young girl who talks about not belonging to the group…touches my heart and makes me smile at the same time…</p>
<p>[YouTube</a> - Broadcast Yourself.](<a href=“YouTube”>YouTube)</p>
<p>And then there is Tammy’s story.</p>
<p>I agree with mini’s post #160…except…society needs money to run…and I think it makes sense to get the money from people that have benefitted from living here and actually have the money…than getting the money from people who only have an iPad and a pair of UGGs.</p>
<p>Dstark, please don’t utilize my comments to further your agenda, as i have never said those unfortunate,needy,poor people need to contribute more taxes,whether they have Uggs or Ipads…</p>
<p>;)</p>
<p>"qdogpa
Member
*
“Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: East Coast
Posts: 813
Air condintioning without paying income tax??? They prob ably have an Ipod and Iphone too, oh the horror…Everyone should pay something,sorry…”</p>
<p>I see you also have a thing for Apple products… ;)</p>
<p>If they have the ‘luxuries’ i mention the post above, then they should have to pay some tax? Wouldn’t you agree???</p>
<p>Those that truly need, i have no problem helping, those that ‘need’ to have whatever anyone else has, i won’t</p>
<p>As someone who grew up with not a pot to pi$$ in, and received little help from any agency,who’s father worked 3 jobs to make ends meet, i understand hunger,no healthcare,etc…But there are many people gaming the system, and we,as a nation, need to weed them out,so those truly in need,receive the help they deserve</p>
<p>I was at the local food bank last week, and a couple walk in ,late 50’s perhaps,we provide them with some basic staples,probably 2 bags of groceries…The director happens to look outside, and calls a few of us over…we watch as the coup,e get into a Land Rover,granted probably a 2007-2008, but we all shook our heads, and continued on…</p>
<p>First of all…the poor do pay taxes…</p>
<p>That argument that the poor don’t pay income taxes…therefore, they don’t pay taxes is false.</p>
<p>I don’t think people in poverty should pay income taxes.</p>
<p>I really don’t care if poor people own a pair of UGGs. I don’t covet their stuff.</p>
<p>There are plenty of people that were doing well…that are no longer doing well…maybe they lost their jobs…got sick, etc…</p>
<p>The LandRover…maybe there are car loans on that vehicle.</p>
<p>I was just talking to a friend of mine who is in the real estate business. He said you can tell if a family is in trouble when their car is nicer than their home.</p>
<p>Even poor people like to buy stuff. My guess is…if you really wanted to…you could buy a pair of UGGs. I could…but I have no interest.</p>
<p>He said you can tell if a family is in trouble when their car is nicer than their home.
I have observed this phenomena for years & I admit I don’t understand it. Sometimes the wardrobe is quite upscale as well.</p>