<p>??? Whats not wrong?? I dont follow.
There is a difference between a no-show and a cancellation. If a person just doesnt show up, they should understand that there might be a consequence.(As was mentioned above,this is usually spelled out in the office policies that the patient signs at their first appointment). Some doctors offices will give one warning, and then not reschedule a patient if they do it twice. Many schedules just cannot easily accomodate this.</p>
<p>Just curious… If a client has scheduled an hour appointment with their attorney or accountant to discuss a matter and then doesnt show up, is the client billed for the professional’s time?</p>
<p>Most, if not all, doctor’s offices I’ve ever been to–they have always asked–or it’s a box you check on a form somewhere-- “is it okay to leave messages on an answering machine at your home?”</p>
<p>Stuff happens.</p>
<p>I was supposed to have my regular check-up; it would take less than 10 minutes, although the commute was rather time-consuming. I waited and waited and waited. My specialist was attending a patient who’d been scheduled for a routine 15-minute appointment but turned out to need major emergency care. After the first 1/2 hour, I was told that the doctor would be right out. After one hour, I asked how much longer, and was told
he’d be out soon. After two hours, I left. I was upset that I had not been given a realistic timeline earlier, but glad that the patient was receiving the needed treatment.
Another time, I showed up for another check-up. The doctor had showed up earlier in the morning but then gone home with the flu. His staff had tried to contact me but, of course, I was not near a phone.
And then, S forgot he had a dental appointment. 
Altogether, I’ve been very happy with the care we’ve all got, and the policies regarding cancellation/no show.</p>
<p>jym626–attorney husband doesn’t charge for cancellations. Things happen and more importantly, like I mentioned in the original post, I don’t think that an est. patient/client should have a rule like this thrown at them. As someone just mentioned, perhaps if the patient had cancelled before, then charges should incur. Attorney husband also does not expect payment when client(doctors) walk out the door. In many doctors offices, co-pays are expected when you check in–BEFORE you see the doctor.</p>
<p>“Bulcroo,
They are not initial visits but yearly annual exam/check up visits. I never like to visit doctors either, prefer alternative medicine like acupuncture, etc… , and I told this to my current doctor( many time to his face), but he won me over, so I don’t dislike doctors as much.”</p>
<p>I thought this was funny, as the time spent convincing you to see doctors cost the doctor extra unscheduled time. Should he have just ignored this so as to get in to see the next patient more quickly?</p>
<p>“jym626–attorney husband doesn’t charge for cancellations. Things happen and more importantly, like I mentioned in the original post, I don’t think that an est. patient/client should have a rule like this thrown at them. As someone just mentioned, perhaps if the patient had cancelled before, then charges should incur. Attorney husband also does not expect payment when client(doctors) walk out the door. In many doctors offices, co-pays are expected when you check in–BEFORE you see the doctor.”</p>
<p>Attorneys charge for everything, including phone calls. Insurance companies do not generally reimburse for phone calls, or allow doctors to charge the patient for them. That is many hours a week of free care given to patients. Attorneys can charge for this time.</p>
<p>Many attorneys charge fees just to evaluate a situation, even if they don’t take a case. And this fee can be $400-500 dollars for 1-2 hours work. Out-of-pocket, no insurnace company billing or discounts from insurance companies. </p>
<p>Copays are required by the insurance company to be paid. It is part of your agreement with the health insurance company as a subscriber, that you will pay the doctor a copay. The doctor is required to collect it. It is supposed to be collected at the time of the visit. Billing for copays is not cost effective, and the insurance company expects it to be paid upfront, as does the doctor.</p>
<p>By the way, if any of you have a good primary care doctor, with whom you are pleased, I am very sorry if s/he makes you wait at times because extended issues with another patient have come up, or if s/he has to take a phone call from a hospital, or the flu epidemic has hit sooner that expected, and s/he is flooded with patients. </p>
<p>You may be surprised to see that if it gets too onerous, with Medicare or insurance payments falling, and patients complaining about waiting or copays when the doctor is trying to do his or her best, that that doctor may just pick up and leave the practice of medicine. That is, after paying off $250,000 in debt.</p>
<p>So I would recommend seeing this with a bit of a wider perspective that people are not cars that can wait for parts, but have to be treated fully as they come in. Doctors do the best that they can, and I have never known one that purposely kept patients waiting doing frivolous things, such as painting one’s nails.</p>
<p>As to charging for missed appointments, if there is a scheduled appointment in a time and someone doesn’t show up, then it is a good idea to charge for that time. That serves as a deterrent for it happening again.</p>
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<p>Yup. As I said above, that’s what my H did.</p>
<p>notredameal,
My question was, if a person does not show up (no called cancellation, just doesnt show up)does the attorney charge.</p>
<p>“The few I’ve been to that are in private practice, who ae not connected to a teaching hospital, do stop scheduling patients around 4. I also know they usually don’t schedule anyone between 12 and 1; in fact, one will get an answering service if you call at that hour. Maybe they’re all in there working away between 12 and 1.”</p>
<p>Jack, actually, that is when the MD’s in private practice run over to see their patients in the hospital, because they MUST see any hospitalized patient daily (some require twice daily)…especially if they are the internist or specialist in charge. Hospitalized patients are not typically scheduled well in advance. A doctor can have a full day of office patients and then have several patients that have been hospitalized, who are usually at more than one hospital (dictated by the insurance company again.) If the MD doesn’t see the patient, the insurance co may opt to not pay or insist on discharge. So when the MD is behind because of other emergencies and answering phone calls, they still get to go make rounds either at 6 am, lunch time or at the end of the office day. Sometimes, they even have to run out during the day (hence, many like their offices next to a hospital they frequent.) MD practice is generally, unpredicable. So, again, Jack, if you have found an MD who never makes anyone wait and only books one/two patients per hour, I am not sure that is the MD for me. Glad you like that type.</p>
<p>“notredameal,
My question was, if a person does not show up (no called cancellation, just doesnt show up)does the attorney charge.”</p>
<p>Often an attorney works on a retainer, so if you give him or her $5000 for your case, then it can be deducted off of that, unless he instead works on another case during that time. Remember, a lot of what an attorney does is paperwork, and s/he doesn’t need the warm body in front on him or her, as a doctor does.</p>
<p>“The few I’ve been to that are in private practice, who are not connected to a teaching hospital, do stop scheduling patients around 4. I also know they usually don’t schedule anyone between 12 and 1; in fact, one will get an answering service if you call at that hour. Maybe they’re all in there working away between 12 and 1.”</p>
<p>Between 12-1 doctors generally make phone calls, run to hospitals, check labs, etc. Plus the office staff needs time to have a break or complete work from the morning patients.</p>
<p>Often doctors will go to hospitals 3 times a day, either different hospitals or to see a newly-admitted patients. Very rare for a doctor to go out to a one hour lunch, or go to lunch at all for more than a few minutes.</p>
<p>Most litigation attorneys work off retainers–as the wife of an attorney, I can tell you that most corporate/business attorneys and esp. one like my husband who has doctors for clients bill by the hour. His time is valuable just as any doctor. Therefore, given that his doctor clients are billed by the hour, he does not have a policy for charging for cancellations, nor does he schedule 3 or 4 clients at the same appointment time. (Doctor bashing, I know, but thought you might want to know that not all lawyers are the same just as not all doctors are the same!)</p>
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<p>blucroo: The doctors where I’ve never had to wait (more than 30 minutes) are the ones who are connected with teaching hospitals. I haven’t a clue how many patients they book per hour, I just know that I’ve never had to wait more than 30 minutes. The one doctor I see who is in a private practice, I see only annually, and I always ask for the first slot in the day; again, I haven’t a clue how many folks are booked per hour. I just know I don’t have to wait.* </p>
<p>The two that I have seen who are connected to teaching hospitals are, in fact, world renowned in their fields. (They are specialists.) They also lecture and travel quite a bit. One of those doctors literally (without exaggeration) saved my life many years ago (after having wasted a lot of precious time and wrong diagnoses with some MDs in private practice). And, as I stated earlier, I also gave up on my daughter’s pediatrician when she was very young, because of consistent missed diagnoses and ridiculously long waits. Took her over to Duke, where she was seen right away (with the appt made the day before), and got a correct diagnosis (pneumonia as opposed to “allergies”). </p>
<p>I am well aware that there is a huge difference out there among doctors–huge. Some are at the top of their fields, do cutting edge research, AND see patients; then there are others–some excellent and dedicated–still others, not so bright. (As the old joke goes, “What do you call someone who graduated dead last in med school?” Answer: “Doctor”.) </p>
<p>At any rate, I prefer the first type I described above. If those are not the MDs for you, then that’s certainly your choice. Perhaps I’m simply more discriminating when it comes to my (and my family’s) medical care.</p>
<p>*Let me just add that I did have to wait once, longer than 30 minutes, for one of those doctors. However, the doctor himself came in and apologized, said they’d had an emergency, and he was running late with everyone, and asked if I would mind waiting longer. That made a huge difference for me, too. That’s all it takes, really–instead of being left alone for an hour or more, wondering what’s up. To consistently be running late, every single work day, is (in my opinion) unacceptable; somebody either needs to cut back on the number of patients, or get more help.</p>
<p>“Therefore, given that his doctor clients are billed by the hour, he does not have a policy for charging for cancellations, nor does he schedule 3 or 4 clients at the same appointment time. (Doctor bashing, I know, but thought you might want to know that not all lawyers are the same just as not all doctors are the same)”</p>
<p>An attorney can do other work if a client doesn’t show up. </p>
<p>You can doctor bash all that you want, but there is soon going to be a real shortage of primary care doctors, such as pediatricians and internists, due to poor insurance, Medicaid and Medicare reimbursements and the hassle of dealing with all of the above.</p>
<p>So you might as well get used to the waits.</p>
<p>Attorneys are not subject to these market forces.</p>
<p>Why would you want to bash doctors? I don’t get it. Please explain what doctors have done to you?</p>
<p>collegialmom: I think there’s already a shortage of primary care doctors. I have noticed that the few times I’ve been to one, they almost immediately refer you to a specialist. In fact, I had a complete physical when I turned 50; I have no heart problems, very low heart rate, low blood pressure, have always exercised, etc., but because I have a family history of heart disease, I was immediately referred to a cardiologist for a full work-up. Given my family history, I thought it was probably a good idea, so I did it. (And just as an aside, this was a cardiologist in a private practice, and I did not have to wait longer than 30 minutes!). However, my point is-- primary care physicians already seem like a relic from another age. If you go to one, and there’s anything at all out of the ordinary–bam–you’re immedately referred to a specialist. I find that a little odd, as though the primary care physician is sabotaging his/her own practice, but maybe that’s all tied up with insurance, too.</p>
<p>There’s also a shortage of OB/GYN doctors because of incredibly high malpractice insurance costs. The ones who do practice are often booked for up to six months in advance. And then there’s the low reimbursement for these doctors by health insurance companies.</p>
<p>I work at a child psychiatrist’s office. We don’t take insurance at all here because the insurance companies do not pay an adaquate rate. We cannot book 5 patients an hour to maximize income, because each appointment is either one hour or a half hour, and the doc always runs on time. There is no squeezing patients in. We get emergency calls almost daily, which we can only accomodate if people who aren’t going to bother to show up call ahead. It’s very very frustrating to have a parent on the phone crying because their child is in crisis and not have an appointment to give, then have another patient simply not show up later in the day. The doc can’t fill that slot with no notice, and the emergency has to wait til someone calls who is considerate enough to inform us that they can’t make their appointment. Many times the people who don’t show up without calling do so because their child has soccer practice that they forgot about, or is ‘tired’ or some other weak excuse. So the policy in this office has become: give us 24 hours notice or we charge for the whole visit. (of course we don’t charge people whose children got sick in school that day, or some other reasonable excuse). The way we have enforced that is that we now take credit card numbers to keep on file, and inform patients that they will be fully charged for no-shows. If a new patient does not want to give a credit card number to reserve the appointment, we don’t book one. If a patient calls the day before to cancel, or even the day of the appointment with a decent reason, they are never charged. It’s that tiny percentage of people who don’t call and don’t show up for no good reason who are charged. The policy is enough to cut way down on no-shows.</p>
<p>tanyanubin, your office’s practices fall well within what seems reasonable! I think you’re even being generous with the “if a child gets sick at school” excuse - since I’ve had parents tell me that to cancel a piano lesson, only to find out from the child later on that the reason had more to do with the parent accidentally double booking the child, or themselves, or something. I am always amazed that parents produce such lies and forget to tell their children about them!</p>