<p>Our HS requires students to submit stamped, addressed envelopes for all transcripts. That seems reasonable.</p>
<p>Restricting the number of schools applied to isn’t fair to kids who need to compare FA offers, kids who really want to attend highly selective schools, and kids who cannot afford to travel to every school they are interested in before applying.</p>
<p>Scalp hunting is deplorable though, especially when it has the potential to affect classmates.</p>
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<p>Sorry, this is a huge sore spot you’ve just hit on. Schools vary in what resources they have. D1’s school staff was 3 people last year, and they were already working late and working weekends. This year, it’s 2.5 people (it was almost just 1.5; it took a concerted parental effort all through the summer to urge the district to reinstate one of those cut positions), and their workload has been ramped way up because the school teaching staff has been cut back. Teachers used to handle the enormous amount of admin work for the school’s extensive and highly successful involvement in academic extracurriculars. Now because of staff cuts, teachers have no free period for that admin work. Their after-school hours are already spent coaching academic teams. There’s no time left for the admin work. Even with parental support, that load now falls on the admin staff who are already truly giving their all, and have a work ethic above and beyond what any parent could expect of the professionals at their school. </p>
<p>Not to mention the cuts to the school’s office budget. The cut was 2/3rds of last year’s office budget. </p>
<p>So yeah, it is simply not always possible for a school to send out an additional 10 transcripts per kid without something else getting pushed out of the way to make room for transcript sending. If your child’s school doesn’t have these issues, that’s truly wonderful (I am being sincere, not snarky). Just please don’t assume that all schools are in that same situation.</p>
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<p>[shrugs shoulders] Dunno. Depends on the student and the high school and the culture therein. I entirely appreciate applying to a large number of tippy top schools because of the random nature of admissions, even for top students. I even more appreciate applying widely to maximize financial aid opportunities. That probably covers many of the students who are applying to a large number of schools. Until the next generation, where 20 apps will be common, just like 9-12 is nowadays. Parents on CC reminisce about applying to 3-6 schools.</p>
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<p>Many professionals in the workplace routinely work 60-70 hour work weeks, and routinely work in the evenings or on weekends. If you are talking about admins who do the same and still can’t get it all done, then more power to them. If you are talking about admins who work a 9-5 type day, take an hour lunch break, and are outta there by 5:05, then I still say a few weeks of a crunch season aren’t that big of a deal.</p>
<p>BTW, in the spirit of the Common App, why can’t some system be devised so that transcripts could be electronically delivered to colleges instead of the tedious photocopy / stick in envelope methods? It seems really backwards that in this day and age, there isn’t just some master email list and the admin person just hits click and addresses an email with a bcc to however many schools.</p>
<p>I am talking about people who work a 10 hour day without lunch, not to mention weekend work, without earning the kind of salary that professionals earn in the private sector. I see these people working their tushes off every single day. It is always “crunch season” for that office, not because the admins aren’t efficient, but just due to sheer workload. Trust me on this one, OK?</p>
<p>Electronic submission of transcripts would be far more sensible.</p>
<p>Schools could send transcripts electronically. Read post #4 in this thread:</p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/780381-how-long-does-your-school-take-send-transcripts-recs.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/780381-how-long-does-your-school-take-send-transcripts-recs.html</a></p>
<p>I guess that the LORs are still a problem though.</p>
<p>Son’s high school charged $2/transcript, I believe. </p>
<p>I don’t see why number of applications should be restricted, especially since many other things don’t appear to be, particularly in regards to admission to the tippy-top schools (private school counselors, extensive “editing” of essays by others, calls to schools to get students off waitlists, etc.). </p>
<p>It’s a jungle out there.</p>
<p>Fair enough, slitheytove - I’ll trust your judgment!</p>
<p>Given that my kids’ school already “restricts” quite a few things (not offering certain AP’s offered at nearby schools, making them have to take a consumer ed course and not letting AP Econ count for it, having to take gym all 4 years, etc.), they don’t get to “restrict” where my kid applies to college. It simply isn’t their business. At all. Especially when they aren’t footing the bill.</p>
<p>And honestly, even though the trophy hunting is as obnoxious as can be, I think it would be out of line for an admin to refuse to send a transcript because they suspect someone of trophy hunting.</p>
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Just because some organizations abuse and exploit their staff, that’s no excuse to expect the staff in other organizations to submit to abuse and exploitation, which is what a 60-70 hour work week is, unless you’re doing it by choice, or you’re self-employed. </p>
<p>There was a general understanding in the industrialized world in the last century that eight hours a day was all that was reasonable to demand of people on an ongoing basis if they were to have a decent amount of sleep and something resembling a family life. Somewhere along the line that understanding has been lost in some quarters. My feeling is, if you are in a situation where you have no choice but to work 12+ hours a day, you have my sympathy; but that sympathy stops when you start to prescribe this as a norm for others.</p>
<p>I don’t know where you guys are getting a 40 hour work week, but our school administration (unless they coach which many do) are at the office at 7:15 and gone from sight by 3. With the exception of the super’s office the school offices are closed 2 weeks after school gets out until mid-August. I don’t begrudge them parental help, but I would be miffed if they whine when they don’t have “free” help. I will say, however, our guidance office has never, ever whined about sending transcripts/recommendations even though there is only 2.5 of them plus an admin for 800+ kids of which almost 90% of the seniors g on to college.</p>
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Well, that’s a 38.75-hour work week. Seems close enough. And unless your school is very different from ours, there are few of those administrators who don’t take work home with them more days than not, especially in the upper-level jobs.</p>
<p>We’re not talking the principals, though. We’re talking the people who answer the phones and walk over to cabinets to pull, photocopy and send transcripts. How long can that take? So don’t take a full lunch hour, then. That is a huge pet peeve of mine where there is work to be done at my office, we’re on deadline, and the employees still take their full hour lunch break. Take a few minutes to eat and move on with it. Stay late or come in early. It won’t kill you. It’s just not that big of a deal for people who view what they do as important. It’s a clock-puncher mentality to think otherwise, and I ding my employees who have a clock-puncher mentality.</p>
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Is that a two-way street? Can your employees count on hearing from you, when their personal lives make demands on their time, “come in late or leave early–it won’t kill me?” If so, then I have no quarrel with this. But it’s not like that at a school; it really can’t be. In my experience, most school employees bend over backwards to give more than they are required to, often to a heroic degree. And in most cases there’s very little flexibility in the other direction. So whatever extra time the staffers put in is above and beyond and should be respected as such. It irritates me when it’s taken for granted.</p>
<p>I spend at least a full day each week at my kids school answering phones, stuffing envelopes, etc. I have tried many times to get the GC’s office to let me help, but student records are confidential. I think many of us would help if they can just come up with a way for us to do it.</p>
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Really? What about a trip to the rest room? Perhaps a personal errand? An actual break during the work day. These are human beings you’re talking about, Pizzagirl. I find your point of view here quite ugly and disrespectful. As I’ve said, I’ve done hiring in law firms for decades, which is a field with a huge “crunch time” every year and let me tell you that we don’t stop being human beings when it is crunch time, and I’m sure the same is true of most school employees. I don’t know about other school systems, but in mine, overtime is very hard to come by.</p>
<p>Re: the admin work of sending out transcripts/recs. I’m sure that staffing varies among high schools. However, this is our kids’ future we are talking about. Not being able to apply to a variety of school could mean (& could have meant, in our case) that our family would have had to pay about $80k more total for my son’s college education. </p>
<p>With all due respect to the professionals who work in HS admin (& they are often very dedicated and helpful) – that’s something that just has to be made to work (sending out the transcripts/recs). It’s something that’s too important to our kids’ future, I believe.</p>
<p>Jolynne, I agree with you. I am also willing to bet that at most high schools guidance counselors do work very hard. I know in our hs we have a few that go far and above punching a clock. Some are there til 5pm, so they do not all run out at 3pm everyday. They are not required to be there til 5pm, so I see that as dedication. We do have teachers that are out the door every day at 3 pm, but that is because many tutor for extra money right after school. They need to do what they need to do to feed their families too. Others add to their salaries by coaching after school. Most teachers do find time to help their students at some point if they request extra help.</p>
<p>At my s’s hs (private) they were limited to 6 applications. After that, if they wanted to apply to more, they could, but their request for transcripts, LOR and other paperwork got put at the bottom of the pile AND the parent had to pay $50 per request (IIRC, I dunno-- older s applied to 2 schools, younger s applied to 4). The money went into a kitty for teacher/staff treats (food, snacks, etc). I used to just bring them a big platter of baklava from Costco and put it in the staff lounge. They always appreciated that, and knew that we appreciated them and their efforts.The school counselors put a lot of time and effort into working with each senior to help them establish a good viable list of reaches, matches, and academic/financial safeties. It is doable to keep the list to 6. </p>
<p>That said, I do think employers and employees do need to be flexible and sensitive to the needs of others, which includes in this case both the needs of the students and the needs of the staff. IIRC, some of the same posters here who are unduly chastizing others for their opinion that staff should be willing to put forth some extra effort when the time is necessary are the same posters who complained vociferously in the past that their counselors couldnt get the materials (recommendations, whatever, I forget) out in a timely manner. </p>
<p>I recall when I was in grad school I worked at the VA. I was in the nursing station holding a large, heavy stack of charts that I had to take somewhere. I asked one of the male staff that was standing there doing nothing if he would kindly open the door for me. He looked at me, told me he was “on his lunch break” and turned his back. Nice guy. Hope that wasn’t the typical government employee mentality.</p>
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Wow. $50/additional application beyond 6?! Do other private schools limit applications like this?</p>
<p>My private school requires $20 for every application beyond the first TWO.</p>
<p>^Stories like this make me realize how lucky we are to go to public school. No extra charges. The GC suggested 8 should be plenty, but there’s no requirement.</p>