<p>Whatdidyou, I have heard that being promoted in Big 4 is a tough case though. Although I know that it adds up good points on one’s resume. I guess I would try going for other firms first and see if I like it. Thank you!</p>
<p>In big4, and public accounting in general, you can make it to the manager level if you have solid technical accounting and communication skills. However, as you move up the ranks your job becomes more and more about developing client relationships and building a book of business and less about being a technical master. Of course, part of keeping a client happy is being a great accountant, but your long term options might be limited if you have trouble bringing in new business.</p>
<p>the eventurer, </p>
<p>I hadn’t heard that at all. the Senior promotion is virtually guaranteed I thought, promotion to manager someone tougher but still very doable, and the promotion to partner is near impossible. And I think this is pretty standard across most public firms. Could be wrong though, and alot of it probably depends on your location/clients and of course on you.</p>
<p>For the smaller and midsize firms, you need to bring in clients if you want to become a partner. This isn’t true for the Big 4. However, you need to be VERY, VERY good and a standout at some field in accounting. At Big 4, most people tend to have pidgeon holed specialties especially in the audit arena. Thus, they become forensic specialists or specialists in auditing banks, retirement plans etc.</p>
<p>Hi I have a GPA question for whomever can help address this. All help is very appreciated.</p>
<p>Regarding how BIG4 firms view my college GPA when I interview for internships; which GPA(s) do they look at?
[Q. #1]Do they calculate your college GPA by themselves or do they look at your overall GPA from your institution’s transcript?</p>
<p>I will be a CC transfer student and I received a some mediocre grades in non-transferable courses whose credits do not transfer to my institution (such as intermediate algebra) and also got a few A’s in courses that will not transfer (CPR classes and such.)
[Q. #2] I was curious as to if they ask for ALL your transcripts and they have your GPA calculated from there (including ALL your courses ever taken are in the GPA calculation; such as a D in a non transferable Int. Algebra class will be in the GPA calculation)? OR, do they look at your GPA from your current institution regarding only transferred courses in the calculation? As in, they just have you bring in your transcript to the table and the number they see on that is your GPA.</p>
<p>[Q. #3] Do they have separate categories for different GPA’s; such as Overall GPA and Major GPA and Accounting GPA? If I had a 4.0 in all my Accounting and Business courses how favorably would that be looked upon?</p>
<p>I’m really confused on this process and would appreciate any insight and answers to my question!! Thank you so much in advance.</p>
<p>Bob.</p>
<p>Well lets get one thing straight there is no real fine line. So it isn’t like you must be younger than XX. However in most firms partners have forced retirements at age 55-62. So it isn’t realistic to start a public accounting job at 40 and expect to make partner. Firms want people with partner potential in 13-15 years. So I would say the ideal age to start a career in public accounting is under age 30. That way you have time to actually make partner, principal, director senior manager etc. That being said I have never seen a firm prefer a 23 year old over a 28 year old. As long as you graduate in your 20s are are absolutely fine! However 30+ will create issues for both you and the firm you work for. This is of course for entry level jobs not experienced jobs. </p>
<p>So in summation</p>
<p>Ideally start your career under age 30. Since in most states there is a 150 unit requirement generally you won’t find anyone under 23 getting hired since you need 5 years of college. Late 30s and 40s is too old to start with the expectation of having a successful progression and promotion.</p>
<p>Below is a link to evidence my assertion. </p>
<p>[Retiring</a> accountants try to keep firms alive - Sacramento Business Journal](<a href=“http://www.bizjournals.com/sacramento/print-edition/2011/09/16/retiring-accountants-keeping-firms-alive.html?page=all]Retiring”>http://www.bizjournals.com/sacramento/print-edition/2011/09/16/retiring-accountants-keeping-firms-alive.html?page=all) </p>
<p>[USATODAY.com</a> - Retiring Deloitte CEO built his career on integrity](<a href=“http://www.usatoday.com/money/companies/management/2003-05-29-deloitte-ceo_x.htm]USATODAY.com”>http://www.usatoday.com/money/companies/management/2003-05-29-deloitte-ceo_x.htm)</p>
<p>@ Valley Account…I feel pretty discouraged since I will be 31 when I graduate with my degree in accounting. Should I maybe reconsider what I study for? I am going to start my jr yr this June and I am 29, does age really matter if I have an awesome GPA and background??</p>
<p>Hoping to get a general consensus on the situation I’ll be facing this fall: </p>
<ol>
<li>Will graduate with 2nd bachelors (accounting) 150 credit hours met</li>
<li>Will have 500 hours towards the 2000 to be licensed (my state requirement)</li>
<li>Have a guaranteed internship for winter 2013 which will earn another 600 hours</li>
<li>Will start sitting for the CPA this fall</li>
<li>I will be 26 this summer</li>
</ol>
<p>My question is: My career clock is ticking, though I’ve already had a successful career in sales management and segued from my business degree into the focused area of accounting, I’m not sure if my next step should be a MAcc program for better recruiting options or if firms will be enticed enough by me having my CPA. If all goes well I would have passed all 4 sections by July 2013 (I’m not working the rest of this year to study for both the GMAT and CPA). There are only two reasons I would do a MAcc, one is for better recruiting opportunity because my undergrad had very little options, and two so I can study the ISACs track to also get the CISA and do Accounting Information Systems Audit. </p>
<p>If I just go on having the CPA I’ll be 27 when I’m recruited. If I wait and go through the MAcc I’ll be 28 plus have 3 degrees which sounds like I’m a professional student (horrible). Thank you all in advance for your insight.</p>
<p>Don’t know how qualified I am to answer your q’s, but Ill try:</p>
<p>I wouldn’t worry about your age, mixguy & texasgirl. Your both still young but likely bring more to the table than us youngins. Be confident. </p>
<p>MACC VS No macc:</p>
<p>For most people, being in a quality MACC program will be more beneficial (in getting a job) than getting the CPA, but then again its also more expensive. </p>
<p>Entry lvl positions are easier to get through on-campus interviews. With that said I know of several people who got in without the on-campus interview. It depends a lot on your networkings skills, likability, GPA. I would try networking first (go to your state society of CPAs, contact those you know with connections; former teachers and such).</p>
<p>Also going into a Macc with a low undergrad GPA (?if you have one?) isn’t necessarily going to help you (unless you just want more debt). </p>
<p>Good you’ve had internships, many have not. Can you leverage those into full-time offers at either of those firms? </p>
<p>FYI: I don’t know if i’d take a huge gap off of work to study for the CPA. Gaps can look bad.</p>
<p>Hello,</p>
<p>I wouldn’t say you are too old yet although your age may be factored into the decision of the hiring managers. You might want to consider private over public. If you have children and a mortgage public might not be the place for you. In some positions a lot of travel is required and you will be working 60-70 hours a week. I actually have some friends that work for PWC in Austin and they all work 55-65 hours a week and travel frequently.</p>
<p>Hey guys, I have a question, I’m currently a student at a NJ community college planning on getting a degree in accounting and other than TCNJ and Rutgers I don’t know what other schools to apply too. I’m looking to stay relatively close to Northern New Jersey (2-3 Hours away at the farthest). Any schools worth looking into? I’m open to both big or small schools most important thing to me is getting a job with a Big Four firm in NYC. Thank you</p>
<p>The big 4 and large public accounting firms don’t care what you have to offer unless it involves real world accounting experience for a f1000 or a public accounting firm. The big 4 and mid tier firms like BDO and McG want young, high gpa, impressionable people who they can mold. They want people who can work 14 hours a day for 7 days a week during tax season if it is needed. Socially it would be hard for a 32 or 33 year old to fit in with people in their early to mid twenties. </p>
<p>There is really no point in trying to make a career after a certain age in public accounting. If you start at 40 you have nothing but low pay and long hours to look forward to. Partnership won’t be a possibility. </p>
<p>If you start before age 30 you can be a senior manager in early to mid 30’s and partner in early 40’s. Then you can retire before the mandatory age of 58-62 with a hefty buyout. Age always matter in public. I just had this conversation with a retired partner. He mentioned that in one office they had a guy who was ex military. He started in public accounting at age 38. By the time he was up for partner he was 55. They didn’t want to make him a partner since he didn’t have many years left to offer. They wanted to have at least 10 years of service before forced retirement at 62. </p>
<p>Just look at the links I posted. GPA and academics will not cover up age regardless of how wonderful you are.</p>
<p>According to a recent article, Accounting, tax and payroll jobs expanded for the ninth month in a row. Just last month alone, 2000 new jobs were added. For further information, see the following article: [Accounting</a> Hiring Outpaces Economy, Hits New Record – CPA Trendlines](<a href=“Accounting Hiring Outpaces Economy, Hits New Record - CPA Trendlines”>Accounting Hiring Outpaces Economy, Hits New Record - CPA Trendlines)</p>
<p>What are some good minor degrees/double major degrees to get in order to complement accounting? </p>
<p>If it matters, I am getting into the honors college at Arizona State University, and I applied for a four year master’s program there (comes with an internship my 3rd year). I meet all the requirements, so hopefully I will be accepted. :)</p>
<p>I am 29 just finishing up freshman year and ValleyAccountant is basically saying give up and go down a different path?</p>
<p>What are the chances of an accountant major from a small university in nc making it at larger accounting firms, or the big 4? Do they even acknowledge smaller, unknown/unranked colleges?</p>
<p>I never said give up! Ultimately the choice is yours. If you are going to be graduating at 33-34 and pursuing a career in public accounting that is great. However, depending on where you go you may experience age discrimination. For example I turned 24 last month and I am a senior that supervises the entry level staff. Basically someone my age would be your boss. My boss when I was a 22 year old staff was 26. You will be the age of the partners in my group when you graduate. </p>
<p>Now that is just the firm I work for. This isn’t anywhere near a big 4 firm but we have over 90 total employees. The goal of someone that wants to do well in public accounting should be to make partner or exit for industry. You won’t have a snowballs chance in hell of making partner if you start at 34 and the mandatory retirement age is 55. I know a firm partner that just had the same issue at another firm. A guy started in public at 38 and he was a rockstar. He got his CPA got promoted to senior then to manager than to senior manager. He reached senior manager at around 49. The firm decided to not give him partnership because he didn’t have enough years left to offer. Now instead of getting a junior partner job at 250k he is stuck at around 150k. That is just entry level partner.</p>
<p>In a few years the guy could easily have made 400k+ if he brought in business. However he will never be partner because he is way too old. </p>
<p><a href=“http://www.accountantsadvisory.com/pdf/PartnerTrack.pdf[/url]”>http://www.accountantsadvisory.com/pdf/PartnerTrack.pdf</a></p>
<p>note that JH Cohn has a retirement age of 65</p>
<p>[CPA</a> Management Essentials: Do Your Partner Agreements Include These Six Key Provisions?](<a href=“http://www.wscpa.org/Content/39775.aspx]CPA”>http://www.wscpa.org/Content/39775.aspx)</p>
<p>again more discussion on mandatory retirement age</p>
<p>[Mandatory</a> partner retirement and succession planning is a hot issue | AccountingWEB.com](<a href=“http://www.accountingweb.com/item/104752]Mandatory”>http://www.accountingweb.com/item/104752)</p>
<p>[Jacob</a> Weichholz | LinkedIn](<a href=“http://■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■/pub/jacob-weichholz/10/a53/758]Jacob”>http://■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■/pub/jacob-weichholz/10/a53/758)</p>
<p>Check the guy out! I don’t know him but it looks like he is implying he got booted by E&Y.</p>
<p>The facts are the facts look at it and make your own mind up Rudnick! I am not a dream killer I am just trying to inform people!</p>
<p>Hello
Thank you so much TaxGuy for this thread! It really is very helpful. 
I am gonna be a freshman at University of Illinois-Urbana Champaign this fall and will probably major in Accounting. How is the recruiting for Accounting majors at UIllinois-Urbana??
And another question is that do you think I should go for the 3+2 MS/BS Accounting program or should I just get a double major in Finance/Accounting to get enough credits for the cpa?? And can I be hired at the big 4 with JUST a Bachelors in Accounting ??</p>
<p>Shourya2609,As I said in post number one, the school you attend is irrelevant. How many times do I have to say this! I am sure recruiting at Univ of Ill is fine. I would personally recommend the 3+2 MS/BS. However, I wouldn’t do a BA and MS if the MS isn’t more specific such as tax, forensic etc. Yes, as long as you have your 150 credits , you can get hired with a BS in accounting.</p>
<p>Can anyone confirm what ValleyAccountant said:</p>
<p>“The big 4 and large public accounting firms don’t care what you have to offer unless it involves real world accounting experience for a f1000 or a public accounting firm. The big 4 and mid tier firms like BDO and McG want young, high gpa, impressionable people who they can mold.”</p>
<p>By the time I apply for the Big4 FT Entry level I will have 6 months of internal audit experience from a governmental org and 6 month of accounting experience from a NPO. I was hoping that my experience will outshine my GPA, which is a 3.4. I don’t have any PA or F1000 experience.</p>