^In other words, ISIS is the child of the ill-fated US policy? If so, how did they let them grow so big? Didn’t the US government know it was coming? We spend billions on intelligence, we have NSA and allowed them peeking into our underpants for the sake of security. Wasn’t that enough to get their job done? What were they doing while ISIS was growing feeding on disaffection be that religious, economic or social?
^ We were warned about what would happen if we invaded Iraq. Many people predicted this would be exactly what would happen. One only needed a basic history of the ME to know it would open a powder keg. But people preferred to hear the “we would be welcomed with open arms” version.
^Let’s not go there. That happened more than 10 years ago. If all you can say is there’s not much you can do because you made a mistake over 10 years ago is not saying much. I don’t plan to get condemned for a mistake I made ten years ago. You govern with what you inherit, or do you say I can’t govern because you didn’t make me prez 20 years ago? What i’d like to know is how they missed the rise of ISIS so completely and failed to contain them sooner? That doesn’t take going back 20 years, does it?
^ They were never going to be contained unless we remained occupiers for the rest of time.
You ASKED where they came from; we answered, and now you’re fighting with us over it?
It doesn’t MATTER if you “don’t want to be condemned for a mistake made 10 years before.” They’re here because of actions 10 years ago. Now we have to deal with it.
“What i’d like to know is how they missed the rise of ISIS so completely and failed to contain them sooner? That doesn’t take going back 20 years, does it?”
Because our policies fertilized the dirt, so to speak, in which the ISIS plant grew.
It’s like holding a match close to a wooden structure despite warnings not to do so and then having someone say - how could they have missed the start of that fire and now the structure is burning?
I disagree that they are here solely because of the Iraq situation. The invasion of Iraq may have intensified their hatred towards western countries, and instigated more violence, but liberal/leftist policies are ultimately what allowed them to plant their seeds over here.
So the brothers at the heart of the Brussels bombings are ordinary thieves? Let’s hope that the religious fervor of their compatriots and next potential bomber is even more tenuous.
They were ISIS period. The bomb maker is still on the run. I am unclear if another one also escaped the airport scene and is on the run. Are the police looking for one or two?
I like Pizzagirl’s line that the Iraq invasion fertilized the dirt. And that dirt is remnants of many failed policies – including the British post-colonial creation of nations where no nations existed before – and the corrosive influence in the region of our big ME ally, Saudi Arabia. That’s just for starters.
Which is why many observers believe that if we eradicate ISIS, another group will step into the void. It’s a quagmire. Which is one reason Obama has been so reluctant to get involved with directly and meaningfully fighting ISIS on the ground. (And I don’t either support Obama’s approach nor criticize it. I have no opinion on how to proceed because I know that I don’t know enough to have one.)
“And that dirt is remnants of many failed policies – including the British post-colonial creation of nations where no nations existed before – and the corrosive influence in the region of our big ME ally, Saudi Arabia. That’s just for starters.”
But we will never achieve energy independence because every mommy in the US “needs” a gas guzzling SUV or minivan. And I’m not really kidding. I don’t care about any given individual driving an SUV or minivan, but I do care about it at the aggregate level and I’m kind of disgusted that gas guzzling cars are so-called necessities
That is grossly incorrect!
What is the relevance of Schengen to the attacks in Paris and in Brussels. The terrorists are home grown and travel freely across borders.
Hardly. While their criminal record might have been trivial, those people were/are part of networks of radicalized Islamists that have plenty of support in their communities in Western Europe. They are not unique and there are hundreds of their ilk ready to follow in their footsteps.
Large neighborhoods in Schaerbeek, Anderlecht and Molenbeek provide plenty of shelter and support.
This article is a bit dated (2010), but helps explain the divide between Flanders and Wallonia.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/may/09/belgium-flanders-wallonia-french-dutch
This article explains “Why Belgium?”
Basically, Belgium has a very poor anti-terrorism policing and surveillance system. The lack of EU borders makes all the other EU countries as vulnerable as the weakest link.
Since this board is about college and higher education, all I can say is, the more educated people we have the better. Seriously. If we are the light that guides the world, we really should be smarter. We can’t afford to let America go down the tubes.
At least one now-defunct government built a large scale system of gathering intelligence on population to catch any people who were doing things that could be seen as dangerous (to the government, at least). Is that what you want the US and other governments to emulate today?
http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/east-german-domestic-surveillance-went-far-beyond-the-stasi-a-1042883.html
Bingo.
STASI, STASI…STASI, STASI, STASI!!! I pray that day never comes.
And the alternative is what exactly? Give everyone (including the bad guys) 100% privacy?
And the terrorists are going to just magically leave us alone?? Come on guys, use your brains… there is a compromise that needs to take place here. No one is suggesting this turn into Orwell’s 1984, but in order for a government to do its job of protecting its citizens, some privacy has to be sacrificed for the collective good.
At some point we have to come to terms with reality that there are really bad guys out there who will never coexist peacefully with our culture.
Good grief! The Stasi gathered information on political enemies in order to protect those in power. The police need to collect information on criminals, real criminals in order to protect the citizenry from being killed and maimed. Anyone harboring a terrorist is a criminal. People who do not come forward with information in order to catch those who kill and maim are morally reprehensible!
Apparently the cab driver who drove these killers to the airport came forward immediately and gave the police a lot of good information. I don’t know if he was Muslim, Christian or Jew, but he was a true patriot.