Facts about different ethnicities !!!

[Newjack88]

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That is true but you are ignoring the fact that taking a higher level math course will put you at an advantage.

It will in that you’ve had more experience, but not in that it gives you more knowledge for the SAT.

Ok… so you are basically agreeing with me that taking higher level math classes does give you an advantage on the SAT since if one is taking these higher level classes “[one has] had more experience."</p>

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You seem to be implying that schools like Berkeley, UCLA, Michigan, UVA, UNC, etc. are not “top institutions.”

No… just no…</p>

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So you’re saying that, say, Duke is better than Chicago because its graduation rate is higher? (I only point out these two because the difference in graduation rate is incremental – as it is between top privates and top publics.)

Again, no… just no… you are completely misunderstanding my argument. First of all I said “some.” Second, it is a fact that the better the institution the better the graduation rate. Perhaps I do not understand your point…? Duke and Chicago are both good schools and both have good graduation rates? The only way your argument could make sense is if you are implying that one of the two is not a good school… which is absurd.</p>

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I think the idea is that the poor person did as well as the rich person, despite severe adversity, so the former should get a boost. Makes sense to me.

Yes, that does make sense but I was talking about how people often complain that wealthy URMs benefit unjustly from AA.</p>

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No, I don’t think I am. I see the “ethnically diverse class” as a PR tactic; I see the “culturally diverse class” or “socioeconomically diverse class” as truly worthwhile. The latter engenders the former.

Well I am sorry you see it that way. And, yes, you do have trouble understanding what a diverse class is. A diverse class is one that contains many views and opinions. Since people obtain their views and opinions from their life experiences, which is affect by their socio-economic background, ethnicity, and culture, it makes sense that colleges consider race to create a class with many different views and opinions.</p>

<p>So that you can better understand what I am saying here is a flow chart:

Ethnicity/Class/Culture -> Life Experiences -> Worldview

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What are these new ideas you speak of? Is a middle-class Mexican going to have a drastically different viewpoint on Kant than a middle-class white person? Pray tell what significant addition is made to a classroom by having different ethnicities.

Refer to the flow chart and it will make sense. People with different life experiences from yours can help to see new ways of looking at the world. But, you know what, I guess you’re right… why should anyone ever try to see the world from someone else’s perspective…</p>

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Anecdotal evidence, again, doesn’t prove much.

It makes me more qualified to speak on this matter though and proves a lot more than you have.</p>

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And frankly, many of the URMs admitted to Stanford (not to mention most colleges) are not as socioeconomically disadvantaged as some might think

That is true. Some are not though. Anyways, one thing is common to all of them; regardless of their class, they were all discriminated against in similar ways.</p>

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Er, I can see it. Not to mention students acknowledge that cliques form. Cliques form at schools. Cliques form at colleges. Cliques form at jobs. It’s inevitable.

Again, the word “clique” probably is not the best word to use here since it implies that strict social boundaries form that prevent students from associating with whomever they wish. I think that what you are talking about is how people form groups of friends that they hang out with on a regular basis. These friends usually have similar or compatible worldviews. Since your worldview is a product of your life experiences (see flow chart), it makes sense that you would hang out with people of the same ethnicity. I do not think this is good or bad. It’s life. And, again, you are missing the point of a diverse class. No one says that everyone has to be close friends with each other and hang out on a regular basis. </p>

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I really doubt that it can be deemed “severely,” though this is delving a bit too far into the efficacy of equality laws, far beyond the scope of this discussion.

I have no idea what you are talking about. Stereotypes are a social issue not a legal issue. And yes it can be deemed “severely.” Most people think that simply having money can put URMs on a fair playing field when that is not the case. It puts them ahead of their poor fellow URMs, but they are still much farther behind than Whites, Asians, and pretty much everyone else except for Latinos who have it equally just as bad. (Most people are reluctant to admit this but it is true.)</p>

<p>I would say that the most dangerous stereotype that Africans/African-Americans and Latinos face is that they are not supposed to do well in academics because this stereotype hurts the self-esteem of many minority students. Not too long ago women faced the stereotype the same stereotype and as a result many women failed to be successful academically. Now that that stereotype has almost completely faded we now see that women are excelling in academics and are even doing better than men academically.</p>