BTW, @gallentjill, I could see people paying to get unqualified kids in to Columbia. Lots of social/media/international cachet even if a tough curriculum (but tons of support so hard to fail out). And the school doesn’t care about sports yet gives coaches admit slots like all the Ivies
A better example would be Swarthmore.
It’s kinda hard to believe that hypothetical son would not get in ED.
@Groundwork2022 USC fired the water polo coach and the AD. Not on leave.
Good point by @bluebayou about the son with perfect stats. He should at least stand a decent chance in ED.
I believe that the outrage is more due to the fact that people were clearly cheating in so many facets of the admissions process: cheating on the SATs, faking RA status, etc. Their kids were not academically or athletically qualified for these universities, so they sought out means to cheat the system. I hope that the College Board sues everyone involved in the SAT cheating allegations for the damages that it will take to its reputation and the value of its products.
I’m okay with the various hooks that are out there because my assumption is that the students are earning the test scores and grades that are going onto the application. A celebrity scion, legacy or URM may have a slight advantage over an unhooked student, but I’m relatively confident that they are academically competitive as well (or at least I was confident). I would even argue that RAs with slightly lower academic credentials merit acceptance based on the level of effort, teamwork, leadership, and discipline that is generally required to excel at that level.
@PurpleTitan It was just a hypothetical example, using a school with a reputation for no grade inflation and a tough core curriculum. I’m all on board with the idea that kids shouldn’t focus solely on one school. I’m only saying that as a parent, I can understand the temptation to do something to tip the scale for a child I knew was qualified but who would probably not get in just because of the harsh mathematics of admissions.
I’m not proud of it, but I remember having moments of wondering what it would feel like to be able to guarantee that my daughter could get the part in the school play she dreamed of. Of course, I would never do something like that, but am I really the only parent who ever thought how nice it would be to be able to rub a magic lamp and just “give” our kids their heart’s desire? Again, I’m not advocating for it and I’m not trying to justify what these people did. Part of being a good person is resisting evil urges.
Yes, @MWolf, the IL governor use to have a number of admit slots to UIUC that he could give to whomever. Still, unless the governor could designate the major, that’s pretty sad. UIUC accepts over half of all applicants. I’m not sure a kid who would otherwise be rejected by UIUC would do better going there than some directional instead.
@3puppies But an investigation such as you suggest might take just long enough for the students involved to graduate, from USC or wherever. That’s too long.
If I rob a bank and give my kid the $$, and my kid didn’t know I robbed a bank, should the kid still have to give the $$ back after I’m arrested? You bet. But…he was innocent! So what?
However…I’m betting that in almost all of these cases, the kids knew something was up. They know if they aren’t doing as well in algebra as their classmates. They know whether they play water polo.
Thanks for clarifying that Felicity was not involved in the bribery scandal. I also see now from the Affidavit why her spouse William Macy is not being charged, since they participated in the test-taking scandal only with their older daughter and not ultimately with their younger one. The Feds have a telephone recording of both parents only regarding the younger daughter.
@psycholing I agree with everything you said except: “There is actually no indication in the complaint that extra time was used as an accommodation inappropriately.” The USA Today article indicated that part of the scheme was for the kids to “play stupid” for the school psychologist (or whoever does the evaluation) so that they would get the private room accommodation. I think this is actually proof that the students that did so knew exactly what their parents were up to.
@girl19 not just in private schools but in public schools as well. It seems there is an epidemic of ADHD diagnoses requiring students to get extra time for school exams and ACT/SAT
@gallentjill: “I’m not proud of it, but I remember having moments of wondering what it would feel like to be able to guarantee that my daughter could get the part in the school play she dreamed of”
“am I really the only parent who ever thought how nice it would be to be able to rub a magic lamp and just “give” our kids their heart’s desire?”
Hmm. You know, mine are small, but when they want candy, I don’t think how nice it would be if I could give them all the candy in the world. Maybe it’s because I’m a dad, they’re sons, and we’re minorities (and my parents were low SES immigrants), but I don’t feel any urge to spoil them. I want them to grow up to be decent people but also to fight both for what’s right and to reach their goals. Because they’ll have to. Nobody else in the world (besides their mother and grandparenrs, none of whom can support them forever) will be willing to spoil them either.
@aurora2016 I’m with you! I did know that kid and for me it was back in the 80s!
@showmom858 - I asked that in #414 - and someone else probably asked it before me
@PurpleTitan Maybe I am the only one with the evil urges. But it also may have to do with age. I never really felt bad about the candy either. 
@shortnuke Perhaps I used poor phrasing. What I was trying to say is the charade wasn’t about the extra time. It was about the private room. I was not trying to indicate that students were not colluding.
At UIUC, students entering undeclared will find that a large percentage of majors are selective based on college grades and sometimes competitive admission: https://dgs.illinois.edu/declaring-your-major
@airway1 you miss the point which is that a SAT of 1100 (and a GPA of 78) for an athlete is a spot taken from an academically qualified student. That’s Duke for you
I keep trying (unsuccessfully!) to a catch up on this thread so please excuse me if this point has already been made.
The final page of the Common App requires students to sign a statement beginning with:
In other words, the student is required to review the application for accuracy just before submission. I know this was the last thing my kids did before hitting the button. There’s no way I could have slipped in a line in the extracurriculars section listing my kid as a varsity athlete in a sport they didn’t pay without them noticing. I feel sorry for kids who worked 4 years for a degree just to see it stripped away, but if their applications were falsified I don’t see how the universities in question can do anything but revoke their degrees.
Stop this extra time nonsense and if it’s a valid reason then get a certificate from a school and make school sign “no cheating involved” certificate punishable by law and see how many fake kids gets dropped out… this accommodation is rediculous