Tom Hanks son the drug addict/rapper? Uhm, okay.
Basically I believe Earl is saying the financial advantages you may bring to the group are worth consideration.
I am suggesting random lottery to keep from having to make those sorts of decisions.
And so legacies are not disappointed.
And the shy ones aren’t disadvantaged.
and so on…
ETA: We had the daughters of powerful politicians in our sorority. All things being equal, we were absolutely going to offer those girls bids. Over time, if your bids are successful, this changes a group.
ETA: the scenario is not using someone you don’t like for their jet. It is about all else being equal - do you advantage someone with a jet, etc.? The question for me becomes how we avoid doing that. Because it is pretty much human nature. imho
@alh understands what I am talking about. For what it’s worth, I doubt anyone knew this kid’s father had a jet, or that they would be watching football games from his family’s suite when they gave him a bid. The jet rides were just a bonus. If two people are about to be cut and somebody pipes up that the prospective member is the type of guy who is likely to pay his bill in full at the start of the semester, then someone might withdraw their ding.
I find it odd that @Pizzagirl and others would have the opinion that if two people were exactly the same in all respects, but they could only give a bid to one of them, that they would flip a coin rather than extend a bid to the person who would be more likely to benefit the current members of the chapter or the chapter as a whole.
Also, if a rushee is from in-state or an area where the Greek organization has members, everyone is going to know whether they have a jet or not. Everyone knows who is or is not wealthy in their hometown; there is no need for the rushee to announce the fact.
I was alumni adviser for my chapter a few years after I graduated. One kid who came through rush was the son of the man who had colonized our chapter 30 years before. He had also been a major donor to the chapter over the years. The son had flunked out of two schools before arriving at ours. Were it not for his “connection,” he would not have gotten a bid because of his grade history. Well, of course he got a bid, and at the father’s request I met with this kid at least once a week to counsel and encourage him. I enlisted the aid of the members to make sure he went to class. He made his grades and graduated. My behavior was based on past services for the chapter, but the fact is that those who have helped or are likely to help a chapter are more likely to get favors.
As I mentioned in my earlier post, wealth is way, way down on the list of qualities that most chapters look for. But again, all other things being equal, it is better to be rich than to be poor throughout life, no matter what the circumstance.
What if rich in life isn’t about money?
“Also, if a rushee is from in-state or an area where the Greek organization has members, everyone is going to know whether they have a jet or not. Everyone knows who is or is not wealthy in their hometown; there is no need for the rushee to announce the fact.”
Well, Earl, that’s the difference between regional schools and ones with a national draw. Big world out there.
I am the one proposing random lottery selection. I don’t believe I have convinced PG yet, but am sort of hoping your posts will. 
“I enlisted the aid of the members to make sure he went to class. He made his grades and graduated. My behavior was based on past services for the chapter, but the fact is that those who have helped or are likely to help a chapter are more likely to get favors.”
Another difference in systems - schools with high academic standards in which of course it’s assumed that you will study and go to class, versus schools in which apparently going to class isn’t the purpose of being there.
Our systems are completely different. Worlds apart.
Different chapters. Same system. Same world. Same whole. Your sisters.
The differences are really pretty subtle, a matter of degree more than anything else. imho
If I were to move to a different city, I might look into joining an alum group as it might be a way to meet new friends, but no, I don’t feel “sisterhood” except in a very superficial way to girls on some campus I’ve never been to who may have very different values and beliefs. I wouldn’t feel “sisterhood” if I knew they hazed, or were known for being the college sluts, or didn’t admit girls of a certain race or religion or whatever.
Chapters differ so markedly from campus to campus. The “nice girls you take home to mother” at one place may be the town drunks at the next. Or more benignly, the artsy house here may be the jock house elsewhere.
Almost all of our houses are single-letter chapters. They had rich history and tradition. That doesn’t mean that their counterparts elsewhere are anything like them, and houses change over time anyway. House strengths can be regional. One of the weakest houses at NU is apparently super strong in the South. I’m sure vice versa as well.
Okay PG. That post makes me think we are way too far apart in our views here to find common ground. It isn’t clear to me anyone else is still interested in the discussion.
“… that they would flip a coin rather than extend a bid to the person who would be more likely to benefit the current members of the chapter or the chapter as a whole.”
The “benefit” that any potential new member brings to the chapter is her friendship and companionship, EarlVanDorn.
Assuming she pays her dues on time, how much or how little money her family has is none of my concern. Her family’s money is not there for my personal benefit or the chapter’s benefit. I am not asking her to join because I think I can get free ski vacations or private jet rides out of it. And I am not asking her to join because I hope one day her daddy will give me a job, either. I am asking her to join because I like her. It’s as simple as that.
And anyway, I don’t even know what you mean by “benefitting the chapter with parents’ money.” The House Corp runs the finances of the house. Individual parents don’t contribute anything other than their kids’ dues.
Alh - I could google my house on different campuses.
On some they will be “nice girls you take home to mother” and are portrayed doing philanthropic events.
Or I could find some chapters where they are all posing in string bikinis with navel rings and one gets the sense they exist just for men’s ogling enjoyment and maybe every now and then a book is picked up, if only to shield your eyes from the sun. And these are often at schools that aren’t exactly known for studiousness in the first place.
Why would I feel much “sisterhood” towards the latter?
@Pizzagirl, Someone with money is going to be far more likely to be able to pay their dues. And they are far less likely to drop out for financial reasons. This is a benefit to the chapter.
That’s why I said assuming they pay their dues.
I think it’s mercenary to meet someone and think - oh goody, his/her family has money, maybe I can get a private jet ride/Caribbean vacation/whatever out of it.
And when you’re in a place with a national draw, you simply aren’t going to know what money anybody has, unless they are a celebrity kid.
And even if you do know / suspect, it’s more than a little gauche to count it or count on it.
At the risk of sounding crass, I understand where @EarlVanDorn is coming from, and I believe it’s way more pertinent to fraternities and to the south or “glam” cities like LA or Miami.
At my son’s smaller southern school, rush is deferred, and they have a whole semester to get to know about rushees (as I believe they are still called in the frat world). You can bet they know whose dad has a jet and whose dad is CEO of a Fortune 100 or coaches a top 25 football team.
Remember these are 18-21 year boys making these decisions, my son included, often without the aid of an alum like sororities. They would not bid someone they don’t like because his dad has a jet, but all things being equal, that stuff is attractive to these kids. (The only jet we have is made of Legos, by the way.) And @Pizzagirl absolutely some parents at this school pay for entire chapter or frat rush events or frat weekends at their ski homes.
At my northern son’s very large school, he barely knows where his friends are from, much less what their parents do. Madonna’s daughter caused a stir, but that’s about it.
@alh As great as this conversation has been, I respectfully couldn’t ever support a lottery. I admire your thinking, but I believe in the right of each organization to choose their members. It best mirrors life (employment, relationships, etc) and I also don’t think it solves the hierarchy problem long term.
Right, that’s why I am saying - different systems. It plays a different social role in the south than it does in the north.
My S could tell you where his brothers are from, but what their fathers do? Who knows, unless there was a specific reason for it to come up in conversation?
Social networking puts a lot of information out there in ways that the parent of a college kid did not experience at all.
@Pizzagirl, I agree it is crass to meet someone and immediately suck up to them in hopes of getting a free luxury vacation. And that’s not really what happens. As I mentioned, in the example I gave, I doubt the members knew the guy was really wealthy at the time he was extended a bid. But it is an example of the benefits of having wealthy members in a chapter.
Assuming two absolutely equal candidates for membership, it is better to take the one for whom the members dues will be inconsequential. Many people never really become all that active in their chapters. A rich student will pay fraternity dues even if they aren’t eating all the meals or “getting their money’s worth.” A less affluent student is more likely to decide the fraternity or sorority isn’t worth it and drop out, using the money for other needs.
I would point out that there are studies where sociologists have taken a luxury car and an old beater and just sat in the left turn lane after light turns green with a stopwatch. The old beater car gets honked at far more quickly than the luxury car. People recognize and respond deferentially to wealth without even being aware of it. A lot of rich kids are goobers, and I’ve seen plenty of them get cut. But no matter what, money never hurts unless you are applying for food stamps.
I actually belonged to more of a middle-class fraternity, but there are some really rich kids in almost every chapter. There were chapters on my campus where a few of the members would just take a commercial flight down to Jamaica or Cancun for the weekend; I’m not talking Spring Break, either. Certainly during the rush process these guys would seek out new members who might be able to join them, and there’s nothing wrong with that.
I know new students are stalked on FB even before they show up on campus. If they are of interest then further “looking into” is performed. Sisters are assigned X number of new students to look into and give feedback. Just in case people are not aware of this…when you google someone, you can see “possible relations,” where you would see their parents and siblings’ names. It wouldn’t be hard to figure out someone’s family background. If a sorority interested in recruiting rich and famous, it is not too hard to figure out who those new recruits are.
People like to think students do not talk about what their parents do, but they do. I know what most of my kid’s friends parents do. Maybe I am nosier than PG…My girls like to gossip with me, especially D1. I probably know more about D1’s boss than most of his friends.
The most striking example of this at some campuses is that the fraternities and sororities appear to be highly racially segregated, based on their photo albums (the fraternities often slightly less so than the sororities, though). At some other campuses, there are chapters that are not highly racially segregated, but there are other chapters that are.