“Schools should cost the same for everyone, not one price if you (or your parents) earn $30,000 per year and triple that price if the income is $100k”
We use an ability to pay system. We also treat education partially as a social good.
There are many products or services where two customers pay different prices based on some criteria. Hotels. Airlines. Cars. Healthcare. Education. Sports Tickets.
He and his wife were pulling down an income of $300k…not exactly chump change!
Just making sure…we are talking about a governor and a judge?
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" In Baltimore, almost all Catholic children go to Catholic schools, and I’d bet all white Catholic children do.
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I didn’t realize that went on in Baltimore. I know that it kind of does in NOLA. After Katrina hit NOLA and so many schools were destroyed, the media talked about what a large % of the kids were in Catholic schools and whether it was appropriate for relief dollars to go towards rebuilding those schools. (and the Catholic schools in neighboring states all absorbed these kids at no charge during their rebuild. My kids’ school was one and suddenly there were new students and everyone donated uniforms for the kids to wear.)
“Last I knew anyone could choose to go work in the public sector and get a guaranteed pension. It bothers me that people whine about it. No one forces them to go work somewhere which doesn’t have a pension plan.”
Absolutely. It is a free country.
But it bothers me when those that choose to work in the public sector whine about being underpaid. Data suggests they are paid as much or more, on a pound for pound basis, than private sector employees. When the full compensation (i.e. pension and other benefits) is accounted for. Don’t whine about the low salary and then be annoyed when people call you on your way above market guaranteed pension.
“Public service” is a well compensated profession. The Georgetown buying O’Malleys prove the point.
“Decades back when lots of people went to work for the private sector, their employer promised a pension. Now many of these same people after 30 years of service are finding that their employers are reneging. Unlike the public sector, the private sector can’t just arbitrarily raise revenue (i.e. raise taxes) to fund the pensions.”
Yes, so? 401K were sold by Wall Street and business to the unsophisticated employee as a great thing because they would have control over their own retirement! Hooray!!! And the kind employer will even give you some more money to invest. People loved the idea. They thought it was the greatest thing since sliced bread.
The same argument that is made in regards to privatizing SS. Wouldn’t Wall Street love to get their hands on all that money and the fees that would generate!!
“I actually don’t think there should be levels at all. If the government is going to give subsidized loans, everyone should get them.”
I doubt the O’Malleys were eligible for subsidized loans. Most likely he took unsubsidized Parent Plus loans. If you think everyone should be eligible for subsidized loans - why are you upset that O’Malley took out unsubsidized loans (which have a higher interest rate and which they gov’t makes more money on then subsidized loans.)
Also, who do you think is less likely to default on a student loan? Someone who has an income of $200K+ a year like the O’Malley’s or someone who has an income of day, $75K?
“Grants should be given to schools to reduce tuition for all, not pell just to some. I don’t like the ‘she gets the benefit and you don’t’ games that are played.”
So taxpayer money should go directly to private colleges so they can reduce their tuition for everyone? Do you have any idea how much that would cost?
“Why is it fair to charge two students different prices for the same product?”
What dstark said.
“Northwesty, what is the present value of that $3 million? $100,000 payments per year for 30 years is not worth $3 million.”
Sure you can NPV that. But also recognize that Marty will get more than $3 million. He gets 50% of THE THEN gov’s salary, not his gov’s salary. The current gov gets $180k so Marty gets $90k. When the current gov gets $300k, Marty will get $150k a year. And so on.
The reason that the public sector has held onto the pensions eliminated by the private sector is because they are a great way to obfuscate the actual level of compensation being paid to the public sector workers.
Marty got paid a $150k salary when he was gov. Doesn’t sound like much. But his actual comp is perhaps double that (or more) when you account for his pension. He ain’t underpaid by any measure.
It’s not either, or.
Many employers, public & private, offer a pension and a 401k. For many older private sector workers who were offered both, thank god they at least have the 401k, because that’s all they’re getting after their employer reneged.
"Don’t whine about the low salary and then be annoyed when people call you on your way above market guaranteed pension.
“Public service” is a well compensated profession. The Georgetown buying O’Malleys prove the point."
Most public servants aren’t paid anything close to what a Governor of a state and a Judge earn.
Yes, benefits are great in most of the public sector. It is how they can keep good people from leaving and going into the private sector.
I’m thrilled H is going to retire with a great pension and practically free medical insurance and I don’t have to worry about the stock market crashing.
State public pensions are not pay-as-you-go. The pensions are paid from a pension fund that is usually invested in publicly traded securities.
“Many employers, public & private, offer a pension and a 401k.”
I’m confused. First you say ^this then you say, " For many older private sector workers who were offered both, thank god they at least have the 401k, because that’s all they’re getting after their employer reneged.
Publics offer 403B not 401K and they don’t match.
While correct, I think you’re being a little nit-picky here. 403(b) and 401(k) plans are virtually identical. Also, the public employers you’re familiar with may not offer matching on 403(b) contributions, but I know of several public employers in California that do.
@emilybee
Maybe your husband was in a state that didn’t offer its public workers 401ks, but other states do.
https://www.marylanddc.com/iApp/tcm/marylanddc/about/plan_options_401k.jsp
I know for a fact that my father (a public worker) retired w a 401k from his state employer.
As a long-time citizen of the state of Maryland, this doesn’t surprise me a bit.
Interesting. I did not know tax exempt organization could offer 401K.
Yes, I know they are virtually the same. Do states which offer 401K’s match?
“State public pensions are not pay-as-you-go. The pensions are paid from a pension fund that is usually invested in publicly traded securities.”
Yes, I know that. However, the last big crash didn’t change people’s pensions at all. All they did was change the rule slightly for new employees. I’m not worried at all - I don’t expect NYS to go bankrupt anytime soon.
There are a lot of variables here. He doesn’t get his pension for a decade after he was governor? Are there survivor benefits? What happens if he dies before he receives the pension? Does his pension increase after he starts receiving it? His pension may be worth a fraction of that $150,000 salary.
You should recheck private vs public pay packages. Those without college educations do better in the public sector.
Those with college educations make about the same in both sectors.
Those with advanced degrees…which includes lawyers, make more money in the private sector.
Federal employees at most agencies have a pension (FRS) and a 401k plan with a match (usually 5%, sometimes more). Public employers can have pensions that fail. Riverside and Stockton California have both failed, as well as a teacher’s pension fund in RI. Many more will fail soon because the pension funds are unfunded. Promise away, but you need to fund the pension fund.
In California after 9/11, many police and firefighter pensions went to 50/30/90 plans, so if you are 50 years old and have worked 30 years, you retire at 90% of pay. It is not sustainable. Many municipalities are now basically paying two payrolls, those on duty, those retired. Not sustainable.
and don’t forget, the Gov gets free housing in the Governor’s Mansion. So, lemme see, he and his wife are each making $150k ($300k total) and they have a housing costs covered. Yeah, sounds like someone who is struggling to me. 
I think it is unfortunate that O’Malley decided to include information about his own family’s education debt for a private U and an OOS U when announcing his proposal for debt-free graduation for students at their own home-state public Us. This confuses two separate issues. The important issue here is whether or not it is a good thing to provide stronger financial support for public Us. How the O’Malley family chose to cover the costs of their kid’s dream schools is up to the O’Malleys.
Only read the first page of the thread, but surely someone has mentioned they may have taken out the loans as a strategic move, not necessarily out of necessity?