“Yes, IE will have lots of math and statistics-calculus, differential equations, etc.”
I have a Masters in IE and never had to take differential equations. There is lots of statistics and linear programming using linear algebra, though.
Georgia Tech does seem to have a pretty impressive IE program these days.
@simba9 ,“never had to take differential equations.” Maybe that is school dependent? My son had to take it at VT and I just looked at the undergraduate checklist on the ISE website and it is still a requirement to take differential equations to get a B.S. in Industrial and Systems Engineering there…
Chardo, Your son sounds like a great kid and very focused. He already has a lot of math and engineering under his belt, which is great. From what you are describing , it does sound like he would thrive at Georgia Tech in engineering (if he also likes the school in general). But, it is your money and nobody here is going to be able to tell you how to spend it. Is there an accredited IE program in your state that would be cheaper that could be considered? Good luck.
Could be. IE has a lot of specializations, so I can see how some of those would require something like differential equations. My degree was basically a vanilla IE degree.
The checklist is for the ISE degree in general. It is taken the second semester of sophomore year, before kids take more of the specialized courses. Maybe other schools just don’t require it. I don’t know.
When you say that your son is interested in “business,” why are you focused on Operations Management versus Finance or Economics? Without knocking an IE degree in the least, if your son’s interest is in business, then Alabama has very strong programs in the mathematically-oriented specializations of Quantitative Finance and Quantitative Economics. Engineering degrees are often considered “pre-professional,” gearing students for one particular field. Finance and Economics provide a much broader basis for business and are increasingly in need of students with strong mathematical skills given the increasing use of data in those fields. The head of Culverhouse, Dean Michael Hardin, is well-known in the field of big data and Culverhouse recently received a $1 million grant from Lockheed Martin to further research at UA.
Not knocking an IE degree at all, just depends on which side of “business” he wants to enter post-graduation. I just wouldn’t rule out Culverhouse simply due to a bias that business degrees don’t have enough Math. UA provides tremendous flexibility to take additional Math classes or even double major due to its acceptance of college and AP credit.
Have you visited both schools yet? Very different campus feels and vibe if that makes a difference.
http://courseleaf.ua.edu/commercebusinessadministration/#courseinventory lists Alabama’s business school courses, including economics and finance. They do not look very quantitative, in that it does not appear that there are any that require any math higher than calculus 1 for business majors (MATH 121).
@ucbalumnus - I think you missed this in the link you sent (it is under “Specializations”) on the Alabama website.
Quantitative Economics - Requirements for this Specialization
Students must major in Economics and take the following courses:
MATH 125 Calculus I
& MATH 126 Calculus II
& MATH 227 Calculus III
& MATH 237 Introduction to Linear Algebra
EC 413 Economic Forecasting & Analysis
EC 470 Intro To Mathematical Economics
EC 471 Econometrics
ST 454 or Mathematical Statistics I
MATH 355 Theory Of Probability
ST 455 or Mathematical Statistics II
MATH 451 Math Stats W/Application I
Total Hours 30
Yes, but those are just added math and statistics courses, rather than business and economics courses which use a higher math content (the EC courses listed above only require MATH 121). Economics departments with a greater quantitative emphasis offer economics course work that uses math more advanced than calculus 1.
@ucbalumus
Econometrics requires completion of Calculus II
EC 471 Econometrics. 3 hours
Prerequisite: ST 260 and MATH 126, or equivalents
No question that Quantitative Economics is not as mathematically intense as Engineering, if that is the point you are trying to make. But Alabama provides students with the flexibility to take many upper level Math classes alongside the curriculum, should they so desire. The courses listed above are just the minimum requirements for the Economics major. Students who take higher level math courses in addition to the basic curriculum will be better prepared for graduate school and probably more attractive to employers as well.
Yes it is based on major and price. He was also offered a big scholarship from Tulane, but has ruled them out because they don’t offer what he wants. He was also admitted to Ohio State for IE, with a large scholarship. Waiting to see if he is selected for their elite Integrated Business and Engineering program. Without that, I think he would choose GT over OSU.
There are no cost constraints. We can afford any school he chooses, but he does understand the concept of value.
There are surprisingly few IE programs around the country, though our state schools (Binghamton and Buffalo) do offer it. He has no interest in those schools. Even if cost were a factor, he would pay less at OSU with the scholarships he got.
Because his main interest is engineering, with a business twist, and OM seems like the most engineering-like business major. He doesn’t want finance or econ as a major. Frankly if he’s smart enough for engineering, and likes it, I think it’s a better major than finance or econ. Anyone can do those.
It seems that industrial engineering has myriad applications and career opportunities in every industry.
Have visited both multiple times. Would be happy at either. He’s an unusual kid, varsity athlete and president of engineering club, A-list socially but also friends with the geeks.
@Chardo “It seems that industrial engineering has myriad applications and career opportunities in every industry.” That is what seems to be good about IE and Systems Engineering- broad applications and flexibility. Both of my kids are industrial/Systems graduates and have had good opportunities and are enjoying their careers so far. My sons sound like your son- both varsity athletes with athletic honors and had athletic interest from coaches and colleges but chose not to pursue it , lots of friends and also “A-list socially” -their best friends in high school were not science or engineering oriented but they also relate to “geeks.” I think there are more kids in engineering out there than people realize that are not the stereotypical “geek.” . Sometimes I wonder if all the stereotyping keeps some kids from pursuing engineering. Your son does sound like more of an engineering student than business student and sounds like he would not have a problem with an engineering curriculum. IE/Systems Engineering should give him opportunities to pursue his business interests and many consulting firms like IE/Systems graduates . The IE program at Ohio State sounds interesting. IE is a good fit for kids with an interest in engineering, good social skills, leadership, , as well as business interests. OM sounds like a good program as well. Good luck with the decision.
OM is not engineering with an “business twist.” IE is engineering with a business twist. And you clearly have a bias toward engineering, so it sounds like you were just fishing to be told you were right to pick GT. But I sure hope your son doesn’t let your bias that anyone can do finance or economics color his interviews with future employers. Yikes.
http://courseleaf.ua.edu/commercebusinessadministration/#courseinventory says:
MATH 121 is calculus and applications for business majors, and MATH 125 is calculus 1.
Actually, quantitative economics can be more mathematically intensive than engineering, but it does not appear to be that way at Alabama.
Looks like Tulane does not have industrial engineering either.
So if he wants to study industrial engineering, or at least have the option to do so, the choices are Georgia Tech and Ohio State (or any other school you did not mention that has industrial engineering).
It looks like Alabama’s business school is a poor academic fit for him.
Based on previous comments, the prices are:
Georgia Tech (list price out-of-state): $44,052
Ohio State (with scholarship): under about $24,000 (since it is said to be lower than SUNYs in-state)
Alabama (with scholarship): $15,356
If you can afford any of the above, it seems that the real decision should be one between Georgia Tech and Ohio State, both of which have the student’s intended major, but with Ohio State $20,000 or more per year less expensive. Alabama may be less expensive than Ohio State, but for a family that can afford Georgia Tech at out-of-state list price, giving up the student’s intended major for a poor fit major at Alabama seems to be a poor bargain for the incremental savings of $8,644 or less per year.
@albclemom , the point of my original question is to see if OM is a viable alternative. I have no bias against finance degrees, I have one myself. I was a rather ordinary student in high school, and I aced finance in college. I could not even touch engineering. Doesn’t take an exceptional student to study finance, but it’s pretty much required for engineering.
@Chardo , OSU seems to be doing well in placing Industrial and Systems engineering graduates. You may have already seen this info but here is a link from Engineering Career Services just in case (includes annual report, average salaries, career employment percentages, top employers,etc). Industrial had the highest placement success last year of any of the engineering departments with an 87% placement rate (and 9% seeking employment,2 % going for further education and 2 % with other plans). $60,472 average starting salary. Many industrial and systems engineers also get nice signing bonuses as well. but I didn’t see where they note the average bonus for that., but may have missed it. https://ecs.osu.edu/ Most of the info is under the “statistics” heading. Hope your son hears his status regarding an acceptance to their Integrated Business and Engineering program soon so you will know where you stand with OSU (although great he is already accepted into engineering there) in relation to the opportunities and cost at Georgia Tech.