<p>We can talk abut this one, too: There’s four dogs in the street.</p>
<p>It doesn’t matter what slang or colloquialisms you can “get away with.” It doesn’t matter how you relate to, say, ^ shop clerks. Learn the rules and use them, as appropriate, choose when not to obsess. But, don’t decide based on what mistakes “the locals” make. Ok?</p>
<p>Another way to look at it younghoss,
“Me and my friends went boozing” is NOT correct grammar.<br>
(because you wouldn’t say “Me went boozing” (unless, of course it is immediately after you, in fact, actually WENT boozing!)</p>
<p>Also NOT correct: “Younghoss went boozing with my friends and I” (for the same reason, you wouldn’t say “Younghoss went boozing with I.”)</p>
<p>CORRECT
“I and my friends went boozing” or
“My friends and I went boozing” or
“Younghoss went boozing with me and my friends” or
“Younghoss went boozing with my friends and me.” </p>
<p>The “putting yourself before others” suggestion is out there and it does sound better/nicer(?) usually to put yourself last. Grammatically, though, I vs. ME rules are just like all they^^^ said :D</p>
<p>Deborah, unless the offending speaker is my child or my student, I’m not correcting anybody. But I would notice that their grammar was incorrect. Not a crime to be incorrect, but it’s still incorrect. We all have choices when we speak, but grammar isn’t a matter of choice. It’s right or it’s wrong.</p>
<p>I’ve learned to use the I and me correctly, but I’m absolutely certain that when I do, lots of people think I’m incorrect.</p>
<p>If I talked like the locals, I’d be saying “I seen” and “he done” and “they was”. I am not going to do it. I really think it’s a disgrace how they do not teach grammar in school anymore. Not sure they could if they wanted…most of the 20-30 year old teachers did not learn grammar and it certainly shows in the communication they send home.</p>
<p>This thread is very encouraging! I was just lamenting to my family this week about the way someone incorrectly used I instead of me. This is one of my biggest pet peeves, along with the way people screw up plurals and possessives. </p>
<p>I learned the same way, to take one of the people out of the sentence and then say it. Agree that to most people it does sound wrong to say ‘me’, but that is because everyone is so used to people mangling the English language!</p>
<p>“I seen” is probably my biggest grammar pet peeve in the world. It grates on my ears like no other. </p>
<p>It is me, but I wouldn’t correct someone other than close family or someone I’m tutoring.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>tptshorty you’re clearly a better person than I. When I hear my son saying “me and my friends are doing this…” I can’t help myself, I have to speak up with what I’m thinking: I’m spending a fortune on sending you to college, please say “my friends and I are…”</p>
<p>When I hear others use “me” incorrectly, I judge as well, but silently.</p>
<p>A local radio station has an ad where the speaker says “Like good music? Us too!” Every time I hear that I turn the station, it’s like nails on a chalkboard to me.</p>
<p>Going off to take a chill pill ;)</p>
<p>
Actually that’s not quite true. Languages evolve and sometimes what is not acceptable at one time will become acceptable. Or what is acceptable in England won’t be acceptable in the US.</p>
<p>The question of whether to say “than them” or “than they (do)” is one I’ve seen argued by grammar experts. I think the if you leave off the verb, it sounds better to use “them”, but make no claim that it’s the more correct thing to do.</p>
<p>If you have grammar questions, this is a nice site to go to: [Grammarphobia:</a> Grammar, etymology, linguistics, usage, and more](<a href=“http://www.grammarphobia.com/]Grammarphobia:”>http://www.grammarphobia.com/) Patricia T. O’Connor appears regularly on WNYC’s Leonard Lopate show and is always fun to listen to.</p>
<p>I correct my kid every time he starts a sentence “Me and my friends…”</p>
<p>Maybe it’s a regional thing, but I’m hearing more and more people misuse the verb ‘graduate’. Incorrect: “He graduated high school.” Correct: “He graduated from high school.” I sincerely hope this isn’t an example of language evolving! </p>
<p>I learned those basic grammar rules from my mother who taught English for many years, so ‘evolving’ language doesn’t really work for me~</p>
<p>Beil, what do you mean “evolving language doesn’t really work for me”? Language is CONSTANTLY evolving. That’s a fact. There are grammar rules that our grandparents were taught that are no longer used. That’s the nature of language. </p>
<p>If you want to stop it from evolving, we’ll have to go back to very early “English”. I have a hard enough time reading Shakespeare! Let’s not go back further than that ;)</p>
<p>Languages do evolve, but “correct” shouldn’t follow some path of least resistance. When we were kids, we used to say, “Well, ain’t is in the dictionary.” </p>
<p>Slang can be charming- that’s different than contexts where it’s not smart.</p>
<p>ps. graduated hs or graduated university or at university or in hospital-- are all British, I believe.</p>
<p>Indeed, US and British/Commonwealth usage of the verb “graduate” is different. In British usage, “graduate” is an intransitive verb. A person graduates, and there’s no direct object since the school or university is not operated upon. If the institution is to be mentioned, the correct usage “he graduated from university.” The Americanism “he graduated university” always grates on me.</p>
<p>I’d also like to say that although my views on grammar probably lean a little to the conservative side, I’m firmly in the evolutionary camp regarding language. English usage evolves constantly. Modern media may perhaps speed the process, but the language has changed continuously over hundreds of years!</p>
<p>I think a current area of evolution is in the use of they/them as singular gender-neutral pronouns. I’m personally in favor of this usage, since constant “he or she”, “him or her” is just tiresome, and the inclusive use of he and him has become anachronistic.</p>
<p>I will definitely second support of the gender-neutral pronoun trend.</p>
<p>Any current-day examples of grammar evolving? I understand certain words coming (and going, I suppose) from our collective vocabularies. But I’m not coming up with examples of grammar rules changing…I’m sure they are out there, but I can’t think of any. Gender neutral pronouns might be one example, but are there others?</p>
<p>The worst one I hear where I live is “should have went” (said more like “shoulda went”). </p>
<p>My other pet peeve, which is a retail phenomenon, is when one is standing in line at the bank or bookstore and the teller or sales clerk addresses customers with “I can help who’s next.” SERIOUSLY.</p>
<p>back when I was in school, when speaking about a mixed gender group, the masculine was used as in “Each student should circle his first choice”
Now, the longer and more awkward sounding “his or her” would be substituted.</p>
<p>Many words and terms evolve. The polite term for an American of African ancestry has certainly changed, and for a person whose mind isn’t up to the average. Feeble-minded and ■■■■■■■■ used to be polite and acceptable terms. Many would be insulted if they were used now. This is what is meant by politically correct- changing and sometimes straining to select wording so carefully that it not offend anyone’s potentially delicate sensibilities. To say something is politically correct could mean it’s correct, but with a qualifier.</p>
<p>My wife defines a girl as any female. 8, 18, 48, or 68, all the same to her. She is comfortable and confident in herself. Others might be offended and choose to define it much more narrowly; yet others still might be flattered by the term!</p>
<p>mass, the gender neutral one is huge currently.</p>
<p>If you mean “one” as a sub for he/she, it’s old and used to be considered semi-formal, at least. Risks sounding a little stilted (anong the non-users) and still runs into possessive gender issues. I find myself often using “you.” Ie, instead of one may choose," “You may choose to…” Does sound casual.</p>