<p>The issue isn’t just whether or not to pay the fines, it’s HOW to pay the fines and keep it off his record or get probation.</p>
<p>Unless there is something so dysfunctional about this family that can’t be reconciled- I’d tell him to talk to his mom and dad, offer to help, or offer to talk to his parents for him. It’s sad that a child would have to go through all this alone. Or… you’re liable to end up the person in-the-middle. If the family situation is so poor that something like this can’t be told to mom or dad… shudder… as godparent, you must have the respect of his parents. This is your hour.</p>
<p>The attorney needs to be carefully chosen. You need to either tell his parents or act as the parent yourself - don’t leave it up to a kid to pick an attorney unless you are sure he knows what he is doing.</p>
<p>Sounds to me like he really does need to talk to his parents. Isn’t he going to need some financial help from them (even it is in the form of a loan) to pay for the attorney plus the other costs involved in this mess (ie: fines)? </p>
<p>I don’t blame him for not wanting to tell his parents. We know someone who got into trouble for “public drunkeness”. He did tell mom and dad, and they did hire an attorney. Yes, mom did have a hysterical initial reaction (frankly I really don’t blame her, and I would have a similar reaction), but it all worked out. Kiddo had to pay a few hundred for a class about alcohol or something like that, and he had to do a certain number of hours of community service. I don’t know who paid for the lawyer. My guess is that parents laid out the money and kiddo is paying all or some portion back to mom and dad.</p>
<p>Well, if the godmother thinks he should talk to the parents, she could play out her role as godmother by advising him that he is growing up. He made a mistake, so now it’s time to deal with the mistake as an adult. Hearing out the angry parental reaction is one of the consequences of his action, and somethjing you can assure him he can endure. He’ll just have to get through that unpleasant but temporary consequence (their upset) in order to have a better longterm outcome of having a lawyer. </p>
<p>In other words, can you lay this out for him like a decision tree: if he tells them, then this, this and that will happen. If he doesn’t tell them, then this, this, and the other will happen. </p>
<p>I’m concerned only that he’ll not tell the parents, decide to plead not guilty (which may not be the best plea), not hire a lawyer because he’s a kid who doesn’t know his resources, and then lose the case.</p>
<p>Does he have a savings account to pay for his own attorney? I really think a lot of this is that he needs a lawyer, and you as godmother need to urge him to take responsible steps to get a lawyer, either by financing one himself (through savings) and thus avoid telling the parents, OR be willing to take the anger from the parents to tell them (and hope they’ll pay for the lawyer). Lay it out for him, and then let him decide. I think that’s treating him more like the adult that he is.</p>
<p>chocoholic–any update?</p>
<p>“He was visiting friends on another campus (during his own Spring Break), and a bunch of them decided to go to a campus food court at 2 a.m. While they were leaving, one kid grabbed the fire extinguisher on the way out. So, now they are walking down the street with it. this kid starts spraying, then passes it to kid 2, who sprays, and passes it to godchild. OFCOURSE, a cruiser shows up, everyone flees, but gc decides that running is bad, and unnecessary, since he was innocent.”</p>
<p>He wasn’t “innocent.” He was drinking underage and was the accessory to a crime. It doesn’t sound like he even tried to stop the guy from stealing the fire extinguisher or spraying it. It sounds like he was drunk and was hanging out with drunken guys who as a group were doing something stupid. It’s not like he was an innocent bystander who had no association with the people misbehaving. He needs to take responsibiity for his actions before his lack of judgment gets him into an even worse situation.</p>
<p>I know that I’m coming in late here, but I’d have told him to tell his parents and to get a lawyer. I also don’t believe in keeping these kind of secrets from parents.</p>
<p>Thanks Cincy-gal,</p>
<p>Yes, actually I accompanied him to consult with 2 attorneys, and both seemed to think he has a very good case. Both said that he should do the alcohol program so that the alcohol incident gets expunged. Neither pushed their services, and one said that the magistrate was a whacko and severely punished minor incidents, but allowed major offences off the hook. He felt that the outcome was entirely unpredictable because of the “power-trip” this person is on. I don’t know what he means,but he went on to cite several recent odd cases.</p>
<p>So, gc will do the program and plead innocent to the other citation on his own. He is very shaken up, even now, and sees the awful judgement he made. Fortunately for him, they are citations and not misdemeanors.</p>
<p>As I said earlier, its my gc’s duty to tell his parents, and he plans on doing it .</p>
<p>Northstarmom- he’s a kid and kids do stupid things. Back in our day when we did stupid things they didn’t necessarily ruin our lives the way things potentially can do now. It’s a different world and I agree with doing everything possible to minimize the consequences. Once again, you are exhibiting NO tolerance for mistakes. You must live in a different world from most of the rest of us.</p>
<p>I should add that I would have a lawyer with me for the court appearance, especially with a loose-cannon magistrate. There can be surprises with this sort of thing, and you want a lawyer to help navigate those surprises.</p>
<p>My DS has been in “trouble” several times when over 18 years of age and once when under 18. Sometimes I found out after the fact – saw ticket lying around on his desk, received mail at home for additional fines or ads from lawyers soliciting business. I can tell you I far better appreciate hearing about it on the spot – and from him. For under 18 problem, we hired local lawyer who expedited everything – still there were court fines, community programs, community service, etc. For over 18 problem, DS actually found a lawyer on line to help with festival problem. When he received citation for disorderly conduct in NYC, he consulted on line with lawyers who said he should not hire them but take care of it himself; he had to take a day off from school but officer who issued citation did not even file it so son got off.
We insist that DS pay for these fees – either $ upfront from earnings or we deduct from monthly spending money – he is not a happy camper.</p>
<p>I pretty much agree with Northstarmom. I have trouble when crimes are described as “mistakes.” There really was no mistake here–they didn’t erroneously think that it was OK to steal the fire extinguisher.</p>
<p>Two things:
Someone from Wisconsin told me that Wisconsin allows underage kids to drink with parents at home and to order for them in a bar! Are there other states? </p>
<p>Just be careful with the citation thing. Neighbor girl was cited last year for “minor” consumption at Iowa State. Paid it off, thought it was over. She applied for a summer internship and she checked off that she had no prior convictions. Guess what!!! She was denied employment/internship for lying when they checked her record. She didn’t realize/understand that a “citation” counted.</p>
<p>“Northstarmom- he’s a kid and kids do stupid things. Back in our day when we did stupid things they didn’t necessarily ruin our lives the way things potentially can do now.”</p>
<p>Back in the day, I didn’t do “stupid” things like that. My husband also didn’t do “stupid” things like that. Some might say we were nerds, but neither of us thought a good time involved things like drunken vandalizing. </p>
<p>None of us has control over whether our kids do “stupid” things that are crimes. I would never say that my kids won’t do such things. If they did such a thing and got caught, I would still love them, and also would expect that they would pay for their lawyer (which might mean my giving them a loan which I’d expect son to pay for in advance).</p>
<p>“It’s a different world and I agree with doing everything possible to minimize the consequences. Once again, you are exhibiting NO tolerance for mistakes. You must live in a different world from most of the rest of us.”</p>
<p>I believe in holding someone responsible for their mistakes. In other words, I don’t believe in giving a free pass – making excuses that everyone drinks underage or commits other illegal acts. </p>
<p>I agree that I must not live in the same world that you do. I don’t think it’s normal or expected for teens to commit crimes like theft and vandalism. While I know that many people drink underage, I also know some who do not. While some of my friend’s kids have gotten into trouble (including one kid who got into trouble for theft), I don’t view such behavior as typical for teens.</p>
<p>If one of my sons had an experience like the OP’s godson, I would not be considering my son an innocent bystander, but would be talking to my son about his own responsibiity for his resulting legal problems. Unless he realized his own responsibiity for his problems, he’d be likely to get into more trouble.</p>
<p>" She applied for a summer internship and she checked off that she had no prior convictions. Guess what!!! She was denied employment/internship for lying when they checked her record. She didn’t realize/understand that a “citation” counted."</p>
<p>One of my husband’s college students almost didn’t get a summer journalism internship because he’d had a speeding ticket. As part of his job, the student would have had to drive, and the company’s insurance didn’t want to cover young drivers who’d had traffic violations.</p>
<p>My husband and the corporate recruiter had to intervene to get the insurance company to make an exception.</p>
<p>The school he attends may offer legal services as part of a student services fee. He should check?</p>
<p>If the worst thing someone does is be with a friend who grabs a fire extinguisher and starts spraying it, I’m not too concerned. Of course it isn’t OK to do and there ARE consequences. The reality (in this world, not yours) is that kids do stuff like this all the time and this kid won’t be doing it again, but it doesn’t need to have the equivalent stigma of a DUI or theft.</p>
<p>Am I correct (may be confusing you with another poster) that you, Northstarmom, are the one who thinks anyone who likes alcohol is a sub-human?</p>
<p>“If the worst thing someone does is be with a friend who grabs a fire extinguisher and starts spraying it, I’m not too concerned.”</p>
<p>But that isn’t an accurate description of what happened. He was part of a group that stole a fire extinguisher, and he was the one holding it when the police arrived. It IS theft. If the police aren’t treating it as theft, he is extremely lucky.</p>
<p>I have a tangential question. </p>
<p>In what states is it illegal for parents to serve alcohol to their own underage children? And in what states is it illegal for an underage child to drink at home when served by his/her parents?</p>
<p>For example, consider the case of serving of wine with a meal to an 18 year-old. In what states are either the parents serving or the child drinking, breaking the law?</p>
<p>It sounds like a petty, juvenile <em>crime</em>. But, would I want to see any young person’s life destroyed? Hmmm. No.</p>
<p>I hope this young man is scared enough (and I believe he is) that he is forever changed. My advice is to TRY repair the rift or whatever it is between him and his parents, that he can’t tell them about this. THAT is something that is important to do right now. If I were a godparent, that’s what I’d feel like my job was- to be the catalyst that helps him talk to his mom and/or dad, and get the support he needs.</p>