Yes. But not at the three colleges in this OP.
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I can elaborate a bit on Rice! Rice is a great school for obvious reasons and I do think I would enjoy my time there a lot, but it does total out to being around 70k/yr once flights are considered, and I can’t really find any way to justify paying so much more for Rice over Johns Hopkins, which is both cheaper and probably a better fit academically + in terms of career/med school opportunities, or WashU, which stands around the same as Rice yet is a small small fraction of the cost.
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Have you chatted with your folks - not about the next four years - but next 6 (MPH) and 8 (Med School) from a budget POV?
That should factor into your decision - i.e. avoiding debt later on. Not sure if that’s a concern or not - depends on that discussion with them.
My parents and I have spoken a lot about this since mid February now when the first of these decisions started coming out.
Again, on paper, all of these can be paid for, including four more years for medical school. But that doesn’t mean that these costs are necessarily easy to afford - Yale would mean that my parents would retire a few years later, go on fewer vacations, eat out less, etc. Debt won’t be an issue but that doesn’t mean that impacts won’t be felt.
Before this cycle started, my parents had already solidified that they would be willing to pay full price to Yale, Harvard, or Princeton, and that they would be skeptical to do so for any other school on my list. I had wanted to apply ED to Brown at first but they made clear that they didn’t think the price was worth it and at the very least I should wait for more options - and now I’m very glad I did because I couldn’t be more grateful to have enough options that Brown right now isn’t even a main consideration.
If I had to “rank” in terms of how much I’d like to go to each, it would probably be exactly flipped to price, with that being Yale > Hopkins > WashU > Emory Oxford. I have now visited all on admitted students days besides for Yale which will be next week, though I’ve visited it a lot growing up and I think I have a good enough feel of campus that I feel comfortable believing this order will stay.
Financially, the transition from “financially comfortable” to “financially possible” happens at around 60k/yr. Yale or Princeton is possible for my family, but as I mentioned earlier, that doesn’t mean it’s worth it since it will have notable yet manageable effects. Medical school is also possible, yet any money saved during undergrad makes those four years also more manageable. The concern I have there though is if I keep on the premed track - as of right now it’s what I see myself doing but I want to stay practical and realize that many premeds start out this way and don’t necessarily apply to medical school in the end.
This will tough decision. If there’s one that I think I’m currently leaning towards it is Hopkins, and if there’s one that I think is most falling off the list it’s Emory. I visited Princeton last week - because although it didn’t make the final cut it’s a short drive away and I thought I might as well - and there definitely is something magical about it that I’d imagine is the case with Yale too next week - I can’t exactly put it into words but from the people to the campus feel to every small detail (to the surprise of Jon Stewart being one of the prospective student’s parents), there is a genuine factor of “otherness” that does place Harvard/Yale/Princeton in their own little tier. I visited Hopkins just a few days ago and loved my time there and I think it checks every box that I have and definitely allows me to thrive, but it is of course just a little different. And then as I go down to then WashU, that “otherness” seeped even a bit more (though I did definitely feel a spark with the other WashU Scholars, who funnily enough, I saw a ton of at Princeton’s admitted students day!) and once I visited Emory Oxford I couldn’t fully see myself loving it - liking it, sure - but not loving it.
I’m someone that loves to write so I apologize if I went off too much on a tangent, but to be concise once more, I think this whole process will go down to converting my love or lack of love for each option (in addition to the opportunity they offer) into a price sign which of course is no easy thing to do. I do think that just talking this over - whether with parents, friends, or online forums like this, has been helpful and I hope by the end of next week I will be a bit less stuck on making the right choice.
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@Polly_P please, please thank your parents for their generosity. Just funding undergrad school fully is a huge gift. There are families that won’t do this, even though they can…so give mom and dad a big thank you hug.
Re: medical school. Many medical school students take loans to fund medical school. Medical school is usually funded via loans…and help from the bank of mom and dad. If you end up taking loans for medical school, you won’t be the first medical school student to do so. It will be a gift not to have undergraduate loans.
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Absolutely! I couldn’t be thankful enough for my parents and all the support they have given and continue to give in every which way!
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I think you answered all your parents thoughts:
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They’d be willing to pay full for HYP but not anywhere else - because you got $$ to the others
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Then it’s the value question - right - because you have both scenarios - which is right. Is the trade off agreeable to them and you - retiring later, less vacations, etc - no one else can answer.
I go back to - if you become a dr. the where likely doesn’t matter. At the same time, if you don’t like being somewhere, then you won’t do as well. The truth is, no one truly knows where is best - it’s all a guess til you get there - but if your feelings are strong - and based on what your parents say, why not decide between the top two.
JHU is $63K so 2/3 off is about $20K - so you are saving without inflation - $170K+.
Yale (today) is $67,250) - so now it’s another $17K - so all in all going to Hopkins, if I understand the scholarship, is about $190K less than Yale.
So have that chat with mom/dad.
They are obviously prestige focused but in reality, JHU, especially in healthcare, is likely their equal,
$190K - can help them retire earlier, go to nicer dinners or on vacation or what not - and you felt good at JHU.
But the $190K belongs to them.
If you tell them you want JHU, then it’s over right - and they save the $190K.
If you tell them you want to go to Yale, then they have to decide - do they want that?
From an outcome POV, all four of these are likely the same - in regards to med school - but the discussion is deeper and clearly they value pedigree.
So in my opinion, you should decide which of JHU or Yale you truly want - factoring in what you know about the cost delta and how that will impact your family. We know if costs were equal, you’d want Yale.
If it’s Yale, even at the higher cost, then it’s a bigger discussion on that delta, how it will impact their lives, and if they’re comfortable with it and let them make the decision.
Good luck.
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WUSTL Scholars being admitted students at colleges like Princeton is sort of the point! They are trying to bribe you into choosing them (and not fooling around with the offer).
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I think this is an excellent and thoughtful summary of the decision you’re facing, and tbh I don’t feel like further filibustering from us is going to make that decision any easier. Maybe someone will come up with a new perspective to add, but I rather doubt it. It’s a personal decision at this point, and it sounds as if you and your parents are thinking it through in a very level-headed and insightful way. I wish you luck and look forward to hearing what you decide!
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@Polly_P, you write beautifully, and come across as very mature. Congratulations.
From your more recent posts, it sounds like none of your options will put you or your family into debt or constrain your future options, and that you have a clear order of preference. It seems that there is a significant step-off between your top 2 (Yale and JHU) and your other options. Given that Hopkins seems to be well within what your family can comfortably pay, maybe you should eliminate WUSTL and Emory-Oxford. These are enviable options, especially for those more financially constrained, but if your parents can comfortably afford $60k/year then you have the luxury of being able to pass them up without undue hardship, as Hopkins falls within this comfort zone.
Visit Yale and see how much it pulls at your heartstrings. Think about how committed you are to health-related fields vs. keeping your options open. Then, if Yale is your preference, sit down with your family and discuss the impact of the additional cost, and make a decision. Be grateful for your exceptional opportunities, and make the most out of whichever you choose.
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That’s called a BS/MD program. I’m not sure if these schools offer it, but here’s my advice on that. Just…DON’T. The vast majority of “premed” hopefuls coming out of high school end up changing their major to something else. College is a maturation process, and as you explore, you will most likely find passions elsewhere. Best just to choose a university you’re happy at and explore. If medicine happens to be your passion after that…go for it!
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So correct me if/where I am wrong, OP, but it seems like:
- JHU is your favorite “fit”, but it is more expensive than Emory and WashU
- Emory is a free ride, but it is your worst fit
- WashU is a favorable fit, and is second-cheapest
- Yale may be a good fit, but it is full-pay (twice as much as Hopkins, 3x-4x the cost of WashU, and ~$350k more than Emory in today’s money)
I think your sweet spot is WashU – second-cheapest and a good fit. Unless you feel that paying (what?) $50k-$80k more for Hopkins would be worth it.
I would recommend Emory for the free ride, which is an incredible value… but you seem to hate the thought of two years at Oxford. If you haven’t, I would visit it – then you will know.
Otherwise, to me, it’s down to WashU and Hopkins.
ETA:
You mentioned name recognition in your original post. No worries here – Emory, JHU, WashU, and Yale are very well known and respected among the med school admissions community, grad schools, recruiters, etc. Nobody is ever going to look at your resume and scoff at WashU or Emory.
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I don’t understand your reasoning, @prezbucky.
WUSTL might be the “sweet spot” if the goal was to minimize cost while maximizing experience. But from what OP posted in #103, this does not apply to her family. She wrote that anything under $60k/year was “comfortable” for her family, including factoring in medical school. So why pick a less preferred option over a more preferred one, when both are within budget?
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If both are affordable and they don’t mind spending more for Hopkins, that’s their prerogative. Same with Yale – though that’s much, much more.
Considering the family can pay for Yale AND med school outright (though with fewer family vacations and eating out) OP would be among the many choosing Yale full pay.
Sounds like the 2nd favorite is JHU and it’s a matter of subjective appreciation at that point.
Emory would be crossed out outright since it’s the poorest fit and OP doesn’t need a full ride at all.
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Repeated for emphasis!
This continued beating of a dead horse may be off-putting to the 17 or 18 year old OP.
My vote – which I realize does not count – is: only post if you aren’t saying things five other people have already written about upthread.
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If Med School is definitely the path, I would rule out Yale. It’s much more expensive and I wonder whether it supports pre-Med as well as the other schools. Why do I make this claim?
Take the comparison to WashU. Yale and WashU are roughly the same size (7,800 WashU undergrads vs. 6,600 Yale undergrads), but WashU sends 1,305 over 5 years or average of 261 first time applicants per year to Med school vs. 150 for Yale (in the single year of 2023). So WashU definitely sends more to Med School.
Acceptance rate by GPA for a higher GPA student is nearly identical. Yale is 1% higher in both of the top brackets (3.8 to 4.0 and 3.6 to 3.79), but WashU best Yale for acceptance for those with 3.2 to 3.6 GPA by a wide margin in both volume and acceptance rate.
Seems like you need a 3.6+ to get Yale’s endorsement.
Data sources:
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Interesting analysis - I wonder if that’s because WUSTL and Yale attract differing types of students, related to their reasons for going to college and future desires.
I wonder how much the Yale-to-consulting/finance pipeline affects these numbers. For years, about a quarter of Yale grads have gone straight into the financial industry and/or consulting, even though many of them started out with different intentions (including, one presumes, med school). The numbers appear to be about the same today as when the late Marina Keegan wrote her widely-read essay on the subject back in 2011 (less than a year before her untimely death, just five days after graduating from Yale) Even artichokes have doubts - Yale Daily News
I’m sure it doesn’t fully explain the numbers, but I don’t doubt that highly-lucrative, low-hanging-fruit opportunities for Yale grads do siphon off some students who would otherwise have undertaken the more arduous path of medical education.
Of course, nothing about this diminishes the quality of premed preparation that’s available to students at Yale who still choose to pursue medicine.
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Per NCES data, the proportion of Yale and WashU students studying undergraduate biological sciences is within 1% of each other (12.6% at WashU and 11.7% at Yale). I don’t think it would be a crazy assumption that roughly the same proportion of each school’s students would be interested in Med School.
What I found interesting was that there was only ONE Yalie (out of 8 applicants) with <3.4 GPA who got accepted to Med School in 2023 while WashU had 188 acceptances over a 5 year period or about 38 per annum to provide an apples to apple comparison. Of course, grade inflation may be so rampant at Yale that there are few graduates with GPAs < 3.4. 
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