Duke and Dartmouth, for example, would fairly be said to be in different climate zones. If you like plants, Duke is in Hardiness Zone 8a, Dartmouth in 5a. That doesn’t mean there are no similar days, but I don’t think it is irrational for people to prefer one or the other overall.
1 Like
Maybe OP can define academics - I wondered the same. Ivy does have engineering.
But in the end, hopefully they got the answer they are looking for….or didn’t. It’d be nice to get a follow up that said so.
Instead, it’s now simply a Duke vs Ivy with little context.
1 Like
that is fame. different IMO
And BOS doesn’t really have much harvard gear if any is my recall
Locals are honestly much more impressed by MIT IME.
4 Likes
Thanks all for the comments. It gives me a lot to think about. I think the drop in prestige is only significant for the most coveted roles in things like say finance and consulting after doing some more research. But even in that case, the companies I have seen students on my current campus intern for all also recruit at Duke (with the exception of few quant finance companies which I was never even interested in). Otherwise, I find that Duke has a much more significant number of alums working in tech and corporate roles with Econ or Stats degrees. Duke’s certificates and courses are what really drew me to the school – innovation & entrepreneurship, finance, info sci, even decision science. Unfortunately, my ivy does not offer such broad offerings in terms of academics. While I understand the argument that major and courses do not equate directly to post grad work, I find it beneficial to balance out a liberal arts curriculum with at least some more practical education. At the end of the day, yes, Duke is not exactly a trade school either. However, the classes within these pre-designed tracks are of high interest to me (and actually to many students at my university yet the administration does not seem to want to accomodate such interests by adding similar courses). Additionally, during interviews for opportunities this summer, I found it rather difficult to sell myself in terms of my own experience/ knowledge gained from coursework or clubs at my university. I ended up relying on my ties to my home state and prior experiences in high school to secure my role. I think it is a great school for some people, but for those wanting to enter industry directly with many options for work, it leaves a lot to be desired. In terms of school spirit, I think it correlates somewhat to alumni responsiveness too. My university has some school spirit (perhaps one of the better ones in the ivy) but I find it hard to get alums on the phone or even seniors to respond. Anecdotally, I know people who have secured jobs out of Duke because of their alumni network. At the end of the day, I have seen how my university advertises its breadth of offerings and interdisciplinary nature. Yet, its lack of caterings in terms of pre-professional support naturally funnels graduates down to the few paths of consulting finance or post-graduate studies since those don’t require a direct linear path or strictly defined skillsets. While I’m not certain what my career will personally look like, it is a bit unnerving to know that options are quite limited and that some employers do not even bother looking at my school because of its non pre-professional nature. Duke just seems like a well-rounded option for transfer but I just want to make sure that my worries and reasons for leaving are warranted.
2 Likes
You need to do what you think is best for you! Good luck. Put in your transfer application and see what happens. You might transfer…and you might change your mind.
In the meantime…do the best you can to enjoy where you are.
2 Likes
IMHO you are overthinking this- if you want to transfer, then transfer. I am not aware that any of the HYP or similar U’s are having an employment crisis because their students can’t get a certificate showing that they know DCF– but if you want a more applied type of education, then it’s great you recognize that and are prepared to address it!
You should just bear in mind that the lack of an apprenticeship/practical/applied curriculum at your college (or the other’s like it) isn’t a bug for the the employers who recruit there- it’s a feature.
I’ve posted before about the young guy I hired for a hedge fund/fund of funds type organization. Possibly the best finance hire I’ve ever made. He was a geology major, had never taken a finance course or even anything remotely close to business. But he had written a paper and developed a model predicting seismic activity (volcanic, underwater tsunami type conditions, etc.) and the MD’s went NUTS over him. Senior folks were lining up to meet him even after it was clear we were going to make him an offer.
Why? Turns out that if you’re in the business of modeling “Black Swan” type events in the financial/banking world, hiring someone who created a highly predictive model of earthquakes based on HUGE datasets, most of which operate independently of each other, is an enormous win. Did anyone care that he hadn’t taken a course in Valuation or claimed that he was self-studying for the CFA? No they did not. They wanted his creativity and ingenuity, they wanted his strong mathematical brain, they wanted his ability to take big imaginative leaps and then apply them to new problems.
So until the day that Harvard, Yale, Princeton etc. grads can’t get jobs because they haven’t gotten certificates in Big Data or what-not– you should feel confident that your employment prospects won’t be significantly harmed by being at a college without a vocational orientation.
But that said- if you want to go to Duke- which you clearly do- stop justifying it and just send in your deposit!!! It’s a fine institution. And they ALSO teach geology and history and poli sci and linguistics if you decide you want a broader education than just pre-professional classes and certifications. Win/Win!
3 Likes
Many of the issues you mention are common and will most likely reoccur at Duke. The Ivies you mention lean more towards liberal arts - they are distinctly and intentionally non-professional in undergrad. That is kind of the point. You will be a finance guy who knows a thing or two about literature and philosophy, not focusing solely on business classes that you will master during an MBA anyway.
You are making Duke seem better because you want to go. So go.
Most schools have the same issues.
If you’ve gotten an internship after your first year, you’ve done extremely well. Few have that happen.
One year of courses / clubs at Duke would not have changed that.
You’ve talked yourself into Duke and that’s a great school.
So go and thrive - as long as you can afford to go.
Best of luck.
1 Like
Agreeing with what others have said. This is not a “Help Me Decide” thread (we’re sort of left guessing what the parameters actually are); it’s more of a “Tell Me I’m Correct” thread. And, since Duke is clearly where you want to go - you are correct in wanting to go there!
5 Likes
For me, there is now clear separation among the ivies. And since ivies have become “somewhat” less in favor over the last couple of years, this might matter more. I see nothing wrong with selecting Duke over any of them, even if prestige is your thing. I would have trouble doing it over Harvard, Yale, or Princeton - but none of the others. Just my opinion. I would never fault someone else for making the Duke selection.
Duke is a fine school, and transferring there from anywhere cannot represent much of a dip in quality (if any…), unless in rare cases where the school you’re transferring from has a notably stronger program/major than Duke. But if that’s not the case for you, and Duke’s curriculum checks out, then I wouldn’t see a hurdle there… provided enough credits transfer that you won’t have to add additional semesters at Duke.
Sports vibe, weather and setting advantages are obviously in the eye of the beholder and it’s fine to use them in choosing a school. Heck, we encourage kids making their lists to use these (and other) things as “fit” variables.
But there are things you should be honest with yourself about, like social skills/comfort level and the willingness to engage. Because if problems exist there, you’ll have the same issues at Duke, or anywhere else. (if you are worried about that, that is. If you aren’t, then it’s no problem…). Generally, in life, you have to go after the things you want - they typically do not just land in your lap. So wherever you end up next year, put your best foot forward, according to your personality, and try to make the most of your opportunities. Whether you are still at your Ivy or at Duke, they will be numerous.
1 Like
Reminder to senior users talking amongst themselves to use PM. This is not the Cafe.
TIA!
Since we got flagged, I decided to post on the topic because I think it will be of interest to the community.
Link added by moderator: Is Prestige Still about Ivies and Rankings?
2 Likes