<p>Bourne I agree with you. Maybe I am a bit polarizing, because I get annoyed when pizzagirl and rjk make blanket statements and seek to disparage anyone who disagrees with them on the basis of age. Being older does not make you smarter or more mature. Thank you for getting the point across, there is a balance that needs to be found and that differs for every individual. Certain brand names provide more opportunities, but I recognize that at the same time some people may be a better fit and as a result excell more at a different school.</p>
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<p>You assume every hiring manager is an elite grad or cares about elite schools themselves. Do you not get it? Leave aside the i-banking and mgt consulting you all salivate over. Think about the other jobs that college seniors interview for. With large companies, medium companies, small companies. You really think the hiring manager at … oh, I don’t know, a major insurance company looking for fresh new blood is herself or himself an elite grad who cares passionately about the minute differences between Cornell or Princeton?</p>
<p>It’s almost like you’re not aware that people exist in hiring positions and in fact in top positions in every major corporation without elite degrees. When I interviewed for my first job, the hiring manager went to a top 20 school that was lower than mine. And then I went on to interview with people who went to (gasp) state flagships. Such people really exist and have jobs and hire other people! Honest! To listen to you talk, you’d think that the only employers in the world are all top 20 grads.</p>
<p>it depends on the job, sorry if I am not interested in a 25k a year one, which for that purpose it would be irrelevant. People exist from any school, but that doesn’t mean a better school on your resume looks bad. Look at where hedge funds, I banks, business schools, med schools all hire from.</p>
<p>Bescraze, you’re simply wrong about medical schools. Even the top medical schools admit people from every single type of school, from the least competitive public u’s all the way up to the Ivies. Honest. And once you’re in medical school, it’s the great leveler. If you want to be in academic medicine, yes, you are better off going to a top med school. If you just want to be an everyday physician treating patients, it really doesn’t matter what med school or what undergrad you went to as long as you finish residency and pass your boards. The pediatrician in private practice from Harvard does the exact same thing as the pediatrician in private practice from State U, and the insurance companies in charge of their pay don’t give bonus bucks to the Harvard ped. That’s the real world.</p>
<p>Someone a few weeks ago wrote a great post refuting what you said, it was something along the lines of top med groups hire from top med schools, since it looks good for them, but I am too tired to find it…</p>
<p>And Bescraze, I never said that a better school on your resume looks bad. Of course it doesn’t. Of course, all else being equal, a better school is better than an average school. What I dispute is that every single employer / hiring manager out there is as attuned to the USNWR ratings as we all are here on CC. You don’t seem to realize that kids coming out of elite schools don’t just go work for other elite school grads – they work for people with all kinds of degrees. Because hard as it may be for you to believe – there are people with non-fancy degrees who are very successful, make a lot of money (if that’s your definition of success) and who hold the power to hire you.</p>
<p>That’s nice, Bescraze. Knock yourself out. I’ve only been married to a doctor from a top 20 u-grad for the past 2 decades and have lived through the med school application process & residency piece of the equation. What would I know? LOL.</p>
<p>People choose doctors based on who is in their insurance plan for the most part. Dh has a top 20 u-grad and med school. His partner went to a state flagship u-grad and med school. Guess what? They make the same amount. Because that’s how private practice works. The ins cos don’t reward him extra for going to a better u-grad or med school, you know. Sorry, I know what I’m talking about on this one. The quality of your u-grad / med school is most relevant for people entering academic medicine, not everyday practitioners. The only private practice where it might differ are things like plastic surgery where people go on reputations – but even so, a reputation as a good plastic surgeon trumps where you went to school.</p>
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Why would an HYP grad choose to become an everyday practitioner instead of entering academic medicine? Maybe a Cornell grad would be satisfied becoming a general physician but a Harvard grad certainly isn’t. Harvard grads aim to be the best: CEOs of companies, heads of medical complexes, world-famous researchers, etc.</p>
<p>I know atleast five Harvard students who are undergrads and are personal friends aspiring to become practioners. Who says that is not a worthy career choice to aspire to?</p>
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<p>Yeah, your a complete idiot. If you ever dared to come to Cambridge, you would just get messed up so badly. You have no idea of what your talking about, your image of Harvard students is completely flawed, Visit the damn place before you immerse yourself in self-created rumours and mythological BS. Get real information, I’m sorry, you have no idea of what you are talking about. Period.
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<p>This strikes me deeply as you are just idiotic enough to say that only Harvard grads aspire to be the best while Cornell grads are only satisfied with being practicioners. Tell me, is it only Harvard grads that want to be CEOs of companies, heads of medical complexes, world-famous researchers, etc? I’m pretty sure EVERYONE, including Cornell, HYSPM, rest of the Ivies, etc… aspires for the best, not only Harvard grads. A very small fraction of the world population actually makes it to those jobs. Not every Harvard grad makes it to those jobs but due to alumni connections and good networking, they are better positioned to reach that level of stratosphere relative to the other university population striving to do the same. ARe you claiming that only Harvard grads aspire to be the best? Dude, you have no idea what your saying. Just shutup.</p>
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<p>Care to cite the sources to back up your claims? Do you have some data that shows what percentage of Harvard grads end up in academic medicine, CEOs of major corporations, relative to other “general” jobs such as physicians, lawyers, business managers, etc? Also, why do you claim that HYP grads would automatically choose the academic paths instead of professional ones? Many people are really passionate about the field of medicine, let’s say, and they really aspire to become doctors to practice medicine. Some others might prefer to go onto academic medicine bc they enjoy researching, etc. Also, for many, the monetary gain that doctors earn will be more alluring than the academic medicine paths with much less fiancial gains. Lastly, only the few of the few, even among HYP grads, will end up as heads of medical complexes, CEOs of companies, and world-class researchers.</p>
<p>This is nonsense. What i am about to say is the honest truth. I knew a person who graduated at the top of his class at UG at Harvard, went to Harvard Medical School and graduated at the top of his class, and completed his residency as a neurosurgeon at a Harvard affiliated hospital. This is the smartest person I personally have ever met. He also was one of the nicest and most humble individuals I ever met. Some of you people here could take a less from him on accomplishment and humility.</p>
<p>You are totally correct, of course, patless88. My cousin, who was a senior VP at Tenet healthcare, got his graduate degree from George Washington University. He never had any affiliation with any IL school. Hard work, perseverance, and intelligence got him to where he is today.</p>
<p>lol this thread got so crazy.</p>
<p>I think prestige only really matters when you’re talking about financial jobs , for these reasons:</p>
<p>1) Networking opportunities open up huge doors 2) Firms are looking for bright talent, and why would they fly a huge recruiting to X state university, where they might get 1 guy, when they could just drive to any Ivy League school to pick up 50 + qualified applicants, and 3) Particularly for consulting, the name brand on your degree matters A LOT. If you’re a client (CEO of some company), would you rather take advice from a Harvard grad or an ITT Tech grad? Honestly, it’s not even a choice. </p>
<p>I’m sure there are more reasons, but these are the three that come up off the top of my head</p>
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<p>I do consulting all the time and talk to CEO’s of various brand-name companies. No one has *ever asked me where I went to school, even though I’ve got nice brand-names to my credit. It doesn’t matter at this point. At all. In the work force, you get a reputation for being smart; you don’t wear a sticker that shows where you went to school. My business partner is brilliant. Abso-freaking-brilliant. She went to USC as a scholarship student (from a middle class family). No one is looking at her and saying “oh, dear, only USC, that’s only a top 30, it’s not an Ivy, tsk tsk, she can’t possibly be as smart as someone who went to an Ivy League.” You 18-yo’s truly have no idea how little it ultimately matters. And I wouldn’t trade my top 20 education and experience for ANYTHING.</p>
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<p>ROFL. This is another classic one, EAD, along with the “I almost cried because Michigan parties were so lame” and “I go to the best school and get drunk 3 x a week” and “how dare you go to a game and visit with your buddies in the stands instead of screaming for the team and being nasty to the people from the opposing school.” </p>
<p>Why wouldn’t a HYP grad choose to be an everyday practitioner? Is being an everyday practitioner somehow less than going into academic medicine? People are interested in different things.<br>
I know people from my own top 20 school who became pastors, opened yoga studios, and direct small theater troupes, as well as those who became SAH parents, of course. Is it that hard to believe that there is more to life than wanting to be the most highly-paid doctor/lawyer/i-banker/mgt consultant?</p>
<p>Pizzagirl, would you mind telling us where you consult? Is it at M/B/B? If it’s not, then sure, lots of people can make it in the field. However, you really shouldn’t accuse an 18 y.o. of knowing absolutely nothing, especially when WE’RE the ones going through the recruiting right now. Yes, I don’t work in the field, but you better be damn sure that I’ve done my research on this stuff. I never claimed that you HAD to go to a great school to make it in the field. I’m just saying that it is a huge advantage. Furthermore, by making a distinction between Harvard and ITT Tech, I wasn’t trying to say that you HAD to go to a H to make it. USC and your T20 certainly aren’t ITT tech, so I really don’t understand why you would use those particular schools to support your claim. You can go to any school, but going to a better school may help your chances (Ever figure that top 20 education may have helped you out?) . Also, maybe the reason that you never got asked about your education is the fact that you obviously WENT TO A GREAT SCHOOL. </p>
<p>So, please chill out with the tone.</p>
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<p>haha. Undergrad school doesn’t give you an education. The fact that your in a Top 20 is self confirming that you are a smart guy that is naturally talented and is smart. The selectivity of the school weeds out and selects only the best. The fact that your in a Top 20 means that your capable of doing excellent work etc…
Its the level of intelligence that surrounds you that develops and matures you throughout your college years in college. Plus the inevitable difficult super challenging problem sets here and there will definitely stimulate your mind going, the education that you recieve at the undergrad level doesn’t reinforce any tools neccessary when you do find a career in the real world.</p>
<p>Going to a Top 20 school is an advantage, but not neccessarily a huge one. Its up to the individual to use the maximal extent of the university’s resources as possible. Its up to the individual person to get themselves into the door. The School doesn’t hand you these things. There are plenty of students from the same school vying for the same position. You just have to be among the best within your pool or else you look dumb.</p>
<p>I agree completely with CNI on this. Pizzagirl we may not know everything, but in that same way, you don’t neccessarily either. So lets all be respectful. As the last poster said going to a top school does not guarantee anything, but when a school recruits the top 1-3 people at UW and the top 50 at U Penn it certainly helps.</p>
<p>Some people don’t deserve respect.</p>
<p>With age comes real world experience, and ultimately that becomes one’s most valuable asset.</p>
<p>I think the core issue here is not that going to a better school is irrelevant. Of course, going to Harvard is going to position you better than Devry. </p>
<p>The problem is when someone like Bescraze says that everybody who goes to any school but HYSP are simply rejects not able to handle the best.</p>
<p>People go to Northwestern or Georgetown or Columbia for a number of reasons that make it the best school for them and position them to excel in their fields based on their own personalities. I know for me, Harvard undergrad would have been a horrible experience. </p>
<p>Keep in mind also that EAD and bescraze have a vitrolic loathing of Cornell and have a perception that superior people go to certain schools and inferior people go to lowly schools like Cornell. They have not yet experienced the real world to know this is false. Cut them some slack.</p>