<p>Economics is all about adapting to change and competition. Otherwise they still would be making TVs in the USA too. There are forces much bigger/stronger than WalMart. You ignore them at your own peril.</p>
<p>Barrons, as someone who, for the last 25 years,has run her own company all I can say is
…well actually I can only think of sarcasm at the moment. But I will get back with you.</p>
<p>Oh wait, here it is. </p>
<p>"Making stuff in America is important to me. "</p>
<p>You can read anything you want into that little statement.</p>
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<p>Our new global market has changed our consumer practices. I can buy a book down the street, at the mall, online from CA or online from India. Lots of choices. Isn’t Walmart just responding to these changes?</p>
<p>I don’t know the answer to this…is what they do illegal? or do some just consider it immoral? and why? And why were they able to grow when other similar companies such as Kmart seem to be dying?</p>
<p>actually when I think of it in terms of morality-
it is probably pretty moral if globalization results in all workers everywhere working for the same wages and only having access to the same products
and I guess all the bosses will also have the same wages worldwide so that will be more moral too</p>
<p>Granted Walmart is just the biggest retailer in the world and this whole thread initially revolved around Walmart and why some of us do not like doing business with them specifically. People are very much attached to where they buy their groceries and $10 sneakers. I get that. As far as globalization goes, my little attitude is just a drop in the ocean. Besides, the consumer market is a very small part of my business. When I do say “making stuff in America is important”, this has more to do with some very scary trends I have seen just in the last year. Companies who used to process specific materials, materials used in defence, aeronautics and medical technologies have also shut down their plants here in the US to favor cheap processing in China. And I mean some of these material processing plants are now to be found ONLY in China. I only discovered this recently vis a vis a problem I had with a domestic fabricator who told me there was only one source for a composite material that is used in a certain aeronautic application. All China has to do is decide not to ship us some of these materials and we may have a major crisis on our hands. I don’t want a shortage of a composite polytetrafluoroethylene(or oil!) to dictate our foreign policy. Again, making stuff in America is important to me.</p>
<p>From sneakers to fighter jets…we need to really rethink how we can bring back manufacturing to the US.</p>
<p>If it has to start with a few jerks like me throwing out a little bad attitude, so be it.</p>
<p>How do we compete with such low labor costs abroad? Don’t get me wrong! I agree with you. But corporations have to be profitable in order to survive. And labor is usually the largest line item.</p>
<p>OK…late to the game here. I happen to like large chain stores for certain things. I frequent Target, Bed Bath and Beyond, KMart, Penneys, Walmart, Macys, Kohls, Staples…and I could go on and on. There ARE times when I got to the smaller stores that do give better customer service. It all depends on what I’m looking for. I chose to buy all of our appliances from a local store because, quite frankly, they had better customer service and ongoing service options than places like Best Buy.</p>
<p>Shop around…that’s my motto.</p>
<p>Now…re: Walmart…the OP of this thread was about the largesse of the grand opening ceremony. We had a Home Depot open in our town…guess what? It’s the largest taxpayer in the town. They had a big splash when they opened (our HS band declined the invitation to play).</p>
<p>I consistently buy Purina One Cat food at Walmart. There is NO cheaper place to get it, and my cat doesn’t care about the politics.</p>
<p>Rom:depends on the product, but yes…this needs to be figured out. It’s not easy. A very small start : the “made in America” has to start to be important to consumers. Two years back, my payroll company switched from a US call center to an Indian call center. They lost a lot of customers (like me). I got a call from them a month ago that they have switched back to a US call center. I brought my business back to them</p>
<p>musicameric, I confess I have not carefully read all your posts but you seem to be upset that Walmart is not carrying your products? I don’t know what those products are. Can you enlighten us?</p>
<p>The shift to manufacture offshore, if I’m understanding things at all, is because of (1) reduced labor costs, and (2) by manufacturing in emerging markets companies are then allowed to sell to emerging markets.</p>
<p>The first reason – labor costs – seems to be partly about the totally unacceptable living conditions and wages in other countries, not something we want to replicate here. But also about the escalating costs of labor in America – SS, medicare and (sometimes) healthcare. Our housing bubble also drove the escalation of labor costs in that workers here simply had to have a wage to support the skyrocketing housing costs.</p>
<p>Walmart is doing what a host of other American companies, like GE, are doing and have been doing. It is disappointing and I feel some frustration with these companies. But keep in mind they have shareholders who demand ever increasing earnings quarter to quarter. Most of us have stock mutual funds in our 401Ks and we get very ticked off when they don’t go up.</p>
<p>I think it’s simplistic to bash on Walmart. The problems embroiling us are complex, to say the least. Scapegoating easy targets may feel good but won’t get us anywhere.</p>
<p>I like Bunsen’s idea of working to identify American made products and making a little noise about it and getting people excited about buying American. Companies will pay attention. It’s a good idea. And the best thing about it is that it’s positive – it celebrates good things about our country instead of making attacks.</p>
<p>“How do we compete with such low labor costs abroad? Don’t get me wrong! I agree with you. But corporations have to be profitable in order to survive. And labor is usually the largest line item.”</p>
<p>In certain high-tech items, labor is NOT the most expensive part, in-licensed technology is.</p>
<p>No sewhappy< another manufacturer who uses a part of mine in there product is sold at Walmart. I do not want to go into specifics (I’ve lost enough business!), but I really do not think you can understand the ire towards Walmart until you understand their very specific procurement policies. And I am not “scapegoating walmart”. This thread is ABOUT WALMART. That’s why I shared my opinion and experience with Walmart.
Celebrate Walmart? Not in my world. (now THAT would be what you called “silly”)</p>
<p>"It is disappointing and I feel some frustration with these companies. " Just curious…but what do you do to express this frustration and disappointment?</p>
<p>I thought this PBS documentary did a great job:
[Wal-Mart</a> :The High Cost of Low Prices (Part 1 of 11) - YouTube](<a href=“- YouTube”>- YouTube)</p>
<p>Well, Walmart is part of and a leader in the new, now most commonly practiced, way to get goods to consumers. Many others are doing similar things, just maybe not to the extent that they are.</p>
<p>Wholesale purchasing in volume was the first way to get things cheaper from the manufacturer. First the retailer kept the extra profit, then they had to mark down the goods in line with the lower costs, as this practice was adopted by others.
Then there was private label.
Then there was reduced quality private label.
Now there is overseas manufacturing.</p>
<p>This is what retailers have been offering us for the last 30 years. This is how they competed with each other- on price. And how they stimulated unit demand -by offering things so cheaply.</p>
<p>Personally, I do worry about it. I do not like that we are becoming so dependent on foreigners for components to strategic items (pieces of aircraft, of bridges…), for things like drugs, food and chemicals which are not carefully regulated overseas. It is dangerous.
And it has rent a huge hole in the labor side of the US economy: first wages, then benefits, then jobs have been sacrificed to this god of low cost goods.
Yes, we have a higher cost to manufacture in the USA, but if the quality is there and/or we are supporting our economy, it is worth it.
It is a free market, so we can buy things for the reasons we want to, and it does not always have to be price. For those who can afford it, we need to review this.
BTW, eating healthy clean foods to prevent illness is a good investment in our economy, too.</p>
<p>We do not need so much. We need to support our local economy at each level. Even if it costs more, frankly. I can eat less, have fewer clothes, less stuff, if need be. I am trying to be more aware of ingredients, components, and sources these days. Our culture of consumption needs to change.</p>
<p>OK- am hopping off the soap-box LOL</p>
<p>"OK- am hopping off the soap-box LOL "</p>
<p>i have to leave and go sell some American stuff…stay on the soapbox, SOMEONE has to hold down the fort!!</p>
<p>musica- I have read that in terms of “high end” manufacturing the US is still dominant and that type of manufacturing is not on the decline in the US.</p>
<p>What if? What if consumers stopped “needing” a larger TV, more earrings, sneakers, kitchen appliances, a 3rd or 4th bathing suit, et al, ad infinitum? What if they stayed with their good-enough desktop (or, hey, have the kids share rather than have their own) and mis-matched dinnerware? Then, what would happen to WalMart?</p>
<p>See, I think we can’t deny that “demand” is behind sales of these non-essential goods- some odd psychological thing about keeping up with the Joneses and some people satisfying themselves that their “small” lives aren’t so small. </p>
<p>Can we break that cycle? I don’t know. It’s not far from the thing about breaking the bank to pay for college x. And, if you can’t get admitted to college x, picking another that they feel has satisfactory gloss (whether or not it’s worth the price.) After all, no one down the street knows the burden of your college loans. It’s a mentality. So, if you have all the goods, you feel like you’re keeping up. If you have the better school decal in the car window…</p>
<p>Essentials are a different angle. How does WalMart jerk the food industry? (We could argue about the big agri-conglomerates, as well.)</p>
<p>tom, we are losing the competitive edge there as well:</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/30/opinion/manufacturing-a-recovery.html[/url]”>http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/30/opinion/manufacturing-a-recovery.html</a></p>
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<p>Out of all the reasons and arguments I’ve seen put forth on this thread, this one makes the most sense to me. We * are* danger of becoming dependent on countries who aren’t exactly our allies for a lot of goods we need in this country. Good point - never thought about that.</p>
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<p>I also think this is a good point. People in the US are all about acquiring as much as possible. When you have a lot of money, you can afford to acquire a lot of higher priced stuff. Not so much for the middle class and below. In order to be able to afford what everyone now deems as ‘necessary’, they have to seek out and find the lowest prices and that’s what creates such a high demand for cheap goods.</p>
<p>I can’t help but feel that rather than cursing the Walmarts of the world and the fact that so much manufacturing has gone to countries with cheap labor we really need to be focusing on producing goods and services that are so innovative that people don’t mind paying more. Seems like America has lose its mojo.</p>
<p>This is what happened to Solyndra, btw.
The Chinese subsidized their solar-panel making manufacturers so they are able to gain market share by offering lower prices, sometimes called dumping. The US stimulation of the SP industry was on the consumer side- to give rebates to purchasers of solar panels.
Solyndra’s panels were just too expensive to compete with the Chinese panels.
What a mess this has become!
I wonder how many Chinese solar panels these US rebates have subsidized!
(This is not a political post, but an analysis of the economic facts.)</p>
<p>tom1944—this is just partially correct. I am mostly involved in this sort of “high end” manufacturing.( We design components that are made here in the US and we are holding on for dear life) Many many materials that go into this high end manufacturing are now solely processed in China. You can’t make high end widgets if China decides that they dont want to ship you the Unobtainium that has been spec’d on the print.</p>
<p>Do not wait to scream “whats going on” when it has already “all gone on”.</p>