How to help my D to get leadership skills? my D

Parents Forum
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<p>Mom 123 -</p>

<p>Our Ds sound quite similar. My D skated figures (though novice level; quit b/c it got too “girly”) and played 3 varsity sports through all but 1 year of hs. She was never team capt, but every year she medaled at regional meets (swimming and track - - DI caliber jumper) and for her frosh/soph yrs was the only underclass member of her vball team. </p>

<p>D also held offices, though never pres or VP in 2 service clubs (Operation Smile and The Heifer Proj - - each involved raising funds rather than direct service) and sch multi-cultural affinity group. Although interested in art (plans to major in arch/engineering), she never joined the arts magazine (a great suggestion) b/c she’s not tradit “artsy” type and didn’t really “click” with the other art/lit kids. Instead, she took every design courser the sch offered, then arranged for independ study (AP Studio Art) w/ design teacher and assisted in restoration of Victorian house the sch owns.</p>

<p>The only proj D “organzied” was to volunteer as life-guard and supervise family swim at campus pool. She also worked as life-guard during the summers (last summer at prgm for “at risk” chrn).</p>

<p>Average grades, math and art her strogest subjs; strong P/SAT scores (Nat Ach Sch) - - but nothing close to 2400.</p>

<p>If you check the “chances” threads, these are VERY modest credentials, but she breezed into a top LAC (and was courted by MIT, Amherst, Wesleyan and Williams). So I repeat, you don’t have to be as star to get admitted to at top college - -just show a sustained interest in something.</p>

<p>I encouraged D to stick with the couple activities that truly resonated w/ her, but continue to explore - - just in case something caught her fancy. So I didn’t mind when, after 2 yrs, she decided to drop varsity swim in favor of jv hockey w/ friends (she wasn’t going to swim in college since track, a 1 season sport in hs, is a 2 seasons at the college level). </p>

<p>In fact, I was troubled by teachers and coaches who att to pressure D by urging that she stay w/ the team b/c 3 yrs of varsity swim would look better on her college app than 2yrs of swim and 1 yrs of hockey. Similarly, the band/orch director insisted that 2 yrs in orch would really boost her admissions chances anywhere (D plays baritone, tuba and bass). </p>

<p>I am not unmidful of the importance of ECs or service or leadership, but for G*d’s sake, they only get to be kids once! The resume building can wait until college.</p>

<p>Anyway, it worked out just fine for D, who is basically your average bright well-rounded kid.</p>

<p>Good luck.</p>

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<p>thanks so much for the ideas, soozievt. They are feasible and will talk to my D about that. Even better, I will let my D read your post! thanks, again.</p>

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<p>One of the students at my d’s school had a wonderful art activity- they had a “soup night” - she organized the art classes to create soup bowls (for display only), obtained donations of soup/bread from parents and restaurants and charged $10 admission to benefit a local food bank and another charity in our town. Everyone came for dinner and music and took home a beautiful piece of art AND donated to a worthy cause. I think that kind of commitment really shows leadership. Perhaps your daughter could think of something she is equally passionate about.</p>

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<p>OK, I’m going to start with a comment going back to the opening post, that the d is a sophomore in HS and would like to go to a Ivy/top college so leadership position are important. Here’s the irony: true “leadership” is not done in order to get into a college – it is driven by an internal motivation, done for the sake if whatever it is driving the person to act in a leader-like fashion. It may or may not be altruistic – that is, it could be that the person is driven by a desire for power or control, or to be the center of attention – but the point is that person is responding to an inner drive, not trying to rack up points to impress someone else. </p>

<p>The resume-building – “do x in order to fit the requirements of y” is inherently a people-pleasing or ‘follower’ type activity. Of course, we all may do both – and I’m not trying to diminish the value of conforming to expectations of those who have the power to judge or exercise authority – I’m just saying that it comes from a different sort of motivation than “leadership”. </p>

<p>So the best way to encourage leadership is to tell a kid to forget how things will look to colleges, and simply follow her own passions and inclinations. So if Mom112233’s daughter has a passion for art and glasswork… it could be that she ends up following that passion, and maybe because art-creating tends to be a solitary activity, she doesn’t look like a “leader” at all… but then again, maybe her art is unique and trend setting. (Was Picasso a leader? He never was elected to public office… and yet his work radically changed the face of art in the 20th century.)</p>

<p>It may well be that down the line, an “Ivy/top college” will not be the best place for this student in any case. For example, if the true passion is art, then the d. may start looking for colleges with the best art programs – Ivy’s may offer strong programs, but they do not happen to offer the very strongest arts programs – so in the process of finding a best-fit college the student may find that path is somewhat different than initially expected. The focus may shift from acquiring “leadership” and academic credentials toward development of a strong art portfolio.</p>

<p>I’m not saying that things should proceed in that direction – just that a high school sophomore should be encouraged to explore all possibilities and follow her passions, without worrying too much about how it will look to colleges – then, at the end of junior year, the student can develop a college list focusing on which schools offer the best fit for her interests, abilities and goals. That may or may not be the “top college” that she thought she wanted as a sophomore.</p>

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<p>I agree with other posters. One, classic leadership positions do not necessarily distinguish candidates for Ivy schools–the majority of applicants have those credentials. Two, you are focused on the wrong track. </p>

<p>Instead, think about your D’s existing interests and talents. Think about ways in which she could her expand–even soar with those interests and talents. Be on the lookout for happy accidents of opportunity too. My son’s flight to excellence happened when he accidently deleted something and had to re-do it. I suggested he simply re-do the original and he scoffed. Why would he bother re-doing anything? He set off on a new endeavor which quickly morphed into a wildly ambitious project which ignited his passion even further–and ignited the passions of the community–real and cyber.</p>

<p>It turned out that the accidental destruction was the key to great creative heights–which is so often the case.</p>

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<p>Calmom, I couldn’t agree with you more! I can’t ever recall having a conversation with my kids in high school about what activities to do or add to get into college. They just did whatever they wished to pursue (most of which were interest areas begun at a young age) with no regard to college admissions. I think if they never ever even went to college, they would have done the exact same things. A lot of these things are things they still are doing and initiating AT college. They just want to do this stuff. </p>

<p>That is why I tried to preface what I advised the OP by saying that none of these suggestions make sense unless her D is already discussing and thinking of something she wants to do within her areas of passion…art, for example, and just needs some fine tuning of possibilities or something like that. I think my suggestions are not really ones I think the OP’s D SHOULD do, because they are not her own ideas or desires, but more EXAMPLES of things related to her areas of passion that either exemplify leadership, accomplishment, initiative, contribution, exploration of a passion, or connection of a passion with community service, etc. The best ideas are ones that come from her inner drive. I cannot truly imagine coming up with an activity just to look good for college. Unless one’s heart is in it, it is hard to sustain a deep level that makes a true difference. </p>

<p>NYC…I also have a D going into architecture (though is in a BA program as an undergrad). Like your D, she pursued an independent study junior year in her area of interest. This was to explore the field further, for herself. But again, this is the kind of thing of taking initiative to delve into an area of interest. I also agree that a strong well rounded kid can still get into selective colleges, even though the thrust today is to have a singular passion. My D who attends an Ivy League school is truly the well rounded type, with several interests and ECs that were lifelong, a bit similar to your D. </p>

<p>I agree with Calmom that a soph need not be thinking of what looks good for college. I think the student should just do what she really wants to do. Come senior year, she should document those pursuits. However, it is good to take stock of where she is at and discuss anything new or related she might want to do the coming year, because she truly WANTS to. I think the best thing is to be who you are and pursue things to your fullest and the rest will follow.</p>

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<p>My d was a reluctant leader…just shy and not willing to be out front. What changed her was an academic team and math team…gave her confidence. she also got a job at the local YMCA working with kids. Her sr. year she started a h.s. club and led it…so there was quite a transition.</p>

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<p>Actually, starting to document things now would save work later and make sure everything gets remembered. My son didn’t keep notes until he was doing apps, but keeping records can be helpful. Son had a friend who put in incredible hours doing community service/leadership things–just because he wanted to. A lot was through his temple. His Mom kept notes over the years and I think it was helpful when college app time came around.</p>

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<p>nyc, calmom, soozievt and everybody else who has given a good ideas and/or good examples of their kids experiences with “leadership”… I agree with everybody, first D should follow her own interest and passions and w/o concern about Ivy/top colleges. However, I also think that she’s very young and needs some guidance. Someone who gives some ideas about what ares to explore or what path to follow, but at the end should be her own decision (she does not listen to me anyhow so it would be a futil effort to tell her what EC to do)…on the other hand, my D has a lot of peer pressure to be the perfect student (all A+, the president, sports, etc., etc.,) so I think she gets worried about her chances to get into her dream college…</p>

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<p>Summer is coming up and there are lots of camps, many looking for teen volunteers</p>

<p>leadership skills and opportunities and growth don’t jsut come from being the president of something, it comes from working with others, organzing and planning, and DOING</p>

<p>so, if your D wants to get some leadership experience, volunteer this summer, organize beach cleanups, find a cause such as Arts in the Schools, and help out with afterschool programs, or such</p>

<p>lots of organizations are looking for volunteers, and it feels good to focus on others besides yourself
’
and there is nothing wrong with mom saying, this summer you will do some service work, you are a lucky girl and its good to help others</p>

<p>and being out of the school environment can do wonders with that perfection stuff and others expectations</p>

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<p>citygirlsmom, the idea is great, thanks. However, we’ll be on vacation most of her summer in China. My d does not speak the language nor do I. I’ve been thinking if she could do something there besides visiting but so far I have no ideas.</p>

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<p>Well…she could show academic leadership by doing some sort of independent research in China.</p>

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<p>well…it really is big problem when one does not know the local language…so i was thinking to send her to take some Mandarin classes…something more sophisticated like independent research would be great just need to figure out how to overcome the language barrier ; (</p>

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<p>Leadership can be interpreted many ways. Leading a group of one (i.e., yourself :)) counts too. </p>

<p>Art is a great extracurricular and you don’t need – or, really, want – a group to be an accomplished artist. Just keep making art, exploring new media, following your star. When your daughter gets ready to apply to colleges she can put together an arts package (portfolio plus other supporting materials) which will be reviewed by the art department. Believe me, colleges, even the the most selective, need artists just as much as they need quarterbacks and student council presidents.</p>

<p>A summer in China is a WONDERFUL extracurricular (and experience for a young person). She can write about it in her essays and ideally interweave her cultural and travel experience with her artistic interests. She could pick a theme – children, doorways, juxtaposition of old and new architecture, whatever intrigues her – and keep a journal of drawings and photographs plus comments, and later, when she’s back home, expand her observations into larger works.</p>

<p>If it overlaps with your family’s plans, this is an interesting opportunity for highschool students to study in China. They offer scholarships.</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.foundationprograms.com/[/url]”>http://www.foundationprograms.com/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Just remember, colleges are looking for interesting kids who do interesting things. Your daughter sounds like she’s well along on her individual path. I wouldn’t worry so much about traditional leadership positions, but would focus on helping her enhance and intertwine her already unique interests. </p>

<p>I mean, really, a URM glass blower figure skater with indepth China experience – she’ll have them salivating!</p>

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<p>momrath, i really appreciated your perspective and ideas! thanks…i like the one group leadership tip</p>

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<p>Oh! and thanks for the link the program sounds very interesting!</p>

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<p>I don’t know if you involve yourself with church life, but if so, by asking the minister, youths are often granted more opportunities than schools! Some churches understand helping kids “develop character” or “build responsibility” by contributing to the visual appearance of the building. For example, one person can repaint or decorate a room in the church; paint a mural; frame old documents about the history of the institution and hang them in hallways; design or plant a garden.
If she put together a small exhibit of works done by children, or herself, these might be displayed temporarily in the social hall of a church.
I’m trying to be creative here, to combine her art and being in a foreign country, even to do mostly alone and with shaky language skills. I know that all of these could be done by a youth in the USA, but I don’t know church life in China. Perhaps there are community centers for seniors; same idea. Just go and ask to paint a mural… that is leadership, and very individual.<br>
And I certainly agree with everyone above that authentic “leadership” is not just running an office in a school club. Rather, it grows out of her authentic interests.
When the time comes on a college application and they ask about “leadership” then she can describe what she has done. When they say, “club offices and positions held…” that is only a prompt to indicate one possible kind of answer.</p>

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<p>I would say – you can’t, she has to. It’s not something you can do for her. She has to want it.</p>

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<p>I think that you should simply encourage your daughter to relax and enjoy her time in China this summer. The best thing you can do while traveling is be flexible and open to changing plans to take advantage of various opportunities that come your way, and try to get some experiences outside the usual touristy items. If you have friends or acquaintances in China who will host you or show you around, then you should be fine.</p>

<p>A girl who “has a lot of peer pressure to be the perfect student (all A+, the president, sports, etc.)” – does not need more parental pressure to pick or choose activities with an eye toward college admissions – she’s already putting enough pressure on herself, and she really needs reassurance and encouragement, not more ideas. The one thing that is still most important is getting good grades in her schoolwork – even though that seems to be forgotten these days. :wink: But except possibly in the case of recruited athletes, the colleges look at academics first, EC’s & other qualities only after the academic part has been met. </p>

<p>The other thing she needs is help to expand her ideas so that she isn’t obsessed with “chances” and she lets go of the idea of a “dream college” and starts thinking how a college can best meet her personal dreams and goals. Again, she may find that the best college for her is not necessarily the most selective. She sounds like a very accomplished and talented young woman – if she simply focuses on developing her own talents and interests, she will have a wonderful array of choices by the time she reaches senior year. </p>

<p>As a parent with an empty nest – I have one more thing to add: your time vacationing with your daughter this summer in China is precious. Even if she “does” nothing more than sightseeing, this is probably a time that you will have to spend together that you will always remember – so I would not encourage you to look for other activities in China that will take your daughter away from you for an extended time. The time flies by all too quickly – you should not feel that you have to sacrifice family time as part of some college audition process. </p>

<p>I promise you: based on what you have already posted about your daughter, she will have plenty of good opportunities and many good colleges to choose from. Help your daughter see that there is more to college than the Ivy League, and that the very “best” college she can choose is one that will appreciate and respect her unique talents and accomplishments.</p>

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<p>This trip will be a very wonderful, personal, irreplaceable time for both of you, as Calmom observes.</p>

<p>Rather than pull you apart, I wonder: Will she keep a beautiful journal and art-sketches of her touring around China? What a treasure that would be. Or perhaps a scrapbook, with collages from the many new things she might encounter; fabrics, papers, plants. Just let it be her own, without critique from anybody. The hard part will be to let it be hers and not try to suggest what to put into it!! </p>

<p>Does she have her own camera to see it all from her own unique perspective? Let her take the pictures she wants; not just the tourist snapshots.</p>

<p>When our S was that age, we were all visiting his big brother in NYC. The best day of all was when he slipped out alone one morning, while we were all sleeping in, into the neighborhood and snapped photos of what he thought was interesting and different. I could have never imagined what he’d choose to shoot! Stairways, construction, architectural details, people… and it was just a random neighborhood in NYC, not any of the great tourist sites. </p>

<p>China must be beautiful, and surely different from home. The camera can help free her to see it through her own eyes. It could help her to see differently for the rest of her life. What a great thing.</p>