<p>One does not necessarily have to be a math/econ major to be employable after graduation. I was a history major in college…though I also made it a point to pick up computer technology/programming skills in fulfilling my science requirements.* </p>
<p>Moreover, I know of plenty of STEM/pre-professional graduates who have been unemployed for years due to market downturns or poor social skills/snotty attitudes towards those they deem “less worthy than them” Plenty of engineering/CS and Econ graduates among them. </p>
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<li>Just a part of my attempt to broaden my intellectual horizons…the pre-professional skills were an added bonus.</li>
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<p>We actually had the opposite happen. We live in a very affluent area, where almost everyone gets a car when they turn 17, as well as goes on expensive vacations, and parents pay 100% of their kids’ college education. My daughter, a junior at our state university, was shocked to find out how many kids had to take out loans, didn’t own a car etc. It was a pleasure to finally be appreciated!</p>
<p>SimpleLife- I feel for you and your situation. </p>
<p>What occurs to me is how is your son going to adjust to whatever income he can earn as a music major? Is he intending to be a performer, or a music teacher? While those jobs are surely rewarding in their own way, they are not terribly lucrative.</p>
<p>cobrat - I purposely did not go into engineering because I never believed it would give me most options in the long run. As someone who never took a day of CS course, I manage IT team(s) and other unrelated areas. There are plenty of unemployed of people nowadays, and more often than not, it has nothing to do with their social skills or or attitude.
lol
Why did you pick up computer skills if you weren’t worry about about employment? How is that different than what I said about choosing to major in math/econ? Where in my post did I say by being a math/econ was the only way to be employable after graduation?</p>
<p>Because I had a strong love of computers/computer technology nurtured from hanging around the computer geek crowd at my high school. It wasn’t different from my love of taking long walks, building model planes, or more recently…learning how to play electric guitar.</p>
<p>To be honest…I didn’t even think of the employment factors. Granted…a large part of that was influence from immediate and extended family…even the most pre-professionally oriented among them would be aghast if their younger family members said they chose a major/courses specifically for employment purposes. They felt that was taking too much of a blinkered narrow-minded view of the purpose of a college-education.</p>
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<p>Apologies for not being clear. I was referring to a period when the economy was doing quite well some years back.</p>
<p>^^^^Thanks, pamom59.
Yeah, a lot of people have that response when they think of music majors. He’s actually very good at what he does. He is routinely offered more gigs than he can take. His coworkers are usually grad students or professional musicians. He’s often the only undergrad. He has been clear from the start (since his junior year of high school, when he decided to major in music) – if it turns out that he isn’t sought after in his field, he’ll either do something else music-related, or he’ll do something else entirely. He has a wide range of interests and stellar academic credentials. He’s kind of a power house in terms of drive and willpower. So far, he feels good about staying in the game. As time goes on, he’ll learn more about whether he’s still on track to succeed. But for now, he’s remarkably successful for his age (that is, in terms of accolades, and possibly hourly wages? not in terms of monthly wages).</p>
<p>Plus, I don’t think he’s envisioning being filthy rich. Based on the things he says, I think he’d be very happy in the, maybe, $150,000-$200,000 range. Less if he stays single. And so far, I think that range is doable for him. Time will tell.</p>
<p>It’s natural for young people of any background to assume that their family experience is the norm and their rate of consumption is typical. This applies to wealthy kids as well as middle-class kids. Until you pay your own basic living expenses, you will not have a good sense of what things really cost. Also, many affluent families never discuss money issues, believing that it is somehow vulgar to do so. The result is extreme financial ignorance among the offspring of the affluent. </p>
<p>But really, unless they are true trust fund babies, sooner or later these kids will go out into the world and get a rude awakening. So the OP’s son, who at least knows he’s in a bubble, may not be as horribly surprised when it pops as some other kids he associates with.</p>
<p>Unless he’s unusually mature and level headed…which doesn’t seem to be the case judging by what the OP posted and the prospective SO is likewise…having GF/SOs will only exacerbate this issue…and add several others as well. </p>
<p>One reason why I avoided entering romantic relationships in college…other than the expenses was seeing how the ridiculous drama inherent in many relationships during that age take a toll on budgets, grades, self-esteem/respect, and more. In short…they often serve as a huge negative distraction to most from what I’ve seen. </p>
<p>That…and I wasn’t ready to give up my independence to be a hapless puppydog* at the beck and call of an immature/inconsiderate SO who may feel entitled to take it for granted…consideration for priorities such as academics, part-time jobs, ECs, and other responsibilities be damned. </p>
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<li>The worse case was one friend whose GF had a DIVAish attitude, always broke because she’s a spendthrift, capriciously changes schedules at random which throws family/friends/etc off kilter, and expected friend to take her out 5+ days a week to eat at places like the Cheesecake factory when he really couldn’t afford it due to college expenses and looming prospect of paying back college loans as a college senior. Ridiculous…</li>
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<p>SimpleLife- I grant that your son is likely very talented but I think it may be unreasonable to expect him to earn in the 6 figure range–how many musicians ever hit that mark no matter how good they are? I don’t think that orchestra musicians, on average, make that much, and music teachers make significantly less…then again, if you are right about his expected earnings, he won’t really have to survive on ramen noodles and peanut butter.</p>
<p>Both my kids attended the IB magnet hs in district, and there were many students from more affluent families. I did warn the kids not to let it influence their expectations. (Example - “Ah, isn’t that cute… a ‘Happy Sweet 16’ sign on a new car… that won’t be happening in our hour”). Nonetheless they were a bit sheltered from the real world. </p>
<p>Since that time one of them has worked at Walmart. And the other has done college volunteer work (required as part of the deal for academic scholarship) tutoring kids in South Boston. I think that both experiences have opened their eyes. Oh, same can be said of their church mission trips to Indian reservation in SD. </p>
<p>Most teens will yearn for the opportunities of more affluent families. Parents of hs students - look for excuses to show your kid that lots of folks have it worse.</p>
The term I was both happiest and unhappiest in college regarding romantic relations was also the only one I got straight A’s. For me, I can’t imagine where I would have found a significant other if I hadn’t done it then. In grad school all the guys were paired up already or gay, and then I worked in tiny offices where the pickings were slim indeed.</p>
<p>I have to admit I’d love to know what you can do in the music business that nets that kind of earnings!</p>
<p>SimpleLife, I’m sorry to hear about your son. From personal experience at a private university, I suggest your son take a closer look at his budget-free friends: they’re not as rich as they seem. At my school, the worst offenders – i.e. the kids who dropped $200 for a table at a club or the ones decked out head to toe in (knockoff) designer clothing – were actually the kids who took out great debt to come to the school! They always seemed to want to ‘prove’ themselves to the kids from more well-off families, as if they wanted to show that they’re somehow better. They’re already very much in debt, and this type of spending certainly isn’t helping them pay off their loans. </p>
<p>Then again, since they already owe over a quarter of a million dollars, what’s another few thousand?</p>
<p>I’m thinking the expectations regarding finding one’s future spouse in college is nowhere near as strong as it was 3+ decades ago…and is extremely weak in colleges where the culture is driven mostly by students from urban/suburban East/West Coasts/Chicago. </p>
<p>I have heard this expectation is strongest among students from certain parts of the South and Midwest judging by what I’ve heard/known from relatives, friends, and colleagues who live/are from those regions. </p>
<p>On the other hand, there’s slight negative perception among undergrads/recent graduates in my generation and later from the Northeast urban areas regarding those who got married during/just after college or who found their SOs in college. The common refrain among them is “What’s the rush?” and “Why tie yourself down so soon”. </p>
<p>To many…especially some radical feminists I’ve met…it not only signifies “lack of seriousness” for priorities such as academics/career, but also perceived to signify fundamentalist conservative religious values which aren’t held by most in the Northeast…especially in the urban areas. </p>
<p>Coincidentally…the vast majority of high school classmates who found SOs in college and married before the age of 25 and stayed married(Vast majority of those “young marriages” resulted in divorce in 5 years or less) tended to be those from highly conservative religious families (i.e. Conservative Catholic, Evangelical Christian). </p>
<p>Most marriages among friends my age or younger tend to be from SOs they’ve met at work, grad school, leisure activities, friends/family, alumni events, online dating, etc. </p>
<p>This was the case with nearly every older cousin in my family. The only exception ended up divorcing and re-marrying someone else a few years later. </p>
<p>Also, the friend I mentioned in a previous comment who had a nightmarish relationship in his senior year of college ended up meeting a younger…yet much more mature grounded woman not too long after he moved a few thousand miles away to take a new job. Ended up getting married to her and I had the honor of attending their wedding. :)</p>
<p>As a current college student, it is easy to see which students are the type to flaunt their [apparent] wealth and which ones live more frugally. </p>
<p>Back in elementary school, I was considered to be a rich kid (my family is middle class) simply because I would go on very low cost weekend vacations to nearby cities. Of course, this was a school where most of the students were living in poverty. Fast forward to my suburban public high school and there were many upper middle class students who had things I simply couldn’t afford, yet would complain that they needed tons of financial aid for college.</p>
<p>I ended up at a large OOS flagship on a large merit scholarship and financial aid. Some students here come from families that make 3-10 times what my family does. I learned really quickly to not go to lunch or dinner with these friends as I can’t afford $20-25 for a meal once or twice per week. My close friends are generally those who come from families that make roughly the same or less than mine. With them, their is no stigma about using coupons or doing less expensive activities. </p>
<p>I was raised knowing that nicer things can often be had for less than more budget-friendly items provided that one is willing to shop around. By looking around for a good deal, one often discovers that they don’t need things that so many others couldn’t dream living without. For example, I don’t drive a car or have a TV at school. Yet, without these things I am able to live in a very nice dorm, have nice clothes (usually bought on clearance), a good social life, and am graduating debt free. </p>
<p>I will say that it is really funny when I, the lower-income financial aid student, occasionally have nicer stuff than the richer students who like to flaunt their wealth. Many times, I have ran into fellow students at the airport who are travelling on the same flight as me, but are going to a fancy spring break or study abroad destination, while I am flying home. The funny part is that I am the one who is sitting in first class (upgraded due to having elite frequent flier status) and am enjoying a pre-departure beverage while the other students walk past me on their way to coach.</p>
<p>Spending money to flaunt status symbols to others sometimes results in the person ending up with a lot less than what they need for something that is really needed. E.g. the family who has expensive house, cars, vacations, etc. but can afford nowhere near the EFC for their kids’ college costs of attendance.</p>
<p>Then again, that brings up the question of how much the extra pay of jobs like investment banking, management consulting, top law firm lawyer, etc. becomes “real”, if one has to spend a lot of it on status symbols to impress clients while working in those jobs. I mean, if you were a partner at a top law firm and pick up your client in your car, would there be social pressure to buy a car with a crooked L instead of a crooked H, or a prancing horse instead of a galloping horse?</p>
<p>If he marries, the combined household income may realistically approach $150,000 if each spouse has a stable career-type job (in which there are no significant work interruptions). Not many individuals end up making $150-200K or above on their own. An individual person making 150-200K is pretty darn prosperous.</p>
<p>Perhaps that may have to do with politics seeming to be getting nastier, with less willingness for each side to see the other’s point of view or make any compromise.</p>
<p>My kids learned in (public) high school that not everyone has the same disposable income. The parking lot might have been packed with BMWs and Audis, but they learned to appreciate their “boring” blue Camry. Their classmates often went on exotic vacations (Patagonia, safaris, Greek isles, etc.) while we went to “ho hum” Cape Cod. It took a bit of growing up, but eventually they learned to appreciate what we’ve got. Truthfully, I think all kids complain about what they don’t have. You know, “the grass is always greener…”</p>