From what I’ve seen, the special invented gender-neutral pronouns such as zie, zir, etc., have been largely displaced in the last few years among gender neutral/non-binary people by use of the singular “they.” So I don’t think anyone, in academia or elsewhere, needs to worry about being inundated with requests to use invented pronouns. And for those few who do use them, it’s really not so hard to remember.
@DonnaL I wonder if that’s a trend that will be heading my way. As of now, those around here who state that they prefer non-him/her pronouns tend to prefer the zir-type pronouns. However, I also tend to work with younger populations who haven’t had time/place to interact with fellow LGBTQ+ individuals… and thus might be latching on to “zir” because it’s the only non-binary pronoun they’ve ever been exposed to (and “they” type pronouns can often be used in a very derogatory way, which might be the only way they’ve been exposed to them.)
As I said before, I want a gender-neutral system. It’s annoying in conversation to have to guess or try to dance around it for fear of offending someone. In my small academic/professional/friend circle, it’s completely acceptable to say “Your partner… he? she?” because “partner” is the preferred term for a SO regardless of sexual/gender orientation. But I know that this isn’t always the case… and frankly, I don’t care what an individual goes by. A gender neutral system would make everyone’s lives easier. I don’t care what form that takes (zir vs their), I just want it!
For most people their preference is clearly implied by their appearance (e.g a man dressed as a man), and it would still generally be insulting, even in most of academia, to ask for a preferred pronoun. Perhaps it is better for the person who has a non-obvious preference should simply say "Hi, my name is Steve, I prefer the pronoun ‘she’ ".
My non-binary child prefers the pronouns they, their,… After 21 years of using she/her I still stumble on using their preferred pronouns but I’m trying my best. I think they recognize the effort.
As I’ve reflected on this, I think it’s offensive to create new pronouns. People in general want to identify a certain way and polite people attempt to accommodate those decisions - instead of crude “what are you?” If a person says call me she, then you say she. Why take away that identity by saying ze or xe or zir? That person has decided to be treated using the feminine gender. Same with male gender identification. When former Bruce now Kaitlyn Jenner says she wants to be called she I don’t think that means she wants to be called ze because she identifies with the feminine gender.
I haven’t seen the use of they getting any larger share of usage I think because it uncomfortably mixes plural and singular. We’re all multiple people in our heads and I doubt most people see a need to recognize bi or asexuality or whatever as a truly unique thing which requires they. We’re all parents and individuals, parts of families and not, professionals who write music, poetry lovers who enjoy hunting, etc. We’re all “they” and language gives us ways to express that. As to individual family choices, those are of course individual family choices.
There are other reasons to have gender-neutral pronouns. Suppose you are writing something about, say, computer programmers. If you repeatedly say “the programmer”, it sounds wordy and stilted. If you say he, then you are reinforcing gender stereotypes. If you say she, it comes across as trying-too-hard to be PC. Using they as a singular pronoun doesn’t seem quite grammatically correct either, but I think this is the trend in this context as well.
@Lergnom i think you misunderstand the purpose of gender neutral pronouns. No one is saying to call someone who identifies a woman ze. You still use she and he for people that identify as male or female; doing otherwise is rude. You refer to Caitlyn Jenner as she because that is what she identifies as. Gender neutral pronouns are for those who are non-binary gender. There are individuals that don’t identify as she or he.
Misgendering someone is incredibly disrespectful. Asking what someone’s pronouns are is showing them respect. It doesn’t matter if they are cisgender (identify with the sex they were born as), transgender, or non-binary (intersex, bigender, genderfluid, agender, etc).
And this is not something the university came up with. Gender neutral pronouns are a thing, along with non-binary genders. Safe zone (which is actually a national program) is just trying to educate individuals. They are trying to be more inclusive.
"“Oh, nice to meet you, [insert name]. What pronouns should I use?”
My daughter was asked this exact question when she did a visit at Smith."
It’s exactly that over-the-topness that made us not care for Smith. It’s a WOMEN’S COLLEGE. If you’re not identifying as a woman and not willing to be a community of women, then go elsewhere already.
I know nowhere where this pronouns are taken seriously.
You know, I think the onus is on the person to correct others and say “I prefer being addressed this way.”
It’s like correcting someone who mispronounces or misspells your name.
@Lergnom and other posters, as the parent of one kid who is transgender and another who is agender and uses “they” pronouns, it’s beyond frustrating and bordering on offensive to have this treated as a joke or as a massive imposition. “As I’ve reflected on this, I think it’s offensive to create new pronouns.” No one is forcing you or anyone else to start using a new pronoun to describe yourself–rather kids like mine are asking to be addressed by their own preferred pronouns.
At k2’s (coed) boarding school, at the first dorm meeting of the year ALL students are asked to introduce themselves by name and preferred pronouns.
BTW neither of my kids is EVER offended by being addressed by the wrong pronoun but will politely correct the person addressing them. They would only be offended if the person refused to use the pronoun they prefer after being informed.
I vaguely remember my mother being annoyed by Ms., but eventually she came around. PG and Lergnom, take as long as you need. Just about everyone else is way ahead of you though.
And before that, @midwestdad3, the horror of a married woman going by her own name. Eek!
“BTW neither of my kids is EVER offended by being addressed by the wrong pronoun but will politely correct the person addressing them. They would only be offended if the person refused to use the pronoun they prefer after being informed.”
Well, then we are on the same page. I certainly would call someone by how they wish to be addressed, but if the meantime if you introduce yourself as Mike and look like a guy I’m going to use “he” and if you say you are Susie and you look like a girl I’m calling you “she” til told otherwise.
What does trans gender have to do with it? They should be addressed by the gender with which they identify, of course. Caitlyn Jenner is a she, end of subject.
Sometimes I think young people do things to get attention, though. And being such a prince/ princess that you just can’t handle picking between he and she …
I am seeing “they” used here also.
But someone agender or gender fluid doesn’t identify with a binary gender - that’s what it has to do with it.
@Post #33
That people are offended because the world wants to use “she” and “he” is, frankly, too bad. Sensible people try to be sensitive to a person’s choice of gender identity. And since many people want to be called “her” or “him” because that’s the identity they prefer, then I’m not going to say we need to shift the entire pattern of speech because a subset prefers no gender identification in speech at all. That a statement of mine that people are entitled to their own gender identification choice and might it find it offensive to be told “no, we need to eliminate gendered words so, no, you can’t say you’re a her or a him” can spark outrage says to me that your sensitivities are set way too high.
As for repeated use of words like “programmers”, the word “they” is genderless.
I more or less agree with Pizzagirl and Lergnom. I have no problem respecting someone’s gender identity, including adopting non-binary pronouns if that is their expressed preference. But there is something absurd and dishonest about going over to a person named Rachel wearing a skirt and asking what her preferred pronoun is.
I don’t see how it is some grave sin to expect the still tiny minority of people who do not identify with the gender binary to speak up and express their preference, rather than expect the entire world to ignore obvious signifiers of gender on the chance that they may be mistaken. There have been times that I carefully avoided applying gender pronouns to a particular individual because their gender presentation was ambiguous enough that I didn’t want to risk misgendering them. But let’s not act as if refusing to do this as a default is a sign of benighted ignorance.
Frankly, in the vast majority of settings, asking someone what pronoun he or she uses is going to get you looked at like you have three heads. Not at Smith, and maybe not at a lot of universities, if UT-Knoxville is anything to go by. But not recognizing that the radical discourse of a group of young activists won’t serve you well outside of a very few specialized settings suggests its own kind of tone-deafness.
It doesn’t bother me to address anyone the way they prefer, although @GMTplus7 is pushing it :), but I’d rather people made their choices known as it came up. Why use class time to introduce each student and their preferred gender identification label?
Maybe it’s where I live (NY), but I wouldn’t encourage anyone to ask someone they just met what gender pronoun they prefer. It may not turn out well.
Is this not commonly done in the first day of a (smaller) class- roll call where people ask whether or not you have a preferred name? I can’t see how it would be too much of an inconvenience to say: “Romani is fine. She/her.”